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> Whatcha think of my character?, from a statistical point of view only
Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 12:50 AM
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Gonna play this in a game soon. I'd like to know what you might have done different, and why.

http://www.geocities.com/starmage21/docs/d...dronerigger.xls

btw, the sheets a little crowded. It looks better if you look at it in print preview.
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Jaid
post Apr 23 2007, 01:14 AM
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just a note, you may have better luck getting response if you had the character in a format other than an excel spreadsheet, due to security concerns.
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ornot
post Apr 23 2007, 01:16 AM
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FWIW You might get a better response if you post the actual stats here, rather than requiring folk to download your file.

As for the stats themselves: I would be cautious about leaving any attributes at 1. It's bound to come back and bite you in the arse.
An agility of 5 seems rather wasted, and I would put it in reaction instead.

You need to specify which kind of tool kit you've bought, and putting a silencer on a hand gun firing ex-ex ammo is somewhat self defeating, depending on your GM. Whether you need multiple copies of your autosofts for seperate drones is another GM call. I would be inclined to put in any vision augmentation (perception mods) you can fit in your eyes, as they can be very useful. Personally I never bother paying for multiple months of lifestyle in advance, as you ought to make enough to live on from running, and depending on how evil your gm is, you may need to abandon your lifestyle anyway.
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Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 01:29 AM
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QUOTE (Jaid)
just a note, you may have better luck getting response if you had the character in a format other than an excel spreadsheet, due to security concerns.

Ahh I figured people would be using virus scanners and whatnot.

Posting that stuff here could make for a REALLY long post, and it wouldnt be all that easy to read. I'll work on getting it into a word doc or something though.
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Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 01:31 AM
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QUOTE (ornot @ Apr 22 2007, 08:16 PM)
FWIW You might get a better response if you post the actual stats here, rather than requiring folk to download your file.

As for the stats themselves: I would be cautious about leaving any attributes at 1. It's bound to come back and bite you in the arse.
An agility of 5 seems rather wasted, and I would put it in reaction instead.

You need to specify which kind of tool kit you've bought, and putting a silencer on a hand gun firing ex-ex ammo is somewhat self defeating, depending on your GM. Whether you need multiple copies of your autosofts for seperate drones is another GM call. I would be inclined to put in any vision augmentation (perception mods) you can fit in your eyes, as they can be very useful. Personally I never bother paying for multiple months of lifestyle in advance, as you ought to make enough to live on from running, and depending on how evil your gm is, you may need to abandon your lifestyle anyway.

I wasnt aware that EX-Ex ammo actually explodes, but rather fragments inside a target. If it really does explode then I'll be re-thinking my ammo choice for the pistol.

I'd rather have APDS anyway, but its beyond the availability =\

*edit*
The sample drone rigger has NOT paid for multiple copies of his software. It makes sense that you wouldnt have to have multiple copies of software, given that you can just copy it(remember, piracy in SR4 is the norm rather than the rule). Certain types of software thats the same on multiple systems would make a hackers job easy though if he needed to move between them.
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Whipstitch
post Apr 23 2007, 01:55 AM
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I disagree with the idea of not leaving attributes at 1, especially for mundanes like this char, since they don't have to blow karma on initiating and binding foci. An attribute score of 3 is rarely appreciably better than a score of 1 when you're stuck defaulting to begin with. It's nice to have a chance to score a hit at all, true, but that 1 or 2 dice simply isn't going to come through often enough to warrant 10 or 20 bp. I'd much rather see him leave Charisma at 1 and maybe pick up first impression. Then he could just spend his first 10 karma on bumping up charisma to 2 and picking up Etiquette. It's very cost effective and you really only have to survive 1 or two runs without dying due to your lack of manners to get there. Heck, I wouldn't even mind seeing him drop strength to 1 and picking stealth skill group either. He could even ditch his Tres Chic clothing for just plain old Chic and afford a Chameleon suit to go along with his 5 agility and newfound infiltration dice.
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Leehouse
post Apr 23 2007, 05:51 AM
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It doesn't pay for multiple copies of auto softs, but as far as I can tell he has payed for multiple pilots and multiple firewalls, you may have I haven't checked the math but I'm assuming not due to the other portions of the software category are only purchased once. And personally that is how I'd do it, you pay for a pilot for each drone(possibly each type) and a firewall for each drone but autosofts are copyable.
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G.NOME
post Apr 23 2007, 06:33 AM
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CHA 1? Everyone is going to hate you.

The AGI seemed a little high. But overall, it seems like a pretty well thought out character, good job.

You might want to get a "dummy" commlink. I know that's be suggested a number of times on these boards.
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Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 12:01 PM
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QUOTE (Leehouse)
It doesn't pay for multiple copies of auto softs, but as far as I can tell he has payed for multiple pilots and multiple firewalls, you may have I haven't checked the math but I'm assuming not due to the other portions of the software category are only purchased once. And personally that is how I'd do it, you pay for a pilot for each drone(possibly each type) and a firewall for each drone but autosofts are copyable.

youre right I didnt pay for multiple pilot programs. It does make sense that you'd have to have different ones though, and different firewalls too(going back to the hacker comment I made earlier).

All drones have a base pilot rating of 3 though, so upping them to 4 only gives me an extra die.
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Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 12:01 PM
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QUOTE (G.NOME)
CHA 1? Everyone is going to hate you.

The AGI seemed a little high. But overall, it seems like a pretty well thought out character, good job.

You might want to get a "dummy" commlink. I know that's be suggested a number of times on these boards.

Dummy Commlink? You mean something I can wear that wont give away my cybered commlink?
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Whipstitch
post Apr 23 2007, 03:52 PM
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QUOTE
Dummy Commlink? You mean something I can wear that wont give away my cybered commlink?


Exactly. A lot of us believe in wearing something like a cheap Metalink comm to run in public mode while doing routine business. That way you can display your fake ID so you don't stand out in a crowd and it also gives amateur hackers something to chew on if they're too dumb to find your real comm. Meanwhile, your real, honest-to-god iced to the gills commlink should be set on hidden mode as well as actually -physically- hidden if at all possible, since that's where you're doing your real biz. Hell, if you're real paranoid and have a ton of 'ware you are terrified of getting hacked, you can even run yet another commlink that has the wireless transmitter torn out/modified. Just subscribe all your cyberware to it via skinlink and you're as close to unhackable as you're going to get. Problem there though, is that your buddies won't be able to feed you info via imagelink that way, but it's still an option, and a very good one if you're doing solo work.
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Wasabi
post Apr 23 2007, 05:53 PM
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As a rule you may want to consider a fake ID ("Fake SIN") and tie it to a fake commlink. Your combat commlink should be rock solid but who cares if the fake commlink throws spam all over your Image Link. You only turn it on when in high sec areas or doing legit activity.
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Ravor
post Apr 23 2007, 05:56 PM
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Although I haven't read the char-sheet (Yeah I'm one of those people who doesn't completely trust my anti-viral software to catch everything.) the Ex-Series of ammo does use some tiny ammount of explosives to create improved fragmentation as per Fields of Fire, but we aren't told exactly how loud of a bang they really make.

Personally I treat the Ex-Series of Ammo as being unsilencable.
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Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 06:36 PM
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QUOTE (Ravor)
Although I haven't read the char-sheet (Yeah I'm one of those people who doesn't completely trust my anti-viral software to catch everything.) the Ex-Series of ammo does use some tiny ammount of explosives to create improved fragmentation as per Fields of Fire, but we aren't told exactly how loud of a bang they really make.

Personally I treat the Ex-Series of Ammo as being unsilencable.

Ahhh, I'll be switching my ammo then at least for the pistol.

QUOTE

Exactly. A lot of us believe in wearing something like a cheap Metalink comm to run in public mode while doing routine business. That way you can display your fake ID so you don't stand out in a crowd and it also gives amateur hackers something to chew on if they're too dumb to find your real comm. Meanwhile, your real, honest-to-god iced to the gills commlink should be set on hidden mode as well as actually -physically- hidden if at all possible, since that's where you're doing your real biz. Hell, if you're real paranoid and have a ton of 'ware you are terrified of getting hacked, you can even run yet another commlink that has the wireless transmitter torn out/modified. Just subscribe all your cyberware to it via skinlink and you're as close to unhackable as you're going to get. Problem there though, is that your buddies won't be able to feed you info via imagelink that way, but it's still an option, and a very good one if you're doing solo work.

Thats a really good idea, and I have some money left over to spend on something like a cheap metalink commlink. I could make that work easily. My good link is cybered, so thats already hidden.
fake SINs are so cheap, I can easily afford a few to go with the cheap commlink just by dropping a few months of lifestyle.
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Wasabi
post Apr 23 2007, 09:48 PM
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If you wait a bit for your team's hacker to crack the software in your main commlink you can use pirated copies in your fake commlink.

Hmmm.. that also means my hacker's new litmus test for who is a shaowrunner needs to include exploiting into their commlink and looking for cracked copies of OS and firewall...
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Ravor
post Apr 23 2007, 09:57 PM
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Yeah, but do you really trust that your team's Decker might not code a back-door into your system, "Just in case?"

Naw, its far safer either learn to crack your own software, or if your DM allows it, buy an Agent to do the cracking for you. (Of course, I imagine that many wouldn't allow Agents to do that.)

Barring either of those two, I'd pay money and go through a contact who had an invested interest in being perceived as honest, then going through a second contact to check your system out. It might not be fool-proof, but its better then asking a co-worker to to do it for you for free.
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Starmage21
post Apr 23 2007, 10:23 PM
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QUOTE (Ravor)
Yeah, but do you really trust that your team's Decker might not code a back-door into your system, "Just in case?"

Naw, its far safer either learn to crack your own software, or if your DM allows it, buy an Agent to do the cracking for you. (Of course, I imagine that many wouldn't allow Agents to do that.)

Barring either of those two, I'd pay money and go through a contact who had an invested interest in being perceived as honest, then going through a second contact to check your system out. It might not be fool-proof, but its better then asking a co-worker to to do it for you for free.

The group actually has a dedicated combat hacker. Im joining a game in progress, so maybe throwing my stuff out there might earn some trust from the team. Besides, the link is in my head!
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Ravor
post Apr 23 2007, 10:30 PM
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Yeah, all of the trust that holding the code to activate Black Hammer wielding Agents and sticking your sim-module into Hot Mode can buy. :cyber:

As for the link being in your head, well in my opinion, that just makes it harder to manually turn it off once DNI controls have been cut-off, but hey, as long as your character is willing to put his life in the Decker's hands then it'd be a good way to get free copies, provided of course that the Decker even agrees to give away his valuable time in the first place.
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WhiskeyMac
post Apr 24 2007, 01:14 AM
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There is no way to turn off DNI control though. That would just be retarded. It's hardwired to your nervous system. Why the hell would any manufacturer make that even possible?
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Jaid
post Apr 24 2007, 02:06 AM
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perhaps a better explanation would be that a hacker could subvery the DNI connection, block it off within the commlink, reroute the commands, fool the commlink into thinking the commands are just to be passed through to some phony commcode, etc.

while i agree you couldn't actually turn them off, i can certainly see ways to achieve the same effect.

on a side note, having a rating 4 pilot does more than just one die... and getting one more die on just about every single test you do is no small matter either. first off, it allows you to use higher rating autosofts... that's one more die there. secondly, it allows you to use *more* autosofts compared to the amount those autosofts slow you down (that is, depending on which line you prefer, at either 2 or 3 programs, a rating 3 pilot has it's response degrade, whereas a rating 4 pilot can handle 1 more).

so don't think of a rating 4 pilot as one more die to all tests only (though it is worth it, anyways). remember that it allows you to run that clearsight program so that you're not stuck with just sensor rating on sensor tests. remember that it allows you to run that extra targetting autosoft so you can use both parts of the ares alpha. remember that it might allow you to run an ECCM program to keep your drone under your command. and so on.
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toturi
post Apr 24 2007, 05:16 AM
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QUOTE (Starmage21)
Ahhh, I'll be switching my ammo then at least for the pistol.

Since SR4 does not impose a penalty to notice someone using EX, I wouldn't advise changing ammo just to have the gun silenced. The sound from the impact of the round might just be as loud as the explosion itself. Check with your GM before alteration, we cannot predict how your GM views it. As a GM, I will not impose any modifiers to notice and will treat anyone using EX in a silenced pistol as it is.
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Shrike30
post Apr 24 2007, 08:31 AM
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I don't have any recollection of the whole "explosive ammo is loud" thing having any basis in canon material. Basically, ask your GM if that's the case, and if he says no, stick with the explosive.

I'm pretty sure that the cycling of a gun's action is going to be louder than the faint "pop" of a few grains of explosive buried in a 125-250 grain pistol slug, especially if that "pop" is ocurring inside someone's torso... ignoring entirely the "crack" of the sonic boom that the supersonic hunk of lead made on it's way to the target. The "bang" of a pistol casing full of gunpowder is certainly going to be a hell of a lot louder.

I treat explosive ammo as the jacked-up frangible ammo of the Shadowrun world. Works pretty well for me.
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Starmage21
post Apr 24 2007, 12:18 PM
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QUOTE (Shrike30)
I don't have any recollection of the whole "explosive ammo is loud" thing having any basis in canon material. Basically, ask your GM if that's the case, and if he says no, stick with the explosive.

I'm pretty sure that the cycling of a gun's action is going to be louder than the faint "pop" of a few grains of explosive buried in a 125-250 grain pistol slug, especially if that "pop" is ocurring inside someone's torso... ignoring entirely the "crack" of the sonic boom that the supersonic hunk of lead made on it's way to the target. The "bang" of a pistol casing full of gunpowder is certainly going to be a hell of a lot louder.

I treat explosive ammo as the jacked-up frangible ammo of the Shadowrun world. Works pretty well for me.

and thats exactly what I was talking about earlier when I said that I thought explosive ammo just fragments inside a target. Someone pointed out to me that there is an amount of explosive in them though(that has a canon basis). But youre right that it shouldnt make much of a difference.
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ornot
post Apr 24 2007, 10:16 PM
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My logic for suggesting that EX-explosive ammo does go bang stems from the fact that it has an AP modifier as well as a damage modifier. While it is true that the sound of a gun cycling, and the crack of the bullet travelling through the air, and the charge that propells the ammo in the first place are factors, presumably the character has a silencer for a reason, and adding any more extraneous noise is surely a bad thing.
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Whipstitch
post Apr 25 2007, 10:58 PM
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QUOTE (Shrike30 @ Apr 24 2007, 03:31 AM)
I treat explosive ammo as the jacked-up frangible ammo of the Shadowrun world.  Works pretty well for me.

That's EXACTLY how I view EX rounds. The rules say flatout that normal SR rounds are FMJ; They're high velocity -solid- rounds. In a world with cheap and readily available legal body armor, that makes perfect sense that people would use ammunition with solid tips; body armor makes flechette and hollow points a losing proposition. The advantage of either type of explosive round in SR isn't that they explode with any real force, it's that they slide through armor with their solid tips like AP rounds and then explode enough to "pop" open like a hollow point. It's not like you're hitting people with an RPG here, you're just using fictional super rounds that penetrate AND fragment.
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