How do free spirits in your games gain karma?, Weird things they do. Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[emo samurai]

I was thinking of having a free spirit set up shop in the Barrens. He'll have a room with only one entrance that has his formula in the center, and outside the entrance to the room is a guard with the spirit's formula strapped to his stomach under his body armor and two locker rooms, one for men and one for women. The changing rooms will have stalls and showers and everything. They'll be forced to enter the room naked so that they can not take any binding materials with them. They'll also be forced to leave the room naked so that they can't take the formula with them.

People will only be allowed to enter and leave on the hour so that the spirit only has to check if people gave out karma instead of sitting there staring at the formula once every hour.

The spirit will give out 1000 :nuyen: per karma point gained. If it has enchanting skill or the Wealth power, this will be nothing.

The temple will open for 8 hours a day.

What do spirits in your games do to get karma?

[Konsaki]

Hmm... giving away a part of one's life force (Karma) for cash would probably be a good buisness for a free spirit. You came up with a good idea there.
Now the way the spirit does the exchange is something entirely up to the GM, but thats just RP anyways.

[Wakshaani]

Sans teh security steps, that's basicly what I have as well ... a couple of Wealth-generating spirits trade gold for Karma. It's teh *easy* way to make a quick buck.

[Glyph]

Spirits don't have any limits to how powerful they can become, so the only thing keeping them from becoming game-breakingly powerful is their limitations on gaining Karma. This should involve some risk to the spirit, and it should generally require a great deal of circumspection. A spirit setting up shop this way would probably get taken out, one way or another, by one of the power players.

[emo samurai]

Probably... but I don't know of any power players besides the megacorporations that would have the foresight to eliminate a powerful spirit like this. Maybe the Triads would, since they actually believe in magic.

[tisoz]

Uhm... Great Dragons?

[Bryce963]

One of my characters I have planned if I ever get to play again, is an escaped Aztlaner blood mage in training, who has a spirit pact with a free plant spirit that has, in his mind fused with his mentor spirit, but the character doesn't know that while he is alseep the spirit takes over his body and does god knows what to gain karma... there has been a rise of horrific murders amongst the homeless near the Tacoma Pullalyup border recently......

[emo samurai]

[Kyoto Kid]

...I would answer this, but it would be a spoiler for the next run I am doing.

[Wakshaani]

[Glyph]

I think any of the powers that be would do this, simply to stop the upstart spirit from becoming super-powerful - they want their little club to be exclusive, after all.

On the other hand, whether someone can take the formula out of the room or not, they will still know the spirit's true name after the encounter, and they don't need one of those new mental adept powers to do it, either. So the stripping precautions won't really protect the spirit from people wanting to bind it.


I think my real problem with this, though, is from a game atmosphere point of view. Free spirits gaining karma is described as something that they need, but which leaves them vulnerable. A free spirit should be hungry to become more powerful, but always concerned about protecting itself and keeping a low profile. This elaborate setup screams metagaming to me - it's less about compellingly depicting a free spirit's dealings with metahumanity, and more about using a cheesy rules exploit to give a free spirit unlimited amounts of Karma.

[emo samurai]

They'll know the spirit's true name after the encounter? Where does it say that? I thought the only way to really know its formula is to go on a metaplanar quest.

[Mistwalker]

They could know the free spirit's formula.

They could recreate it, or help someone else recreate it, just be describing it in more detail to them. After getting dozens of people to describe the formula, someone would be able to recreate it.

If the ritual is used for karma transfer, it takes at least one hour, with the free spirit's formula present. So, anyone wanting to control that free spirit, could do a shadowrun at the time of the ritual, and take control of the formula, hence the free spirit.

Any ambitious being would love to get a crack at something like this.

Once the formula has been taken, the free spirit only has 3 choices, as I see it.
1) suicide
2) follow orders of it's new master(s)
3) make a spirit pact with someone else, to nullify the formula.

[emo samurai]

Well, what do they do in your games to gain karma?

[Mistwalker]

They carefully choose who they will get karma from.
They want someone who will not try to screw them over.

And/or, they get a spirit pack with someone, so that only the formula in their spirit pack partner is valid, and do their thing as above, with the added safety that even if the formula is copied, it won't help.

Free spirits who want karma, usually make sure that the donors are happy with the deal.

Of course, there are a few that make sure that the donors are dead shortly after wards, but that leads to a decrease in donor, and possibly a vendetta against that free spirit.

So far, a free spirit has taken karma off of two PCs. The deal was/is done in secret so that the rest of the group does not know about it, as the free spirit does not trust a few in the party (one, with very good reason).

[rangda]

In our game (based on Boston) there is a free spirit NPC runner in the Rox that runs a homeless shelter. He's a Christian spirit and preaches to the homeless in the Rox and offers food / shelter. Some of the unwashed masses offer karma in return.

Our team had a run in with him after messing up a couple of runs his team was doing (note, having a high force free spirit pissed off at you is BAD). We ended up doing an astral quest to get his formula, and then starting a ritual to kill him. But at the ritual I ended up turning him into a contact instead of killing him (and picking up a spirit pact in the process). Which has worked out well for both sides so far...

[Serbitar]

[Kyrn]

Erm...in describing a spirit racking up Karma like a motel after prom, said spirit seems to be attempting to gather power. The desire for power, it should be noted, is pretty much the only thing most GDs are described as having in common. And as there is a finite amount of power (whether measured in gold, karma, market share or booty score), this one spirit in the barrens is going to be attracting the attention of quite a few people it really shouldn't want noticing it. Like Lofwyr. With his world's largest mega-corporation. (and it's German!)

[emo samurai]

Dude, I figured out a way for spirits that gain karma in this way to avoid getting bound by a captured formula. Get bound by a magician it trusts! After it already owes services, it can't be bound by any other magician, right? As long as the magician's a good guy and won't tell you to wipe his ass, all they can do to you is possibly summon you and get you to kill them. It's win, win, win.

[Ravor]

Umm, Emo, I really don't see such a power-hungery Spirit as willing to 'trust' any Mage who is also power-hungery enough to actually be willing to deal with such a power-hungery spirit in the first place...

Well that plus I don't believe in having 'Good Guys' in the Sixth World, you have bad guys with power and bad guys who want power. *winks*

[Eryk the Red]

Ravor, does your Shadowrun game take place in Sin City? ;)

[Moto42 Again]

The spirit wouldn't need to be bound by an uber-mage. It could convince some magical newbie (from who's binds the spirit could break free on a whim) to bind it for two or three services.
bada-bing! The spirit is "bound" and someone who can barely pronounce 'orichalcium' gets maybe 8 hours of training per week from a bona-fide free-spirit.

[GM on the Thresh...]

A few things...

First thing I see with the Free Spirit setting up 'shop' is that eventually word would get around to a megacorp that its there and its taken root in a static location (making it easy prey for them to run in a grab it).

Second, a metaplanar quest could be undertaken to identify the spirit and then to gain its formula.

Third, having the free spirit allow itself to be bound to a magician doesn't ensure the safety of its formula.

That said, I'd go with what was suggested of having the spirit work out a Pact with individuals. If those individuals are PCs though, make them pay for the Spirit Pact Positive Quality out of Street Magic. Sure, they have to feed it Karma to make it grow. But Free Spirits can become uber-powerful relatively easy.

[Ravor]

*grins* What can I say, when I think Cyberpunk, I think of dirty tired cities overfilled with dirty tired souls whoes only hope for a glimer of happiness is in the BTL chip they just sold their child's body as a joytoy to afford.

And that is the 'good' life of a Wage-Slave that most of the Sinless would kill for...

[Thane36425]

A spirit wouldn't need to set up a permanant shop to gain karma. It could just wander about looking for people that are hard up or in trouble. It could offer its services in exchange for Karma. It could pay out some nuyen or mess someone up, or even cast healing spells.

Or, a spirit could increase its edge or initiate and take the Karma Drain power and then not have to worry about rituals and such anymore.