Cyborg beats normies in official race, The Future Is Now Options

[toturi]

Look among normal athletes, you can be sure that if the said athlete isn't working as hard, he has the same basic physical makeup as the other. There is simply no proof either way that the new guy isn't benefitting from his blades any more than a normal person would from his lower limbs. What I have read is that his blades has improved his performance. So at this juncture without widely accepted definite proof, his blades is still a performance enhancement tool that the other athletes do not have access to, unless they want to cut their legs off and replace them.

I'm not in competition with that guy and I'm saying he's got an edge(not to be confused with the Edge :D)

[odinson]

[hyzmarca]

[eidolon]

[Cheops]

[Ikirouta]

I have to say that I'd like to see him run in Olympics. Is it fair? I don't know, since it's kind of hard to say how much those blades help him, if at all. Heck, he's faster than any of the Finnish 400 m runners :eek:

What comes to doping, please! I don't believe that there are anyone at any sport (that can benefit from it) who doesn't use doping (at least those who are at the top). Kenyan runners might be an exception because long distance running is not as sexy sport as 100 m dash so maybe richer countries just don't want to invest to long distance running enough to use doping.

Obviously I don't have any evidence but since top athletes get busted for doping every now and then it's a pretty good indication, don't you think?

[toturi]

[ShadowDragon8685]

Cheops, welcome to the Olympics, 2070 style.

(And yes, assuming no major changes, the Winter Olympics will be held in the year 2070. I calculated it.)

[Ryu]

So we wait for the first competitors who get their legs hacked of once this tech is allowed?

Right about now he seems to be at an acceptable point of performance and should be allowed to race. We as SR-players know what is comeing up, for sure.

[nezumi]

I would have to agree with Cheops. The question does not end at whether it's fair for this person.

Additionally, in response to those people who have tried to apply disability laws and such, remember that if any trait results in the person being unable to perform the duties indicated, there is no requirement that person get hired on. This is doubly true since the Olympics are not hiring these people, but rather offering a service, and the fact that I do not believe they are based out of the US, and therefore US law does not apply. However, simply said, the idea of the Olympics is a competition between natural men performing at the best of their natural ability. Just like we wouldn't hire a black man to play Abraham Lincoln, we wouldn't hire a person with substantial augmentation to compete as a non-augmented person. It's discrimination on the same level of denying someone a job because he doesn't have a college degree or doesn't live in the right city. It sucks, but that's life.

As someone else said, I'd love to see him in the para-olympics, and considering how Olympics viewing rates have been going down, I imagine the para-Olympics really might be the 'way of the future'.

[Wakshaani]

[James McMurray]

[pestulens]

Sorry to be anil retentive about this but he is not technically a cyborg, there is no control integration involved ie he cant bend at the aicle or flex. Cybernetics is the study of control sistoms.


wate a second, I'm not sorry!

[Moon-Hawk]

So if letting this guy compete with his prosthetic is unfair, what about:
Someone who has artificial implants in his eyes to improve vision? Implanted contact lenses are a rarely-used, but allowable, alternative to laser surgery, I believe.
Someone who has had tendons replaced with stronger tissue? Baseball pitchers sometimes have torn tendons in their elbows replaced using tissue from their legs, which just happens to be stronger.
Someone who has metal bones, which are stronger than regular bones? The metals and ceramics used in reconstructive surgery aren't weak.
Someone who wears an external device on their feet that allows them to run faster and longer? They're called shoes.

My point is, human modification is a spectrum. This guy is a little farther down the spectrum than we're used to, but that doesn't mean that his situation is a whole new thing and is fundamentally any different than all sorts of crap that's already allowed. I admit that, at some point, a line must be drawn, but it's tough to come up with a condition that specifically excludes him that doesn't exclude something that's already been allowed, and doesn't sound contrived and silly.

[Xenith]

Let the man run. If its his dream, let him. If an astronaut or racer had an artifical heart, would you keep him from doing what he loves to do? How about an archer with an artificial eye?

Seriously, people whine and complain about piddly shit, but then ignore the important things... like breathing fresh air for instance.

[Cheops]

I'm not against this sort of stuff in the Olympics of 2070. I could understand why you'd have augmented athletes in the world of SR. However, not everyone is talking about SR athletes. The discussion is primarily RL about this runner in particular.

The problem with this guy, is does this give him an unfair advantage? He says it doesn't but the governing body for Athletics (track and field) says it does. The IOC gives the governing body the right to adjudicate its own sport and only steps in when it feels something fishy is going on.

Lol...Moon-Hawk. I don't think anyone is worried about shoes for athletes. The world is doing a much better job at making sure that LDCs are getting access to sports and necessary equipment (shoes, balls, nets, etc). See Right to Play and all the effort that FIFA is making. However the stuff you mentioned above that is definitely valid.

For starters I've never heard of a baseball pitcher doing that when it wasn't a serious injury (ie. not mandatory). That Kenyan runner who gets his legs chopped off by the local rebels because they thought he was a threat is not going to be able to afford the surgery to replace his legs. His days of competition are over. The Para-Olympics are almost entirely a developed country sporting event. And I believe that the IOC and various governing bodies DO have guidelines about how far you can go before it is "unnatural."

[Moon-Hawk]

I can certainly see the arguments of unfairness.
I think at the very least he should be given a lane and allowed to run, but told that officially he won't be competing for a medal. No one can possibly bitch that it's unfair, 'cause he can't get in anyone's way of the gold, but if he does well then the world will have seen him do it, and if in 50 years we decide that he definitely should have been allowed to compete than we can give him or his family a medal and revise the records. But if he's not given a lane then the world will simply never know.

[Xenith]

An interesting compromise. I'm impressed, if not entirely convinced.

[Demerzel]

I did some looking into these, I remember from a while ago seeing similar prosthetics in the news. Aimee Mullins was showing them off on the Rosie O’Donnel show in 1998, and doing magazine covers with them on as a model in addition to running in them. She used an earlier version of them, but they were similar. Jami Goldman wrote a book about her experience with amputation and it includes her using “cheetah legs�, possibly the same or a similar prosthetic to the one in the originally posted story. You can google their names for more details.

As to your comments Mook-Hawk:

[nezumi]

Demerzel basically answered the specific examples Moonhawk brought up, however I"d say that there's also a substantial difference between modifications for a player in a US-only sport who is actually paid to participate (and so is an employee) and an Olympic athlete. I'd see no problem with this guy joining the NFL or the NBA, as long as he's obeying federal and appropriate local laws. I would see a problem with him joining a soccer team that might go off to play in the World Cup, however (although not so much as compared to the Olympics).

[Moon-Hawk]

Incidentally, my point was not that any of my examples were abusive, only that human modification for recovery and/or enhancement is already taken as a matter of course. It's just a question of where to draw the line. I agree that the line must be drawn somewhere, but for now I think he should be allowed to run, let the world see how he does, and just don't let him place, officially.
Anyone who thinks it isn't fair can't complain, since he wasn't officially competing anyway, but anyone who believes he should be able to compete, well, at least the world saw him and everyone knows who crossed that finish line before him and after him.

[hobgoblin]

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/15.01/b...betterbody.html

i also recall reading about special contacts that filtered out blue light to give a batter contrast on grassy fields. interestingly they made the users eyes look red. some athlete's that used them talked about enjoying that recoloring as it spooked the opponents. makes one think of cyber-psychosis...

[Demerzel]

The problem I see with letting him run and saying it doesn’t count is that if he does do well, then the winner(s) of record has to defend his victory in a stupid way. Then you place this burden that right now is on the community as a whole onto the medallist(s). Then not only does he have to defend against the allegations that he’s on drugs but he’ll also have to defend that he deserves it over Mr. Cheetah Legs.

What precedent would we be setting anyhow? Should we let the gold medallist in the Special Olympics race also, because it doesn’t count so why would it matter? Can we reserve a lane for the Tesla Roadster so we can show the world how much faster the current fastest production zero emissions car is compared to a meat athlete? Can I race my horse in a spare lane also? She’s half quarter horse, you should see how fast she can accelerate, it’s impressive.

[Heimdalol]

[Demerzel]