On the writing process, I feel like I'm missing something. Options

[sunnyside]

Alright this isn't complaining, I feel like I'm missing something. And I'm genuinly curious.

While my memories of second ed are fairly dim, and I never read first, as far as I know every edition of shadowrun (the base book) just has a whole lotta obvious errors. Typically the examples are wrong a couple times in the book, and usually the archtypes have errors.

Since it's the most recent the memory of the messed up sprite abilities is fresh in my mind. That was glaringly obvious to me on the first read through of the book.

Anyway I'm wondering if some of my basic assumption of SR games are wrong. Such as the idea that the final version is proofed and playtested before release by people other than the people who wrote it. I assumed some of the 100+ playtesters referenced in the "props" section would have fit into that.


So that led to wondering how the writing process for an SR base book really works. Is it less "corporate writing and art project" more wild and crazy bunch of freelancers putting stuff together online?

[Adarael]

That would be the majority of it, yes. That's actually true of most RPG companies these days. Either it's freelancers, it's a small group doing an entire project (EOS Press, say), or it's WOTC using in-house guys.

[Rifleman]

Sadly, roleplaying as an industry requires small groups doing large projects spanning months for (relatively) minor payouts.

Thus, this is not what you would call a industry indicative of the corporate method.

Therefore, there is almost no way to achieve any sort of fully proof checked book before production. As someone with editing experience, I can tell you truthfully that if it isn't something that can be figured out through it being read aloud (such as stat errors), it is very unlikely to get caught.

[Adam]

Stuff like the archetypes [and often other examples] are usually written with an early version of the rules, and if the rules are updated *after* those things are generated, sometimes the samples/examples derived from them don't get updated.

Shadowrun books are edited in two different ways: "dev edit" -- which is Rob, Peter, and Robyn working to integrate the drafts from different authors, make sure they mesh together, tweaking the rules, integrating playtest feedback, etc; and a "copy edit" that occurs after the dev edit, cleaning up grammar, spelling, and that sort of stuff.

Sometimes further dev editing sneaks in after the copy edit, and that can fix some problems while adding others, most notably when one part of the book is updated and another related part doesn't get updated. This sort of stuff really only happens with books that are in serious time crunch and that have a very broad scope [like the core rulebook]

[Snow_Fox]

and what happened with the abortion of a Rigger Black book that was sooo bad?

[Wounded Ronin]

I think that we need to hire a bunch of unemployable physics grad students and make them write up a mathematically and theoretically perfect RPG system. However, they can be so socially inept that the system is unusable for anyone who isn't a mathematician. If that happened I would carry around a copy of that sourcebook to let everyone think I was smart enough to play it.

[Adam]

[Angelone]

Not trying to be snarky or a smartass, but or else what? They were closing what were they going to do fire you? I'm sorry if I'm drudging up bad memories or sticking my nose where I shouldn't. I just have an uncontrollable curiosity about these type of things.

[Adam]

Would you like to lose your job today, or in a month, after you've had time to look for a new job, cut expenses, etc? I didn't work for FASA, but I've worked for a game company that was in the process of laying off all the full-time staff, and I sure appreciated the month and a half to save a bit of money, curb my spending, find some freelance work, take advantage of my workplace-provided dental insurance while I still had it, etc.

Bear in mind that at that point WizKids had not agreed to buy SR, so the game had no new home, and there was also the mentality that SR3 should be "complete" in case nothing was ever published again.

[Angelone]

I see, I like the need for it to be complete. How long does it usually take to make a book? Either a sourcebook or something like the core rules.

[Adam]

Anywhere from six to eighteen months depending on the complexity/size of the book. A book can be done in less time, but it usually requires some sort of special situation or compromise -- for example, a book that used only pre-existing artwork could be released more quickly; a book of 3 unrelated adventures is quicker to develop than a book of 3 related adventures; etc.

[the_dunner]