 Elephant Gun with different ammo..., See the title... =] |
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 Dec 21 2006, 05:21 PM
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#26
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 600 Joined: 31-August 05 Member No.: 7,659  |
It's more common than you think. A lot of time shotgun slugs can take a glancing blow of the skull/antlers without killing the deer and it'll wake up and leave while looking at it. Sometimes while taking pictures. I'm fairly close to the hunting industry so I know a few people who had to wrestle a wounded deer down.
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Dec 21 2006, 06:27 PM
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#27
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,333 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Austin Member No.: 9,168 |
My dad apparently used to bowhunt (It's crazy the bizarre things you randomly find out about your parents - my dad was a motocross racer, a semi-pro dirt bike racer, and a bowhunter. And you'd never guess it now), and apparently it's far far more likely you'll get attacked using a bow. You have to be closer, there's not a startlingly loud noise, and you're far more likely to get a wounding, not killing blow.
From what I understand, the main goal of bowhunting is to create a bleeding wound, then wait for the deer to bleed out, rather than actually kill it. So sometimes, they're pissed. |
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Dec 21 2006, 06:34 PM
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#28
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Nearly always when you violently kill someone, you kill through bleeding. This is usually the main goal of, say, shooting someone with a firearm or hitting them with a sword. |
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Dec 21 2006, 09:18 PM
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#29
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
Yeah. The only way to reliably cause an instant incapacitation is to hit the central nervous system. Unfortunately, it's a relatively small target.
And to expound on Lord Ben's comment a little, this hunting season, a friend of mine shot a whitetail buck in the back of the head with a .300 WSM at roughly 100 yards. As he came up to the buck, he noticed that its skull had been split between the antlers and he could see nervous tissue. But when he poked the deer to make sure it was dead, it sprang up and ran another 30 yards or so before he could shoot it again. I would have flipped. |
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Dec 21 2006, 09:37 PM
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#30
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Yeah, I know, but it just doesn't make sense to me. There is no recoil until the bullet(s) (shells, rounds, whatever) have left the barrel of the gun. With both chambers firing simultaneously, any recoil generated would not affect the shots already fired. |
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Dec 21 2006, 09:46 PM
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#31
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 289 Joined: 20-February 04 From: in the matrix Member No.: 6,091 |
I can not speak for game terms, but in RL when you fire both barrels at the same time, there is a slight difference in firing the two barrels. One goes then the there a half second (I did not time this, but only a guestimation) later. There is where the -1 comes from I believe. With a shotgun, this works out better since the spread going left out of the right barrel and the spread going right out of the left barrel will not then collide right in front of the gun. Just my 2 cents worth.. dog |
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Dec 21 2006, 10:19 PM
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#32
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
The difference in timing is negligible, nowhere near a half a second, maybe a few hundredths tops. That will be enough for recoil from the first shot to disrupt the aim of the second, but not by much, especially in the type of situation where you'd risk opening up with both barrels (read: very close range).
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Dec 22 2006, 05:36 AM
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#33
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 732 Joined: 1-December 06 Member No.: 10,116 |
It's also not a good idea to have a deer run before it dies. THe meat tastes as one of my friends once put it 'like sweaty socks' afterwards. This is due to the eh.. bleh, mind fails me atm. It's a chemical buildup basically in the muscle tissue when you run etc. A little bit of running probably wont have too grand an effect but if it's been running for a while, thats a whole other story. If you manage to kill it in a single hit so it just keels over, you dont get this buildup. I doubt, however, doing this is actually all that easy, not sure. I've never actualy had the chance to hunt anything like that alas. |
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Dec 22 2006, 05:53 AM
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#34
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 600 Joined: 31-August 05 Member No.: 7,659 |
An arrow through the lungs will cause the deer to run maybe 30 yards before dying. The blood comes out like from a garden hose mister. A rifle through one or both front shoulder blades will drop it in it's tracks and also damage several major organs so it'll usually bleed out by the time you walk over there. I've shot 9 deer and most dropped where they were standing. For rifles the force of the impact kills just as well as bleeding.
I haven't noticed much difference in taste around deer depending on if they run or not. But I think it makes a difference how much they run. Also, the most common way they die slowly is from a gutshot. The fluids in the gut poisons the bloodsteam and they die in like 24 hours. The meat tastes absolutely shitty then I've heard. So maybe that's where that comes from... |
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Dec 22 2006, 06:30 AM
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#35
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 732 Joined: 1-December 06 Member No.: 10,116 |
Nah it's dependant on how long their running. If they run a short bit, there isn tmuch difference becuase there is very little buildup.
Longer periods of running are what does it. I'm not quite sure where exactly the noticable threshold is however. I"m sure if you goggled the subject some actual scientific/hunter lore would come up. |
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Dec 22 2006, 08:47 AM
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#36
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
I suppose it is theoretically possible that the impact would kill it without directly damaging the CNS, but it is very unlikely. Apparently what much more often happens is that the pressure waves caused by the projectile in tissue hammer at the spine and temporarily paralyze the animal or knock it unconscious, and usually with a well placed shot it will have bled to death by the time it comes to. There are plenty of stories of animals that have been "killed instantly" by a shot through the shoulders only to leap up and run off a while later. |
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Dec 22 2006, 09:01 AM
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#37
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 732 Joined: 1-December 06 Member No.: 10,116 |
This has incidently happend with human beings as well.
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Dec 22 2006, 09:22 AM
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#38
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Certainly. The shape of most quadruped mammals' ribcages and the way in which they are shot (sideways through the shoulders with relatively high-powered rifles) just makes it much more common with them.
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Dec 22 2006, 03:21 PM
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#39
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,333 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Austin Member No.: 9,168 |
Lactic acid is the chemical you're thinking of, I'll wager. That's what builds up in human muscle tissue and causes cramps, etc.
And I can see how that would affect the taste of the meat. |
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Dec 22 2006, 03:47 PM
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#40
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 188 Joined: 16-June 03 From: Da Burgh, PA Member No.: 4,751 |
I believe they mean that shot takes a -1 recoil penalty similar to a short burst. The idea beingto get you to purchase a shock pad for your 'Spirit Killer'. Though personally I like to put it on a gyromount for effect. Just imagine pre-teen orks, two over-arm swinging gyromounts, eyes crazed with amphetimines, and you have 2070's child soldiers. The stories I heard from Sierra Leone years ago still scare me. |
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