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 xbox, playstation, or wii?, which? |
 Nov 19 2006, 04:58 AM
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#26
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MechRigger Delux  Group: Retired Admins Posts: 1,151 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Hanger 18, WPAFB Member No.: 1,657  |
A friend of ours that works at a gamestop jhere in aOhio was robbed at gunpoint, the last 3 PS3s he had that morning were taken. I personally feel it pretty much sums up the amount of assinine energy people put into these things. I mean, someone got on Ebay and bid all the PS3 auctions up to 15K yesterday too... I might get a 360 here in a few months (after the holidaze rush) when the HD comes standard and they have bigger hard drives. But I have more pressing multimedia concerns for my new place right now (cause its new PC time... plus 2 media center PCs, plus the 50 inch screen, and the 37 inch one for the game room... oh, and the payments on this place ;) ) |
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Nov 19 2006, 05:22 AM
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#27
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
There are probably 50+ awesome games I haven't played for the PS2, all of which could be found used for under 20 bucks at this point, and with the amount I play video games, I'm good for another 10 years or so... ;-)
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Nov 19 2006, 05:46 AM
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#28
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Less fucked up than when we were fucking shooting people over a damn pair of sneakers? Expensive item ~J (Edit: corrected self) |
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Nov 19 2006, 06:02 AM
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#29
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Target Group: Members Posts: 50 Joined: 14-March 06 From: Phoenix Member No.: 8,375 |
Nope.. Because the same thing happened in the 80's with the cabbage patch kids.. |
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Nov 20 2006, 04:02 PM
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#30
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
No, not different at all. And not lessened in sheer idiocy because there's precedent. Especially when the assholes (read: Sony and Microsoft) are Creating a False Shortage to incite this kind of jackassery. I'm with Caine and Adam here though (to get away from my vitriol on the subject ;)). I just bought a new notebook PC, and I'm far enough behind on good PC games that I'll never need a console. On a somewhat related/random note, a friend and I were discussing the old "PC vs Console" debates of times past (not that they don't still occur, but I'm getting to that). We basically boiled it down to the following observations: - PC gamers also tend to want to be able to do other things with their machine/investment, whereas console buyers are happy with (and indeed just want something) that it plays video games really well. - In cases where money is no object, someone is likely to have both (best of both worlds scenario, if you will) - Given setups specifically geared toward gaming, both a PC and a console perform well, as opposed to Olden Times™ when PC games surpassed the depth, breadth, and graphics of console games - The market is different for PC gamers and console gamers; the PC market is generally games that are a significant time investment (CPRGs, etc) and that go longer between releases, whereas the console market is "flavor of the week"-ish, with games coming out that you're expected to get bored with after a few weeks of intense play and then move on to the next release (that's not to say that games of the other type don't come out for the opposite system, see Oblivion for X-box and "quickie shooters" for PC) That's what we came up with (in like, 2 minutes of um...deep and well thought out discussion...yeah). I'm sure other people have different takes on it. |
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Nov 20 2006, 05:21 PM
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#31
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
The Wii is amazingly fun. Wii sports are pretty simplistic, but they're designed to be accessible, not 100% realistic. There will be more realistic sports game coming for those who want to worry about the difference between an 8-iron and a 9-iron.
Zelda: Twilight Princess is really fun. I've heard it being critisized as 'dated', but accusing it of being too much like Ocarina of Time, arguably one of the best console games ever made, isn't all that bad. I'll admit Red Steel isn't quite what I'd hoped it would be, but it is still a lot of fun. Definitely worth renting for the experience of playing it, even if you don't buy it. The Wii has worse graphics than the other next-gen consoles, and a heck of a lot less processing power, but it is, IMHO, the most fun console I've ever laid my hands on. |
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Nov 20 2006, 08:49 PM
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#32
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
I can't speak to what Microsoft did or didn't do. For Sony, though, bull-fucking-shit there's a false shortage. Seriously, they had less than half a million consoles available worldwide. That is disastrous. I find it inconceivable that anyone could believe that something that stupefyingly bad in terms of supplies could have been deliberate. I'm not saying that deliberate shortages are never caused (though I find it questionable), but saying this about the PS3 launch is about on the level as saying that, I don't know, John Kerry rigged the 2004 elections to remove votes for him. You're going to have to provide some serious evidence if you want me to take that seriously. ~J |
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Nov 20 2006, 09:37 PM
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#33
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
If you honestly thought that what Sony did doesn't count as deliberate, maybe you're just not paying attention. Do you really think that nobody at Sony knew, prior to the release date, that having less than a half a million consoles ready to ship at release was a bad idea? Or do you think that nobody bothered to check to see how many there were and how much demand there would be?
These are the guys that made the PS1, the PS2....they're not exactly new to this. Don't agree if you don't want to, but I don't think I'm the one that has to prove anything here. |
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Nov 20 2006, 09:43 PM
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#34
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
I'll ask the naive question, Eidolon. What's the purpose in this? Why create the false shortage? Doesn't that cause them to make less money, by selling less units? If PS3s are selling for $9,000 (I almost put 9000 nuyen) on ebay, Sony isn't seeing anything past their initial sale anyway. So why?
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Nov 20 2006, 09:46 PM
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#35
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 681 Joined: 28-February 06 From: UK Member No.: 8,319 |
Despite being a Playstation fan and owning a PS2, I weakened and treated myself to a X360 last month (reward for having completed my thesis at last).
First X360 unit was faulty and had to be returned in about a week. Not had that problem with a console before, but the replacement has been fine. I got it mainly for Oblivion, which I couldn't have run on my PC or laptop without massive investment (that and in some ways I prefer gaming on consoles- it's just a more social activity that way). The wireless controllers are great. But you'll get them for PS3 as far as I know. Have played Oblivion for hours and hours. Great game- though would presumably be just as good or better on a top-level PC or PS3. Borrowed various original xbox games off friends, and managed- for most of them- to do the downloading nonsense necessary to make them playable on the X360. No way to get Chronicles of Riddick working though, which is a shame, as I'd heard good things. Other X360 games acquired so far: Test Drive Unlimited- which is huge and looks great but hasn't entirely held my attention; Dead Rising- which is fun and wonderfully cinematic, and it's great to see hundreds of zombies on screen at the same time, but it's seriously hampered by almost illegible text (we don't all have HD TV's, Capcom), and an annoyingly sparse savepoint system. Nevertheless, all these games are good showcases of next-gen console gaming. Just acquired Gears of War. Yes it's another FPS, albeit with tactics, but it certainly is very very good, beautiful to behold, and almost painfully intense. So thats the X360. I don't regret buying it, and I think there are some good games out there for it. What worries me about the PS3 is that I haven't seen any particularly appealing games for it yet. But knowing Sony that'll change. Still, not sure I'll bother getting a PS3 unless I've got an HD TV (which won't be for quite a while) and can take full advantage of the blu-ray. May well pick up a Wii at some point, just because it looks like a fun thing. Will depend on the games though. It's all about the games. |
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Nov 20 2006, 09:59 PM
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#36
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Worse than missing the holiday season, thus not only giving the 360 a second holiday season without Sony's new entry but giving Nintendo one? Maybe someone else can reality-check this, but from where I stand you've got a huge burden of proof here. "Think horses, not zebras" and all that. ~J |
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Nov 20 2006, 10:01 PM
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#37
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
They do if they hold back a fair number of units and then put them up on e-bay themselves. ;) |
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Nov 20 2006, 10:10 PM
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#38
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
That has to be illegal. Doesn't it? And even if it isn't, could they really get away with that without anyone finding out? |
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Nov 21 2006, 12:32 AM
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#39
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MechRigger Delux Group: Retired Admins Posts: 1,151 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Hanger 18, WPAFB Member No.: 1,657 |
I don't know about legality, but I do know that at least 100 units were "disappeared" before delivery. Which was probably less than Sony was expecting to write off, and I'll be there are warehouse/shipping folks who will make a pretty profit before Christmas. Not that this kinda thing happens all the time.... |
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Nov 21 2006, 02:02 AM
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#40
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Serious question: why would (or should) it be? That said, even Sony must be bright enough to recognize the PR nightmare it would be (despite the fact that it's pretty much the only sensible way to handle a launch this small… c'est la vie). ~J |
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Nov 21 2006, 03:25 AM
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#41
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
Hype. Create a false shortage to ensure initial sales are 100%, then leak them onto the market until it's not the "it" thing as much anymore, keeping the sales up, and then ship normal numbers. Yes, later demand will be slightly lessened, since all of the early adopters and "have to have it nows" have already stood in their riots to get one, but look at stores that still couldn't keep PS2s in stock a year or so after their release. And as far as not seeing the profits off of resold units, they know it's going to happen. And all it does is further the hype. Hype is sales, especially in these kinds of markets. Kage, look at reality man. Do you think that Sony couldn't have upped production? Couldn't have just contracted a couple more manufacturers to build components? I'm sure at a certain point it stops being a good enough ROI, but fuck man, look at every other electronic component on Earth. They ship more initial units of a home theater system than they did the PS3. Yeah, okay, maybe the market is larger for speakers and a DVD player. But 500k units for "the" next console mother of all consoles we're gonna roxxor your soxxors? And "miss the holiday season"? Last I checked, it's not even Thanksgiving until this Thursday. Want to sell every unit in about 5 minutes? Launch on the day after turkey-fest. But hey, think what you want. I'm not saying I know 100% beyond any doubt period end of story that I'm totally the rightzorz. I'm just saying it makes far more sense than thinking that Sony a: didn't know what the demand would be b: couldn't up production. Hype hype hype. |
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Nov 21 2006, 03:37 AM
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#42
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Yes. Seriously. They would have sold out trivially at one million units. At eight hundred thousand units, it would have been vaguely believable that it would have been deliberate. At six hundred thousand I wouldn't believe it, but I wouldn't argue against it, either. At, from all reports, well under 500,000? There's no way the hype is making up for that, and word on the street says that the next shipment is at least ten days out, meaning that launching on Black Friday gets them nothing. With a launch so tiny, I find it preposterous to think that even Sony would do it deliberately. ~J |
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Nov 21 2006, 03:11 PM
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#43
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
Okay. Agree to disagree.
Whale's vagina. ;) [ Spoiler ]
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Nov 21 2006, 03:32 PM
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#44
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
Could be. I don't know enough to form a strong opinion, so I'll just stockpile rumors in my head. :-)
Personally, I think Sony is going to lose this round of console wars, and their next console won't be called the PS4. I doubt I'll ever buy a PS3, because for the money I could get 12+ Wii games. I can't say enough good things about the Wii. It's just more fun. (more fun than any other console I've played, although I admit I haven't played a PS3, and have barely touched an XBOX 360, so take that for what it's worth) Oh, and I picked up Trauma Center: Second Opinion yesterday. I never played the DS version, but this game is also extremely fun. |
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Nov 21 2006, 03:34 PM
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#45
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
No! ;) Moon-Hawk: define "lose"? ~J |
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Nov 21 2006, 03:49 PM
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#46
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
@Moon-Hawk,
It'd be interesting. I wonder what they'd call it? NPS4? ;) What games have you played on the Wii so far? edit: Oops, a few posts up. I can read... |
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Nov 21 2006, 04:18 PM
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#47
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
By "lose", I mean in the same sense that Nintendo "lost" the last round with the Gamecube. It was, by far, the least successful, and was really only saved by their exclusive titles like Zelda and Metroid. It didn't fail, of course, it lasted the whole generation and continues to be somewhat successful, but the XBox and PS2 definitely beat the pants off of it, and I think Nintendo took a bit of a reputation hit from it as well. I think the same thing will happen with the PS3. I think it will be the least popular of the three, and that Sony's reputation will take a bit of a hit, but I think it will continue to release games and be played throughout this generation. But if it does poorly, they might want to change the "Playstation" name to distance themselves from the "shame", if there is any. I don't know, it's way too early to say anything for sure, just idle speculation. @eidolon (so people don't have to search up the tread): Wii sports, Zelda, Red Steel, and Trauma Center, all with short reviews earlier in the thread. I'm happy to answer any specific questions about the console or the games. I haven't actually used it to play any Gamecube games yet, I just haven't gotten around to it, and I don't have a wireless router at my apartment, and I haven't bought the USB network adapter thingy for it, so I haven't used any of the online features either. |
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Nov 21 2006, 04:22 PM
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#48
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Well, it would be worse than that—it would be how Nintendo "lost" with the N64 (overwhelming market dominance to merely existence within the market). That said, I was trying to clear up whether you meant that kind of loss, the Dreamcast kind of loss, the XBox kind of loss (possibly-pyhrric victory), or the "came in something other than first" kind of loss, as they're all losses of a kind but very different.
Edit: I should add that the Gamecube outsold the XBox by a small margin on the worldwide front, and actually made (as opposed to losing) money. It's far from "definite" that the XBox beat the pants off of it. ~J |
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Nov 21 2006, 04:27 PM
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#49
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
I meant something in the Gamecube to N64 level of loss. I guess you're right, N64 is probably a better analogy than Gamecube in some ways. I don't expect Dreamcast levels of loss. Sony can weather one bad console, as long as they don't have two in a row. Nintendo was only able to get away with two weak consoles in a row because they're Nintendo, and I think the Wii is really going to either return them to the head of the pack or boot them out of the console market, 'cause not even Nintendo can handle three weak consoles in a row.
But, from the looks of things so far, Nintendo is going to come out of this round in pretty good shape. edit: regarding your edit: Good points about the Gamecube. I just always got the impression that the XBox did better. I have both, and I've really enjoyed both. |
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Nov 21 2006, 07:39 PM
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#50
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Karma Police Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,358 Joined: 22-July 04 From: Gothenburg, SE Member No.: 6,505 |
Sony had troubles with manufacturing, that's a fact. I don't believe they deliberatly delayed release in Europe until March next year. Eidolon is right in a way, though. Because even if they didn't have problems with getting enough components for the blueray player, they would still have had a minor shortage that would have been deliberate. There was a delay with Sony's stand alone blueray player too, so it's not just the PS3. And the lack of a Sony blueray on the market was not a good thing for Sony, as it's their format and there were already HDDVD players out, so that delay was absolutly not deliberate.
Nintendo makes money off of every console they sell, and they rule the handheld market. They're not even bothered by this console war. |
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