Levitation, Partial lift and lightening the load Options

[ialdabaoth]

Is levitation all or nothing? i.e., can it lighten something before it gains the ability to fully lift it?

For example, is it possible to use a low-force levitation spell on a very heavy object, to lower its weight rather than lift it? I.e., if we're in an 800 ton T-bird that needs to be lightened by 75 kg to make it over the next ridge, and everything that isn't nailed down has already been thrown out, could a Force 3 levitation spell be cast to help keep it aloft despite the blown rear vent?

Likewise, could a Force 2 levitation spell be used to lighten an ork just enough that they could walk on a broken ankle without putting too much pressure on it, like a crutch? Could a Force 1 levitation spell be used to make a boulder, already slipping slightly, JUST light enough that it breaks ground pressure and starts sliding down the hill? Or to provide the tiny extra 'oomph' necessary to help six trolls lift an overturned bus?

[Sphynx]

If you go by 'Canon', then yes, it is an all or nothing, since the 'Sorcery Test' TN rises. However, I'm pretty sure not a single person would play it that much 'by the book'.

Sphynx

[Lilt]

Well: unless your GM allows you to abstract from the spell rules the spell; it's all or nothing. The spell called Magic fingers (just below levitate on page 197) could do what you ask though.

[ialdabaoth]

hrm. But 'magic fingers' is a point-based force; you're pushing on it *from somewhere*. I guess I just want a generic 'lighten' spell, that will make something or someone lighter and easier to lift/keep up. Or just to take some weight off a prissy mage-girl's feet when she's forced to wear high heels...

[Tanka]

So then make the spell using the rules given to you. Probably just a Manipulation spell that magically lowers something's weight as per successes.

[ialdabaoth]

*nods* doing so. I just wanted to make sure it wasn't already covered by Levitation.

[ialdabaoth]

Would 'each success lightens the object by Force %' be completely unprecedented? I.e., a Force 6 Lighten spell with 5 successes would lighten an object by 30%?

[Tanka]

Maybe for each success it either lightens by a percentage or by a flat rate, like so many kg.

[Zazen]

Do you guys think it's reasonable to cast levitate on an object and use that object to move something else?

i.e. I levitate a table, place a teapot on the table, then move the table out to the living room?

If so, you shouldn't have a problem with someone levitating, say, a paint chip or pebble and using it to push something from underneath. With it possible to indirectly lighten via this workaround, I think it's reasonable to let people lighten using the levitation spell alone.

[Tanka]

I think the paint chip idea is a bit out of it... The table not as much because the teapot can rest easily on the table, but something on a paint chip, unless smaller than the paint chip, cannot rest easily. It would just end up falling off.

[Zazen]

It's not supporting it though, just helping. It'd be like having a person applying extra force to some furniture with his finger. It still helps you move the couch.

[moosegod]

I would say avoid this and the issues that come with it. Just make a "Lighten" spell.

[BitBasher]

Well reasonable is really up to your GM, but...

In the first example a resourceful player would just levetate one or two of the passengers then the vehicle would be lighter by the required amount.

In the second example the boulder needs to be heavier, not lighter, if it's lighter there is less ground pressure, and less force so it would likely not go anywahere. If it was heavier it would slide by breaking the ground pressure threshold.

In all honesty I would not let Levitate do this because it has a clearly defined target number, but I would have absolutely no problem with a player making a spell that did this and starting the game with it. This spell has a lot more application that it initially appears, especially with jumping/running/lifting. There would probably be penalty to melee damage as a result of the reduced mass though.

[Tanka]

Yes, but how much help? Probably enough to lighten it by maybe half a kg, if they're of higher than average strength.

[John Campbell]

I'd reevaluate the successes against the new TN in that case. Putting a teapot on a table is unlikely to be a problem, because it probably won't bump the levitated mass over the line into the next TN category. Parking a bus on a paint chip probably isn't going to work, though (and you still have to worry about it falling off, as tanka says)...

[RedmondLarry]

A few times we have used levitate on a rug, a rowboat, or even a broom, and the GM has calculated a 'maximum capacity' using the highest die rolled. The players then pile on runners and gear until the rug/boat/broom barely lifts off. This seemed to us to be a very reasonable and straight-forward way to use the spell.

There are legends of flying carpets and brooms, and a really skillful magician could anchor Levitate on a car and fly to Hogwarts.

[Tanka]

You did not just reference SR to Harry Potter...

Now you need to watch out for the falling clowns. I think they do 18D Stun.

[Ol' Scratch]

Or just create an Ally Spirit with one as those as its forms. :) That's a much better example of the car from Harry Potter (considering it developed an attitude and kicked them out).

[moosegod]

ANd don't forget the 45th level Wizard/ 20th level Fighters!