Spirits and edge., When do they use it? Options

[emo samurai]

Summoned and bound spirits all have an Edge attribute equal to their force. What do they use it for besides resisting binding when they're pissed off at you? And can you tell them to use it on your behalf?

[cetiah]

I don't think you could instruct them to use it, but I imagine they would use it to oppose combat actions made against them. You can look to the way your GM uses Edge for his security grunts as inspiration.

[Demerzel]

As a GM I decide when a spirit, even one controlled by a player, uses edge. I haven't ever used their edge to resist binding or summoning, but I've used the threat to prevent spirit abuses. We briefly had a character with spirit bane, and I was considering using edge when he was with the mage while summoning the appropriate spirit type, but it never came up and the player quit.

Generally when the situation for a spirit turns bad. If an ancoming attack or spell has a decent chance of disrupting it, then edge will be used. If a player were to ask the spirit to do something that causes pretty hefty drain I would consider using edge for the spirit as a self preservation method, but that may never really have an effect on the game...

[TheOOB]

I only have spirits use edge when it would a) prevent them from being disrupted, b) oppose a summoner who mistreats them, or c) help a summoner who they really like.

If you get along really well with your spirits they will be more likely to use edge to help you rather then just saving their own butts. Likewise mistreated spirits will resist your attempts to summon and bind them tooth and nail.

[Glyph]

I would do it like theOOB, although I would also consider it for spirits attacking someone with a Spirit Bane negative quality, or helping someone with the Spirit Affinity positive quality.

Edge is a metagaming concept, so I would NOT allow mages to command their spirits to use Edge.

[emo samurai]

Maybe a good idea is to make it so that spirits can opt to spend edge on actions it wants to spend edge on, like protecting itself from disruption or attacking somebody with spirit bane. To force a spirit to spend edge, maybe make the magician spend edge too if it's an action it wouldn't normally spend edge on. Also, make spirits spend edge more on actions it knows are important to the mage if the mage has spirit affinity.

I think that's good.

[Sren]

In my games, I let spirits use their summoner's edge if the summoner's player chooses. IF the characters become seriously abusive to spirits, I may use have spirits resist binding or even summoning with their own edge.

I like edge as a game mechanic, but in the high-magic game I'm running, both edge and spirits seem to be an exceptionally powerful tool for the characters to use, so I don't want it to be possible for them to get extra luck via spirits (They are capable of summoning spirits over force 6, so spirits can often to everything better than the PCs if they have the required skill).

As an example of how powerful edge is in my games, I only let edge refresh between runs, and the players only choose to run from overwhelming opponents when they are low on edge, and most of the character have maxed out edge (They only ran once, after killing two of three force 12 (loving essense drain) guardian blood spirits).

[Glyph]

I should have checked the book first - page 95 of Street Magic addresses spirits and Edge (and is pretty close to what most posters think is reasonable). Basically, even though they are compelled to obey, spirits are still autonomous beings, so a summoner can't make them spend Edge any more than a mage casting Control Thoughts could make the controlled person spend Edge.

By the way, Sren, if you think spirit Edge is a bit too powerful, you could always use one of the tweaks on page 31 of Street Magic to tone them down.

[Brahm]

Our house understanding is that spirits, as partially independant NPCs, use Edge:
1) on their own volition, typically in cases of self preservation such resisting spells or getting wacked over the head by a steely fisted Adept
2) on their own volition in the case of Summoning and/or Binding, depending on the conjurers history of attitudes and actions towards the spirit specifically, their type of spirit, and spirits in general
3) at the demand of the commander, costing an extra service

Mind you we refresh Edge every session, so this might still be too much Edge available if you use a longer Edge refresh rate for your PCs.

[Eryk the Red]

Personally, I basically just don't have spirits use edge. I treat them like grunts. (I also don't have grunts use edge, not even group edge.) Mostly, it's just that it's another thing to keep track of, and the mage in my campaign uses a lot of spirits. They're quite powerful enough, really, without edge. Adding edge to the mix might put them over the edge, and it gives me more crap to worry about. Combats get pretty hectic for me to track as it is.