Getting into SR, Newbie Options

[Ikirouta]

Hi,

This is my first post to this forum. I have had SR 4 for about as long as it has been available but I am yet to run it. I have a long "career" of running CP2020 but now I need something fresh.

Now, I need to know whether this game is for me. As a married man with kid I am pretty short on spare time so I'd like to know how "high maintenance" SR is. Of course it depends on how complicated you want it to be but that applies to other games, too. What I really need to know is how hard it is create NPC stats etc. SR specific mechanics wise.

Another thing that I'm a bit afraid is that there are so many ... subgames in SR that the learning curve might be a bit steep for me and my players. After all there are those trigger, netrunners, various mages and adepts. Lots of stuff.

So, how hard it is to start running this game and how much prep work is necessary to keep the game going?

Thanks in advance!

[Zolhex]

The rules for 4th have been simplifiyed alot to make it easier for new players to get in on the game so that should be easy for you.

Character creation in any new game can take hours but that is just due to everyone reading and decideing what to be and best to be it.

As to running the game start with the Shadowrun Missions you can download from the main Shadowrun website.

There are like 16 available right now all are writen to be run in a 4 hour convention time slot so it shouldn't take more than that and it is an ongoing campain for you to run.

By the time you finish them you should a have a firm grasp of the system and what it takes to run a game of your own design.

[Ikirouta]

OK. I have to take a look at those scenarios. I am still itching to put my own gang "Inner City Goblins" to game 8)

[sunnyside]

The one thing you have to watch in SR4 as a new GM from CP2020 is the "three worlds" issue. In CP the Net is there, but, in my limited experience isn't everpresent, and is enough of a major pain in the butt to do something with that it only comes up when central to the plot. So you just have the physical world.

In shadowrun however, you have 3 worlds.

The physical world (what you're used to).

The astral world: The realm of mages. This doesn't just mean what is actually present in the astral, but means that when designing security or something you need to consider what wards are present, if they have a mage on staff, if they can call in a spirit or astral mage from a remote site if they need backup etc etc.


The Matrix: It's wireless, it's everywhere, it's in everything. Even the potted plants are online (they at least have a simple RFID based transmitter that transmits soil moisture, salt concentration in the sap, and temperature.) More practically the security system can be hacked, the smartgoggles on the security guard can be hacked, the drone outside can be spoofed. And all that stuff needs ratings.

Probably worried you there. Calm down, take a deep breath, it isn't that bad. Typically devices just have all the ratings at the same value, and there is a table for what that single value is. You can also assume that nearly every corp building has RF blocking paint (so you can't hack stuff inside from the outside) and a Ward (cheap easy to make magical protection). Eventually all of this will be second nature to you, and hopefully your players to.

Don't worry if you have issues at first. Most SR4 GMs totally botch the matrix at first, as often as not the players don't know or care. They're learning too.

Also you mentioned a gang. Starting out in the barrens or something like that can simplify things a lot. Not as much matrix presence, not as much magical presence. You can build up And every campaign in 4th is different. They haven't normalized things all that well, don't sweat it. And missions do help you along.

[Aaron]

I have a number of resources for new players on my Shadowrun Resources page. You're welcome to them.

[marghos]

[OneSeventeen]

One thing that had helped me and my players a lot is On the Run. It kind of goes around and gives you a peak at all the different pieces of the SR universe. It also has (very helpful to me) page number references to rules (likely to be) used in each scene. It is also good about pushing across the idea that the wired world is omni-present and all that. We're about done with it and will be moving on to stuff I've made soon. I can tell you for certain, I didn't have the confidence with the setting and rules until now to try to run something of my own. Great introduction for me as a GM and to the players as well. Handily, it is longer than a 4 hour block, so you can get used to things over a series of sessions. On the down side, it is not free like the Missions adventures are.


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[Ikirouta]

Yes, I noticed this 3 world aspect and that is one scary thing for me. Lots of things to learn. Of course I could say that only non-awakened characters and maybe even no netrunners for the first team but that kind of takes the edge away from it being a SR game, doesn't it :P

Marghos, old buddy (yes, it's me SnowDog but I could not use that alias here, long story) you should have asked ;)

Thank you all for giving all the advice (so far). I am still looking for further hints so don't be shy :)

[sunnyside]

Oh and be very wary of having a technomancer in the party at first.

They are the only class, in any system I know of, where players utterly have no idea how to use them. It's really sad. They'll make up the character, try to hack something, and totally blow it. And they won't be able to do anything else either because nearly all their BP are in technomancing.

But when they finally start a thread here and we clue them in the first thing they'll have to do is go out and buy more dice because they want to roll 30+ at once when shooting with their drone and they don't own that many. And then they'll say they want to hack Zurich Orbital.

All of that is a headache you don't want out of the gate. Just have them be a hacker and buy all the programs in the book at rating 6(they can only start with system 5 so until they upgrade all progs will run at rating 5), so whatever they want to do they pretty much roll the same number of dice. Very easy. Very straightforward.

[marghos]

[Ikirouta]

Great advice! Technomancers are out, one down, many to go :)

I am still wondering about whether to keep matrix and magic or put the magic to NPC only category at first. On the other hand it narrows down the things I have to learn to run the game but it also narrows down some great aspects of the game to be used later on. Tough call. Maybe I just re-read the char gen rules, combat and matrix plus the GM part and then ask what kind of character my players would like to play.

Using a gang as a starting point would explain why magic is not that common and necessary part of the game at the starting stages.

Now, how much time you use to give game stats to your NPCs? Old hands do it probably quite quickly but as a beginner (I hate to be a beginner) it can take a bit more time.

Thanks, Marghos, I think that my sig is kind of cool, too ;)

[Wasabi]

Start by not having any magic present and only a rare metahuman here or there. Then do a run into Oregon and the Tir Tairngire with the elvin lands when you're ready. Slowly build up the aspects so you dont get overwealmed. Its story that makes a good game, variety is only a means to that end.

Also... focus on power levels involving knives and pistols at first. Shotguns and Uzis should be feared. Later on you can always escalate. Focus on the story. SR is all about detective work and politics... its why the game world is so rich. Focus on the story and slowly adapt to the rest. :-)

[Wasabi]

Have the matrix present but require the cracking skill group to be rolled, notihng more individualized and just do it as a straight resisted dice roll.

[sunnyside]

There are sample NPCs in the book. Also there are the archtypes, plus stuff in the books.

In reality a lot of us probably just wing it for non critical NPCs. i.e. if we want a head of security we probably just give them a couple stats at ratings we feel are appropriate and maybe toss in some cyber. If we need to know his charisma for some reason just make it up on the spot. No need to do all that BP business. Sometimes if unplanned NPCs get involved (players sometimes go off on all kind of tangents) I don't even bother to make stats per se. I just figure what size of dice pool looks right. And then when the guy shoots with their smartlinked gun I just roll say 11 die.

How did that happen? Does he have agility 5 and firearms 4 with the smartlink, or maybe agility 4 firearms 3, spec in whatever he's shooting and the smartlink? Unless it comes up I don't have to decide. 11 Dice, that's what's important.


Now the "main" NPCs are a little different. I think you may find time to work them out in more detail. Though again you can save time by ignoring the whole BP/Karma thing. Just give them skills and ware that seems appropriate. Still it's fun to make characters. And in time you'll find yourself making a 400 BP mage to oppose the characters whether you want to or not. :D

[knasser]

I have a load of stuff useful to new GMs on my site (first of the links in my sig) which you are quite welcome to. I would particularly look at the adventure Cold Blood, which I wrote specifically as an introduction and it covers a lot of "roll this to do this" for things like hacking maglocks, etc. There're also some example matrix sites as the main book is very sparse on these. The FAQ's and NPC rosters may or may not be of interest.

I second Technomancers - keep it hackers only. Particularly if you want to later run Emergence. I disagree with keeping out the metahumans. Having metahumans could add a small amount of complexity to creating characters, but not much to the running of the game which is where complexity would actually be a problem. And metahumans are a major piece of the Shadowrun flavour that players will love!

As to NPCs, grunts, I tend to rip straight out of the book and modify on the fly, very detailed people might take me about twenty minutes. I may be pretty fast though, I don't know. One thing to keep in mind when making characters which many people don't notice, is that the average Attribute score is TWO, not three. Three is for where you have a reason for it to be higher (a cop with Body three, for example). And the average skill is 0. Pilot (Ground Vehicle) 0 doesn't mean you can't drive. It means that your driving ability is the bog-standard minimum you need. It's important to keep the power scale right, especially at the start.

[TheMadDutchman]

Personally, I think it's worth the extra time to introduce Hackers, mages, and riggers from the start. It'll help everyone at the table to learn the rules together and yes, everything will move a little slower at first but it'll only take a few sessions before everything starts running seemlessly and it's worth it to have all the elements of shadowrun available from the beginning.

A good cheat sheet always come in handy and shouldn't take too long to do.

I haven't seent the GM screen yet but they usually have good aids and quick references for rules to help keep everything flowing good.

[Aaron]

[Ikirouta]

Thank you all for the input! I have to reconsider having matrix and magic both. Metahumans certainly but if I want to go "low level", then I might disallow trolls. For some reason I have a feeling that mechanics wise shooting a troll with a pistol is not that effective if you want to keep the game gritty and showdowns scary.

I will have to take a look the link mentioned at the thread.

[Particle_Beam]

Keep in mind that the average street ganger in SR might easily get his hands on assault rifles and other quite heavy armament if he wants it.

[Ikirouta]

[sunnyside]

Um according to the book the average stat is 3 back in the attribute sections. Generally I'd just base things off of what the book has.

You might want to talk to your players. A gang level game would be an easy start rules wise, but a lot of people want to jump right into the cyberware and all that.

Maybe just play them as being new in town and hiding out in the barrens or something. It isn't so bad letting them be big fish in a little lake for a little while. And if you go with puyallup organized crime and stuff could start entering into the plot all to quickly. You could maybe add game elements one at a time over game sessions. For example in week one it's just social skills and making things bleed. Then in the next you add the matrix, lots of it. Then in the next magic, then in the next drones. Then after that start trying to add world elements like Seattle itself and the different crime organizations and the corps and lonestar and all that. This gives you some time to decide how you want to run things.

GMs run Lonestar in particular wildly differently. Sometimes they have drones all over and quick responses. Sometimes the opposition they send after runners is like a bad 80's comedy. Personally I give them credit for having good equipment and special forces, but they're stretched. So if the runners don't make problems for the public or really torque off a corp they may play it a little soft. If the runners start killing cops or something things can get rough fast. Lone star does have a couple thunderbirds after all, which nifty "land shark" surface to ground missles. That isn't in the base rulebook, but you can use your immagination or just give a banshee a pair of missle launchers and a HMG.



Or just do something like knasser's stuff or missions that holds your hand a little.

EDIT: You copywrote that thing?

Anyway good stuff (cold blood anyway, I will avoid commenting on carnival). Only thing on the matrix is that I would expect most or at least many systems to have analyze loaded. I notice you don't add that even to higher end systems. You also might want to stress that you roll analyze +firewall at each hack on the fly attempt.

And maybe, if you're ever up for a third adventure. Have the same hand holding for some magic stuff. Throw in a simple ward and maybe a magic 4 type of mage.

[Ikirouta]

Good advise, Sunnyside. I'll have to talk to my players and see what they want. In any case I thought that they (or most of them) would be new to Seattle. Other things are up to negotiation and what kind of character they want to play.

[Ikirouta]

I talked with one of my players about SR yesterday and he came up with an idea. Maybe we should just create a bunch of characters (no matrix and no magic for them). Maybe use 300 BPs and have a run or two to get hang of the rules. Then we can create the real runner team using basic 400 BP characters and allow matrix and magic to them. The old (surviving) characters can be bought as contacts or friends to new players (and replacement characters).

Another idea I got after that would be to create full 400 BP characters (again without thinking about matrix or magic) and after getting the basic rules (and combat) working I would allow those who want to change characters (to mage or netrunner) if they want to.

What do you think? Would it work? Should I give free Karma to the new characters in second option so they would start as experienced as older characters? I would not do it normally but this is not a normal situation. On the other hand the players then have better grasp on rules and how to create better characters so maybe that will even out the field for new characters...

[Particle_Beam]

If you're just going to learn to play with the rules, I'd rather advise to just take the archetypes in the book for a few test-runs, instead of creating customized characters in a long and time-consuming evening. Unless you also want to test out character creation, but that's actually less a problem than the active gameplay rules, in my opinion. :)

[tisoz]