Question on spell force Options

[captainh]

In the main rule book it say that the number of success you can apply to a spell in the magic + spellcasting roll is limited by the force. Does this mean net success or just success period. Mainly i'm trying to figure out from a combat spell stand point.

Example:
Mage A casts a force 4 mana bolt on Streetsam B, Mage A gets 7 successes on his roll and Streetsam B gets 6 successes on his resistance roll. So my question is would the Streetsam take no damage because the force 4 limits it to just 4 success or would he take 5 damage?

Example 2:

Mage A casts a force 2 mana bolt at Streetsam B, Mage a gets 3 success and Streetsam B gets 1 success, In this situation would the Streetsam take 3 damage or 4 damage?

I've been trying to figure this out for a while and I'm just not sure which is the correct answer, so any help would be appreciated.

[Eryk the Red]

Successes period. This makes low force spells easy to resist.

[DTFarstar]

Example 1: Mage goes "What the hell?" and has his buddy shoot the guy who dropped an insane amount of BP to get like 18 dice to resist spells.

[Naysayer]

Example 1: GM whacks the sammie and takes his dice back...

OT though, the force of the spell caps your hits (you know, newspeak for success), so if Mage A throws a Force 4 Mana Bolt, for all it's worth he could roll 10 hits, only 4 of them count. If the Sammie then manages to cheat and wiggle his way into 6 hits, the spell goes poof and nothing happens.

So, in Example 2, it would be 3 damage.

Or, to put it in a nutshell: what Eryk said...

[DTFarstar]

When I play a mage if I am aiming for a maximum effectiveness spell I generally cast it at Force = dice pool/3 or at Drain Value = soak pool/3. Unless I'm trying to exterminate something with extreme prejudice then I cast it at Force 12 and go "AAAAARRRRRRRRG!" as my frontal lobe explodes.


Chris

[James McMurray]

It's also important to remember that you can get around the max hits limit by adding Edge toy our pool.

[DTFarstar]

Force 5 Lightning Ball + Edge +8 hits = 24 dead, dying, and/or incapacitated gangers.

[odinson]

But never forget it is only the edge dice that can excede the force. So if you have 8 hits from your spellcasting dice and no hits from your edge dice then you still only have 4 hits for that force 4 spell.

[FriendoftheDork]

[Konsaki]

[Nychuus]

[DTFarstar]

They were in two flatbed trucks which had just crashed the gate into a complex I was helping protect. The SS had already fired a rocket in between them. I'm not a big fan of indirect spells the drain is such a bitch, but sometimes they are just fun.


Chris

Also, my GM doesn't want to slow down gameplay anymore than needed so we just let hits exceed force with edge period because none of us are insane so ritual teams of doom aren't a problem.

[odinson]

It's not a problem as long as you have more than one set of dice. I think I've got about a dozen or so sets of d6's so I always have different colours of dice set aside for different rolls. If you set one colour to edge and one to your spellcasting it's not hard to tell what ones are you edge dice and what ones aren't.

I supposed if one was to limit the number of hits to force+edge it would get around the 1 edge, 20 spell poll magicial casting a force 4 spell with 7 hits, more than enough to ko most people.

[Glyph]

Keep in mind that if you declare Edge dice before rolling, all of the dice become exploding. So even if you only allow the non-Edge dice to go up to the spell's Force, it is likelier that they will reach that limit, and the purely Edge dice will add on from there.

I don't have a problem with that, though. Edge dice are supposed to be used to get extraordinary results. Plus, by spending Edge before rolling, you can't spend it to negate a glitch or turn a critical glitch into a normal one.


By the way, your Force: 4 spell with 7 hits example would only work if a target got no successes to resist it. For one-shot takedowns, you usually need either overcasting, or an Edge higher than 1 or 2.

[DTFarstar]

Overcasting + Stunbolt + Combat Dice Pool of 16 = Win at the 400 BP 20 karma level.

I generally sap people to sleep with Force 7 spells. I think it has failed once and let's face it the drain on a Force 7 Stunbolt is laughable.


Chris

[Buster]

How does the combat dice pool help with the stunbolt? (not being facetious, I'm wondering if I'm forgetting a rule somewhere)

[Ol' Scratch]

I think he's talking about his dice pool with Combat Spells (Spellcasting 6 + Specialization 2 + Willpower 6 + Totem 2 maybe?).

[Fortune]

[Ol' Scratch]

Details!

[DTFarstar]

Sorry, yes, I heard spells in my head while I was typing that, but as I've long since stopped playing MUDs and such my typing speed is now well below the speed of thought and sometimes I can't keep up with myself. I really miss my 160+ words per minute typing speed. Anyway, combat spells dice pool.

6 Magic + 6 Spellcasting + 2 Power Focus + 2 Spec = 16 dice.

I also soak at 13 dice 8 Cha + 5 Will.

FA at 2 First Aid + 4 Logic + 6 rating + 2 spec in Combat Wounds.

And Influence Group/Intimidate at 9. Good old Charisma.


Don't know why I added all that in. I should be asleep. Gotta run Food Fight and segue into Queen Euphoria tomorrow.


Chris


EDIT: I want a Mentor Spirit, but I think I may have to make one. None of the published ones fit my character at all.

EDIT2: Except for the Dark Goddess, but the sheer volume of gay jokes would be way worse than the actual disadvantage.

EDIT3: Actually, holy crap, somehow I managed to completely miss the Sun mentor spirit multiple times. It would be freaking perfect. Mechanics and thematics wise.

[Buster]

I always ruthlessly rename mentor spirits to avoid the "that's gay" comments. My mentor is always Raven even if it looks exactly like the description and rules for Adversary, Artificer, Owl, etc.

[James McMurray]

[Tarantula]

[DTFarstar]

I have a feeling that I may be being made fun of, but hell, you caught me sleepy again so.... here we go.

Initiative is pitiful unless we are on a run. While running I'm generally possessed by a Force 6 Spirit of Man with Heal and Combat Sense or a Guardian Spirit with Concealment and Skill in whatever weapon happens to be handy.

So, outside runs it is 5, often a little higher because with his wasted physique it is just easier to rely on spirits for alot of things. So, he possesses himself alot. He also cultivates good relationships with his spirits. Makes sure to try and do at least some stuff they will actually enjoy and not be able to get in the astral plane. Drinks/food/sex/music/art whatever depending on the spirits personality.

During runs it is 11.

Outside runs, body of 3, inside runs body of 9.

Outside runs, I generally come equipped with a stun baton and a Defiance EX Shocker.

In runs, I usually travel with a monofilament whip and some form of firearm dependent on the situation.

Everything you mentioned mainly depends on whether or not I'm being possessed. I have a stable of a couple of Force 4-6 spirits that I keep relatively high on favors so even if my current summoned spirit gets banished I have some backup bound ones.

Gear-wise, I have a scooter, armor with rating 6 mods across the board, a mono-whip, a stun baton, a Defiance EX Shocker, and a couple of grenades. I mainly use magic for just about everything. I currently get free High lifestyle for maintaining the wardings on my gangs territory.

Did I mention he is blind and uses astral sight for everything?

He's an interesting character. At least I like to think so, if you actually were serious and want to know more, let me know and I'll either PM you a transcript of his sheet or post it here if you would like.

Thanks for your time,
Chris