Private armys, real life gets closer to SR Options

[Daddy's Litt...]

http://www.blackwaterusa.com/

These are the guys in Iraq now, but you read about them or hear about them on the news and it seems pletty clear you are looking at an extraterritorial strike team. They have military grade weapons and do not answer to the police or army. the US State dept is supposed to hold their leash but are not watching them.

[Kagetenshi]

You may want to review the history of the British East India Company :)

~J

[nezumi]

I'm pretty sure you've been scooped a long time ago, but it's a continually evolving situation, so that's okay.

Blackwater and other military contractors are basically armies for hire, yes. And they will be doing increasing domestic work as well, simply because they're cheaper for the taxpayer than an actual federal employee. It won't be long before we see Blackwater and its ilk providing deadly force protection over things like nuclear plants, places where we need strong protection against 'terrorists', but it isn't cost effective to actually set an army post there.

Whether Blackwater and the like are required to follow the rules of military justice depends solely on their contract. Unless otherwise specified, the only laws they are bound by are the laws of that country, and there they oftentimes get exceptions as a government contractor (for instance, they get access to hardware that I as a Joe consumer can't buy). Oftentimes they don't work under the supervision of a current federal employee, but I don't think doing otherwise would significantly help.

How good or bad these guys can be depends almost completely on the contract. Like Ron Paul has said, if there were a $1b reward for finding Bin Laden, Bin Laden would be found by now, probably by people like this, and would cost the taxpayers $49b than it has so far. If these guys are required by contract to make sure they follow reasonable standards of law and ethics, they will do so because every level of the organization knows to do otherwise is to lose the contract (as opposed to federal employees, who think 'it's your job, if you want to do that stupid thing, go for it'.) As long as the company seriously pays out for dead soldiers (or dead civilians) they will make darn sure they invest in the best medical and safety equipment they can. Unfortunately, if they're not restricted in their contract as such, they can, and will be economically pushed to, provide unethical methods to reach their goals. So the problem ultimately leads not to the contractors, who most certainly do good work and save American lives, but to the people who need to define the rules of the game properly.

To take it a step farther, on the one hand having them reduces government accountability to citizens, since it can pay these people to do things the gov't itself cannot or should not do. That certainly is a bad thing. Accountability is important. However I suspect that loophole will be closed soon, since Bush is using it to get around Congress. Additionally (wishful thinking) this may be a step towards empowering the individual again, and resurrecting the rights of citizens to form militias for their own defense and train and equip themselves against times of trouble.

[Fix-it]

what we need is a Battletech-style Mercenary Regulatory Commission.

not that it would work in most 3rd world areas. but it would help make mercs a shade whiter than they currently are.

if you want the scoop on mercs, I would suggest the book "Corporate Warriors" and all the wikipedia articles on "Executive Outcomes", "Triple Canopy", and the revolution in Sierra Leone.

[Mercer]

The most interesting part of the Blackwater company to me is the founder. A billionaire from his father's auto parts company, he went Special Forces (Navy SEAL, I think) and then formed his own mercenary company. If someone put that in a game, we'd call Bullshit so fast it wouldn't even be funny.

I heard an interesting report on Blackwater on NPR not too long ago, by the author of an article on them in the National Review (if memory serves). It said that a lot of SF people have gone to Blackwater because the pay is better (natch), but now Blackwater is facing a lot of competition from what they call "Two men and a laptop" companies which are basically fronts which bid on the jobs and staff up after they get them.

Now that's Shadowrun.

[nezumi]

I hadn't heard about the "two men and a laptop" bidders. The problem with those people is they're likely not going to pay death benefits, so the people they hire are going to be less skilled (skilled people know when to walk away from a job), more poorly equipped, with less medical equipment available, and likely less responsible. It goes back to what I said, unless the contract or law specifies what the company is responsible for, they won't take responsibility for it.

[Kagetenshi]

You really think they'll take responsibility for it if contract or law specifies it?

~J

[nezumi]

Yes, because otherwise they lose the contract. I may be biased, since so much of my day to day work has to do with forming contracts on behalf of the government. I've seen a lot of sloppy contracts put together and, in general, contractors will do the bare minimum to get paid. But all contractors want to get paid, so if they want to stay in business, they make sure they do that bare minimum.

[Wounded Ronin]

The way I see it Blackwater allows the President to put more fighters in Iraq without nearly as much political fallout when they get killed as would apply for the US military.

[Kagetenshi]

[Cthulhudreams]

I honestly think it is faintly absurd that government employees are being protected in hostile environments by private security contractors.

I know that if I was being dispatched to Afghanistan, I'd prefer a military security detail to a private sector one - while it may not be the case for a really high profile client, I'd feel like I had more chance of being part of the team.

Plus the rates private security contractors are being paid is eye watering - it would seem much more effecitve to invest in your own military.

[Emperor Tippy]

[Daddy's Litt...]

This is not just a corporate army Nezumi, that is what may have been reported before. the new element coming out is that they are not bound by local laws. They are not bound by the military code. They are operating in a field free of control. Only if they screw up enough to cause their corporate masters' grief are they in trouble. Smaller events are trickling out now.

[Kagetenshi]

Still not new, see again John Company.

~J

[nezumi]

[Emperor Tippy]

Every mercenary in Iraq right now is completely immune to any prosecution under Iraqi law. Blackwater could walk down the street and shoot everyone they see and it would be legal.

[nezumi]

[Fortune]

[mfb]

the key there is "under Iraq law". i believe the contractors are subject to UCMJ, under which they may be remanded to Iraqi courts--but Iraq doesn't have first claim.

[Emperor Tippy]

http://www.iraqcoalition.org/regulations/2...ith_Annex_A.pdf

When the CPA gave up power to the Iraq government the government never rescinded the order. It's still in effect.

See section 2 in the above link.

And from the last order the CPA gave, the order turning over power and rescinding a bunch of orders, there is this gem.
http://www.iraqcoalition.org/regulations/2..._Directives.pdf

[Emperor Tippy]

[mfb]

[Emperor Tippy]

It doesn't actually do anything. None of the security personnel (such as Blackwater) actually fall under it. They are under the auspices of the State department and don't count as "serving with or accompanying an armed force in the field." The only time Blackwater is subject to the UCMJ is when they are actually on a US military base or embassy.

At least according to a JAG buddy. When a Blackwater guy sodomized a 12 year old Afghanistan boy to death in front of the boys father all they coudl do was get him fired. The Blackwater guy apparently "slipped on the stairs" on the way back though.

Oh and that was about 2 months ago, well after congress changed the UCMJ.

[Moon-Hawk]

[mfb]

you're making it sound like there is no law at all that applies to civilian contractors. while it may be true that many civilian contractors effectively operate outside the law a lot of the time, it's pretty easy to get them into someone's jurisdiction if enough of a stink is made about their actions.