Okay, how Crazy is Berlin? 2070 Options

[Cynic project]

Really what is it like in 2070?

[FlakJacket]

I can't run down the links at the moment but hasn't a large majority of it been pacified and turned into Corp-ville? Best bet is to wait for one of the Germans to show up since a lot of that stuff is a FanPro GmbH gig.

[Serial_Peacemake...]

Funnily if my runners ever end up in Germany, I think I'll have Berlin gone completely schizoid again. However I always play it that really, very few people actually have any real control over anything that isn't specifically their territory, and not even that for governments.

[Grinder]

West-Berlin has become a corp-controlled, calm, city. East-Berlin is walled up and has become a hotspot for anarchos and the like.
Personally, I don't like the anarchist undertone in most of the german sourcebooks and East-Berlin description is no difference.

[raben-aas]

OK, this is a really old post, but before I open up a new one let it be said that there's a growing (wholly unofficial) setting of Berlin in 2071+ on http://rabenwelten.wordpress.com

Yes, it's in English, but the person responsible for the blog (that would be me) speaks English, so if you have a question fire away.

The presented setting may not be official, but it is not contradicting existing material on Germany and Berlin. So it's not sn "Alternate" setting, just a more fleshed-out version in which a lot of the craziness of the first official Berlin setting was dumped.

The city itself is split into corporate-controlled sectors and an anarchistic containment zone, with some zones that are "in transition" in between.

There is a map of all major roads in and around Berlin here and a map of the zones/districts with short descriptions here

Seeya!

[Grinder]

Wie im offiziellen SR-Forum angedeutet, wird Pegasus auch hier eingreifen und einige der missglückteren Artworks bei der Produktion der deutschen Übersetzung austauschen – selbst der Austausch bestimmter Cover ist im Gespräch.

That's fucking interesting. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[raben-aas]

Let's just wait and see.

The mentioning of the possibility for new artwork or even new covers was vague at best (as it happened in the open forums – that tidbit is by no means "inside knowledge" on my part – with the possible exception of the Arsenal, for which there will be "some extras").

[raben-aas]

See here: http://www.foren.pegasus.de/foren/index.ph...ost&p=22122
Seems that there are new covers planned for the German edition of Arsenal, Augmentation und Emergence.

[Grinder]

Sweeeeeet. Would be a reason to buy the books. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[raben-aas]

Meanwhile, the new German cover has been revealed:
http://www.pegasus.de/uploads/pics/46000G_03.jpg

[Grinder]

Shit. Now I have a reason to buy the german book too. Will the books also have different interior art as well?

[raben-aas]

Yup, there will be new art and new equipment as well:

http://www.pegasus.de/137+M5648b5d56aa.html


Nahkampfwaffen:

* Athame
* Injektionsdolch
* Stockdegen


Projektil- und Wurfwaffen:

* Nutzlastspitze


Feuerwaffen:

* AS-113o "Assassin"
* Enfield Merlin
* Zastava CZ49
* AK-127
* Altmayr SP
* Ruhrmetall R506 Balmung


Kleidung und Panzerung:

* Anielski-Joop: reconquista-Kollektion
* dressCODE: CYBERPIRATE-Kollektion
* Rheingold: Aurora-Kollektion
* SK Myrmidon Kampfpanzerung


Umwelt- und Überlebensausrüstung:

* Proteus Monoschlitten


Dies und Das:

* (Inlineskates)/Powerboard


Fahrzeuge und Drohnen:

* BMW 2065 Mjöllnir (Rennmaschine)
* BMW Trollhammer (Chopper)
* BMW RV430 (Limousine)
* Eurocar President (Limousine)
* Mercedes IG310 Igel (ATV)
* Peugeot 11e ElectroCar (Kleinwagen)
* Volkswagen Lingus (Mittelklassewagen)
* Renault-Fiat 264 „Fattorina“ (Lieferwagen)
* Scania VM 42 (Transporter)
* Messerschmidt-Kawasaki Wandervogel (Kippflügel)
* Mercedes Multimog Greif (Kommandowagen)
* Mercedes PE Commando (Sicherheits-Lieferwagen)
* Ruhrmetall Wolf II (Mehrzweckpanzer)
* Jena Robotnik Cyclone (Spionagedrohne)
* Renraku Shrew (Zerlegbare Rad-Spionagedrohne)
* Ruhrmetall Wolfsspinne (Arachnide Läuferdrohne)

[Gast]

The city itself is split into corporate-controlled sectors and an anarchistic containment zone, with some zones that are "in transition" in between.

So it has become like Seattle =/

[Grinder]

Yup, there will be new art and new equipment as well:

http://www.pegasus.de/137+M5648b5d56aa.html

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lick.gif)

[faultline]

So who's going to volunteer to translate the "New" gear once the book comes and post it up on Dumpshock for us?

[Coldan]

Hey, won't you get the supplements? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) As I have heard, it is possible, that there will be some pdfs for you with the additional german equipment. Not sure what's the status there. But it is possible (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
But we have to wait until we get the book, it isn't there yet. I'm just waiting for it.

[faultline]

Is that right.

Well guess If they do release supplementals I'll be downloading them ASAP.

[TW]

There will be no german language pdf's for the forseeable future, but since Catalyst is also working on (english language) ebooks, chances are good that the additional material will be made available for the international audience as well.

[hermit]

Okay, how Crazy is Berlin? 2070

Batshit.

So it has become like Seattle =/

Not really, it used to be munchkin paradise with the whole city being total anarchy (while maintaining an infrastructure, somehow, possibly through magic) and a favoured corp investment zone (as can be seen in Somalia, investment skyrockets as soon as a bunch of loons with nothing to do and way too many heavy weapons are around).

The new Berlin setting actually IS an improvement, though it's not that hard to improve on the shittiest SR setting ever (including California and the Black Forest troll kingdom).

[raben-aas]

(while maintaining an infrastructure, somehow, possibly through magic)

Yup. They had mages work as subway guards to defend it against toxic earth spirits, remember? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Berlin has vastly improved as a setting, while still keeping a different flavor than Seattle. Berlin ist still only an "associated state" of Germany (ADL), and since it was the corps that "freed" the city what parts of the city are controlled are extraterritorial too. So you don't have any "federal law" (or rights) in the corporate zones (as they belong to the corp that freed the respective zone) or the East (as there are no laws at all and infrastructure etc. HAS crumbled and the remaining populace is starving).

If you like, Berlin is now more like Berlin after World War Two – a split city in a cold war, lots of districts in ruins, "secret agents" (aka shadowrunners and corporate black ops men) carrying out hidden agendas etc.

If you ever wanted to play something like the COLD CITY Rpg (LINK) in a SR universe, visit Berlin anytime

[hermit]

Yup. They had mages work as subway guards to defend it against toxic earth spirits, remember?

Urg. Yes. Spontaneously manifesting toxic spirits. Doesn't stop anyone from using the subway, of course.

If you like, Berlin is now more like Berlin after World War Two – a split city in a cold war, lots of districts in ruins, "secret agents" (aka shadowrunners and corporate black ops men) carrying out hidden agendas etc.

Well, kinda, yes. Somehow, even more arcologies popped up in Berlin (propably the corps had a few spares lying about in a back room in Nagoya), but except for Renraku's Seattle project, arcologies in SR seem to be insta-buildable anyway.

I still maintain that the setting can only be properly playable if Verjigorme devours the current city and a new one is built in it's place, but there you go.

[Rasumichin]

I always enjoyed playing in Berlin, but that may be due to the fact that i never fell for the completely unfounded idea of SR being "realistic" or at least not totally gonzo.
Or that i never considered RPGs to be something to be taken completely serious.
Others sometimes seem to lack that capability, which may be a pain in the ass if you are confronted with the AGS, the CFS or Japanese world domination in general, the concept that, all of a sudden, magic returns at a point in time that coincides with a wrongly quoted date from a Mayan calendar and happens to be modelled after 20th century fantasy stereotypes, or, heavens forbid, the NAN.

[MYST1C]

I always enjoyed playing in Berlin, but that may be due to the fact that i never fell for the completely unfounded idea of SR being "realistic" or at least not totally gonzo.
Or that i never considered RPGs to be something to be taken completely serious.

The problem with the Germany setting is that the original authors didn't take the game seriously, or so it seems. The original Deutschland in den Schatten of 1992 is so full of over-the-top silly ideas it reads (at least in parts) more like a satire or parody than an actual sourcebook.
Granted, AFAIK elements like the Troll Kingdom or flooded Hamburg had been introduced earlier by the American-written Harlequin adventure so the German authors had to work with it but "weird = cool" seems to have been one of the design concepts of the AGS setting.

I always had the impression that the German authors of the early 90s were influenced by Paranoia (a somewhat dark and dystopian world as background for a comedy RPG) and by comic books like Judge Dredd. SR's Berlin (pre-2055) could be transferred to Dredd's world without problems if you change metahumans into mutants and magic into psi powers.

Make no mistake, I love the German setting but I'm willing to admit its shortcomings.

[hermit]

I always enjoyed playing in Berlin, but that may be due to the fact that i never fell for the completely unfounded idea of SR being "realistic" or at least not totally gonzo.
Or that i never considered RPGs to be something to be taken completely serious.
Others sometimes seem to lack that capability, which may be a pain in the ass if you are confronted with the AGS, the CFS or Japanese world domination in general, the concept that, all of a sudden, magic returns at a point in time that coincides with a wrongly quoted date from a Mayan calendar and happens to be modelled after 20th century fantasy stereotypes, or, heavens forbid, the NAN.

Cry me a river.

Yes, it's not believable, and for a make-believe game set in a future derived from the present, it better should be. YMMV, but keep that arrogance down, will you?

AFAIK elements like the Troll Kingdom or flooded Hamburg had been introduced earlier by the American-written Harlequin adventure

No. That only included elements from Germany SB, like Anarchist Berlin and the Troll Kingdom. Hens and eggs.

[Rasumichin]

The problem with the Germany setting is that the original authors didn't take the game seriously, or so it seems. The original Deutschland in den Schatten of 1992 is so full of over-the-top silly ideas it reads (at least in parts) more like a satire or parody than an actual sourcebook.

Depending on your POV, that's either a problem or the main adavantage of the setting.

Yes, it's not believable, and for a make-believe game set in a future derived from the present, it better should be.

Make-believe game does not automatically boil down to sound speculative simulation game.
It can certainly (i've heard Traveller did particularly well in this regard), but it can also entail genre convention emulation, it can mean style over substance to the extreme, it can mean all physics are subject to action movie dramatic conventions.
Or that the NAN exists because the original devs thought a fragmented USA would be cool.

Suspension of disbelieve is only strained when basic assumptions about the gameworld are violated by a specific subsetting.
So what if the basic assumption is anything goes?