Alternate Matrix Rules, Everyone is doing it Options

[Jaid]

Ok, I've seen multiple references to Matrix Stealth including SMAs note of sustaining multiple of them. I dont' see a program called Matrix Stealth, though there are a number of programs and Patrons that reference it. Is this simply referring to the Hide ability?

If so, does it take up a program slot to sustain it normally even though it's a skill use rather than a program?

Thanks!

With a sweep of his...

Hat

just found this on page 1:

Datamasking A Technomancer with Datamasking can make Matrix Stealth checks with Resonance + Hacking instead of Intuition or Logic + Hacking if she wants. In addition, any time she makes a Matrix Stealth check she adds her Submersion Grade.

which rather heavily implies it's (intuition OR logic) + hacking.

[FrankTrollman]

Hide and Stealth are terms used interchangeably in this document. Sorry about that.

-Frank

[Hat]

Looking back over things I noticed that in Frank's ruleset Drones operating on their own only get 2 IPs. Was that a misprint or intentional? BBB gives a drone operating on its own 3 IPs.

Thanks!

With a sweep of his...

Hat

[FrankTrollman]

Looking back over things I noticed that in Frank's ruleset Drones operating on their own only get 2 IPs. Was that a misprint or intentional? BBB gives a drone operating on its own 3 IPs.

That is quite deliberate. It puts drones in on the level of materialized/possessed spirits rather than the level of Astral spirits. I did this because I found that a drone army operating on autopilot control was far too powerful under basic rules. It really isn't even that expensive to get a drone a 10 or 12 die attack pool, and if they are acting 3 times a round with it, it gets ugly real fast.

Independent drones are much weaker under these rules because they have less IP and they have to take a target acquisition action (something which is avoidable in basic rules). But since you are still rolling around with like 5 crawlers with guns, the drone rigger is still the largest pile of firepower that a player character can rationally aspire to. A straight Street Sam just has a fighting chance now.

-Frank

[JoelHalpern]

Some additional minor questions, having tried to go through the whole rule set together.

1) It looks like Submerged Technomancer deliberately have the ability by great form sprites to easily create level 4 fake SINs? (A reasonable Technomancer who has managed to get two submersions and Resonance 8 should easily be able to register a great form rating 4 Sprite. And thus great a veracity 4 truth.)
2) Similarly, submerged technomancer would seem not to have any money troubles. This seems a quite resonable power, given that all the money is in the matrix in practice anyway. But does it affect play balance? (A friendly Technomancer as part of an advanced team can rather markedly increase the team income.) I realize that if I assume, as seems reasonable, the rest of Frank's rules that there is plenty of room for BP based character advancement even if money is no longer an issue. But the game effect seems likely to still be noticeable.
3) I believe by the wording an upgraded car could be given some programs for use by its firewall, without needing to add IC? (For when the owner / rigger / ... is not networked with the car.)
4) It looks like for many purposes a signal booster sitting on the desk next to a Technomancer would make up for most issues caused by having relatively low signal. THere would still be the limit on the number of registered Sprites from low charisma. Are there other issues?
5) Does threading have drain? Does it have the -2 dice-pool sustaining cost? I did not see either item in the rules. I would have expected at least the later, based on the parallel with sustained spells.
6) When does a person take a Matrix stealth roll, and does it need a program? The roll appears to be Intuition + Hacking (although in the Datamasking text it refers to Resonance + Hacking replacing Logic+Hacking, I presume that is a typo.) DOes a hacker take their Hide roll once, and then just use that from then on for their activities?
7) The Resonance skill based actions of compiling, threading, registering, reregistering, unravel, remove task, and rend Icon do not themselves require complex forms, although those skills also do have custom complex forms to do other interesting things?
8 ) There is reference in the sprite section to Pilot Complex Forms. Normally, Pilot programs are specific to a given device / drone / vehicle. Is the Pilot CF also specific to the vehicle, needing a different one for each vehicle? (Presumably, whatever applies to pilot applies to pilot auxiliary programs as well?)

Thank you,
Joel Halpern

[Sma]

1) It looks like Submerged Technomancer deliberately have the ability by great form sprites to easily create level 4 fake SINs? (A reasonable Technomancer who has managed to get two submersions and Resonance 8 should easily be able to register a great form rating 4 Sprite. And thus great a veracity 4 truth.)?
2) Similarly, submerged technomancer would seem not to have any money troubles. This seems a quite resonable power, given that all the money is in the matrix in practice anyway. But does it affect play balance? (A friendly Technomancer as part of an advanced team can rather markedly increase the team income.) I realize that if I assume, as seems reasonable, the rest of Frank's rules that there is plenty of room for BP based character advancement even if money is no longer an issue. But the game effect seems likely to still be noticeable.

In our game we allowed the easy creation of Fake SIN's, but since we treat SIN's as throwaway items the impact of getting them comparatively cheap has not been noticeable. And while the Wealth power of Great Form Sprites allows for stuff worth a lot to be delivered to a enterprising Technomancer, it usually comes in a from not easily abused. I.e. a week of holidays in a luxury resort, a truck full of mayonnaise or lifetime membership in a golf club. All things that might be turned to cash at a loss, but give the Technomancer in question a nice chance to roleplay or for the whole tema to hit the casinos Oceans 13 style, while already having someone inside.

In a more cashtight game or one treating SIN's differently I would simply disallow these uses.

4) It looks like for many purposes a signal booster sitting on the desk next to a Technomancer would make up for most issues caused by having relatively low signal. THere would still be the limit on the number of registered Sprites from low charisma. Are there other issues?

Yes technomancers are able to get around low signal stemming from bad charisma by dropping a minor amount of cash and getting the same benefits as any other character. Though since they are summoners at heart, dumping charisma is not recommended.

6) When does a person take a Matrix stealth roll, and does it need a program? The roll appears to be Intuition + Hacking (although in the Datamasking text it refers to Resonance + Hacking replacing Logic+Hacking, I presume that is a typo.) Does a hacker take their Hide roll once, and then just use that from then on for their activities?

There is no program for a Matrix Stealth roll and it uses Intuition + Hacking. I require a Hide roll whenever a character wants to go "invisible" in the Matrix be it though literally becoming invisible or simply hiding as a innocuous icon. This roll sets the Threshold until the situation changes (switching nodes, launching possibly noticeable programs etc.).

7) The Resonance skill based actions of compiling, threading, registering, reregistering, unravel, remove task, and rend Icon do not themselves require complex forms, although those skills also do have custom complex forms to do other interesting things?

Yes, Technomancers are still playing catchup with a mundane hacker if they don't want to go the summoner route, due to the amount of programs required to accomplish most things expected of a decker.

8 ) There is reference in the sprite section to Pilot Complex Forms. Normally, Pilot programs are specific to a given device / drone / vehicle. Is the Pilot CF also specific to the vehicle, needing a different one for each vehicle? (Presumably, whatever applies to pilot applies to pilot auxiliary programs as well?)

Yes the Pilot CF and auxiliary CF's are just as device specific as their programs counterparts.

[JoelHalpern]

Thanks for the answers.
A couple of followup questions.
First, in talking about the wealth power, you say:

... And while the Wealth power of Great Form Sprites allows for stuff worth a lot to be delivered to a enterprising Technomancer, it usually comes in a from not easily abused. I.e. a week of holidays in a luxury resort, a truck full of mayonnaise or lifetime membership in a golf club. All things that might be turned to cash at a loss, but give the Technomancer in question a nice chance to roleplay or for the whole tema to hit the casinos Oceans 13 style, while already having someone inside.

While reasonable, I wonder how you got to this interpretation. The rule says:

]b]Wealth[/b]
With the expenditure of a Task, bank accounts increase, catalog orders are made and paid for, and invoices are lost. Over the course of the next week the target's real wealth is increased by 10,000¥ per hit on a System + Charisma test.

which specifically says that the wealth increases by 10,000Y per hit (on a system + charisma test, or about 2/3 the force of the spirit.)

I presume you didn't comment on the uestion (3) about running programs without IC because it has not come up in your game?

And on question (5) about whether treating causes fading? I can't imagine you don't use threading. That is just too useful.

I did think of one further Sprite question. The Inate Form power for sprites says that it can be any form kinown to the technomancer calling up the sprite. Does that include a complex form that the technomancer has threaded up from scratch, or only ones he knows permanently? (It seems, for balance, that it ought to be only permanently known complex forms, but if the sprite is going to work in the same node the technomancer is in, the wording would seem to allow such threaded forms to be used.)

Thank you,
Joel

[FrankTrollman]

One thing to note: each Technomantic song (tradition) only gets one Greatform power to throw around. If your campaign won't survive characters being able to pick up a couple million a year (much or all of which will go into a Luxury Lifestyle), then just force them to choose a song that gives them a different power.

-Frank

[JoelHalpern]

One thing to note: each Technomantic song (tradition) only gets one Greatform power to throw around. If your campaign won't survive characters being able to pick up a couple million a year (much or all of which will go into a Luxury Lifestyle), then just force them to choose a song that gives them a different power.

-Frank

Thanks Frank. That is an interesting and useful restriction. I had assumed that, like the magic rules, each Sprite type (a tradition having 5) could have a different Greatform power. With only one power, the GM and Technomancer will have to agree on one.

Joel

[xsansara]

I just stumbled over your house rules while searching for reviews for Unwired and all I can say is that I wished I found this thread a year ago. Good Work.

I actually had the same idea of brain hacking while compiling the house rules for my group, but have never dully fleshed the idea out as you have.

But I would like to make a suggestion from my house rules. I hope you like it.

In our group we found it very frustrating to be expecting a hacking attack (or knowing about one) and not being able to actively do something about it, especially when you are a "clean" computer user, like a scientist or a reporter (yes, we do have characters like that). The action might be like trying to restart Firewall operations if your PAN is attacked or humming Mary had a little lamb, when being brainattacked. Game-mechanics-wise it should be tied to the Computer (that's how we do it) or Electronic Warfare Skill. This makes random Spam attacks more of a nuisance for those people, but not a real thread.

Sorry if something like that has already been mentioned, but haven't read every post in this (long) thread.

[RunnerPaul]

But I would like to make a suggestion from my house rules. I hope you like it.

Frank's got a different thread where he's solicititing suggestions for where to go from here with his houserules. You may want to post this there too.

[FrankTrollman]

In our group we found it very frustrating to be expecting a hacking attack (or knowing about one) and not being able to actively do something about it, especially when you are a "clean" computer user, like a scientist or a reporter (yes, we do have characters like that). The action might be like trying to restart Firewall operations if your PAN is attacked or humming Mary had a little lamb, when being brainattacked. Game-mechanics-wise it should be tied to the Computer (that's how we do it) or Electronic Warfare Skill. This makes random Spam attacks more of a nuisance for those people, but not a real thread.

I've got the idea of Signal Defense, which protects people from signal interference. Since Arsenal came out, I can very easily imagine that some 21st century martial arts would have techniques to rid the nervous system of external electronic influence.

-Frank

[Cthulhudreams]

Yeah, EW gives you counterspelling. Your other option is to buy a crash program - it works at range connection so you can get your firewall to use it so it can defend you when someone connects to you. As far as I can see anyway.

[Sma]

Also Terminate Connection usually has a not too bad chance of kicking any intruder out.

[xsansara]

Also Terminate Connection usually has a not too bad chance of kicking any intruder out.

Oops I missed that, seems like I should have a closer look at the spell, sorry program list (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Thanks for all the answers. Is there a public play test somewhere to get a feeling for how the rules interact in real situations?

[Sma]

There is a new writeup in the making that will include examples. Some examples also can be found here.

[xsansara]

Back with some more feedback, read through the whole thing this time (well up to sprites) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

* I really like that you got rid of all those extended tests (which I hate). Exception is veracity checking, but that's okay, since its kind of like a race
* Fading seems kind of inconsistent,
1. when compiling or decompiling sprites Fading is increased + 1/2 sprite rating (compared to Mage/Spirit rules)
I assume the +1/2 sprite rating is a house rule and applies to Mages as well, but
2. when registering the hits are not doubled,
making it as cheap as compiling (why should I not do always then?) Typo?
3. Threading does not cause Fading,
how come you removed that? It seems logical to pay some prize for doing something better than normal. Especially, since you can use learned complex forms at will with no Fading, unlike spells.
4. Rend Icon does not cause Fading
Which makes it about as good as Crash (potentially better for starting elves), with no costs. I suggest Charisma/2 (downgradable with less damage)
5. Unravel causes Fading equal to " the number of hits on the highest original instruction set of the device"
This is a very unusual mechanic and would require a lot of bookkeeping, if properly enforced. Making it an attack-like ability against Firewall (+ Pilot? or Armor?) which deletes a random instruction if successful, would be much simpler gameplay, methinks. And is not overpowered compared to the Programs. Also you might consider adding LOS to the range. Back to Fading: using Enemy hits would be a nice tag along the compiling theme or give it a pseudo PR to stay in line with the programs; overall I like the effect and its making Decompiling a useful skill (with Rend Icon)
* I also really liked the "automatic" programs and cf you get, it is really frustrating to be dependant on programs (or worse cfs) for standard actions any decent OS should deliver free-house
* Minor note: You might want to add the role System plays in soaking D Damage in the System description
* Spam areas effecting TMs negatively seems out of flavor. Places like the Tokyo electronic district Akihabara brim with aggressive advertisement, I have some trouble believing that a TM would feel uncomfortable there. Maybe, it should be treated like correctly Aspected, positive Background count and allow bonus dice to Matrix activities, if appropriate.
* I would like to ask for some clarification concerning Forge Credentials, especially: what are the counterrolls (Firewall + Signal Defense or Device Rating for Scanners?); is it only for licences or can I forge a generic SIN for an identity check, if I assume the SIN should not be permanent;
* I am still not clear, when Matrix Stealth checks/re-checks are appropriate. I assume, whenever a target is interacted with in a non-beneficial way (e.g. by an analysis program). But then a Find Mind would trigger a lot of alarm, so maybe that's only appropriate for paranoid Hackers and too much slowing down the game speed. Still, I do not like being Backtracked by a Noob Hacker without the chance to notice it. But then, if he were such a Noob, he couldn't hide from me in the first place and I would notice it automatically. So Analysis on unassuming targets is okay, as long as it didn't see me the first time. Find Mind in a situation with many people in which a Find Mind is common (eg. a stadion) would be shrugged of, while it might blow your cover in a lone hide-and-seek-scenario with a TM.
* Hack an the fly has a weird speed. I usually do not keep track of free actions in an IP when I GM. Free Actions are for stuff that can be multitasked easily or is very fast and thus one, two or three of them that do not logically overlap (like talking twice) are usually okay by me. That aside, as an IT professional I can assure you that programming is neither mulitasked easily nor particularly fast. In fact, you need to concentrate very much, in order to "quick-program" anything with any hope of success. I can however verify that these attempts are better of deleted, even if they worked. I do not see how this would have changed within your paradigm. You still have to visualise very precisely what you want and how that can be achieved methodically, the rest is picked out from your brain, at least that reduces the amount of typos (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The alternative would be to download a "free" program, which is adaquate for the task, but that is explicitly forbidden by your paradigm, as it would involve adjustment to the brain.
* Decrypt/Encrypt (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) How about that:
1. High-density transmission can be decrypted in real time, but require some time for adjustment. Roll Logic + Electronic Warfare in an extended roll (variable, 1 IP). The threshold is the original hits from the Encrypt, which may only be rerolled, if the Encrypter constantly and actively reuses Encrypt (Taking the CA (at least) every time the Decrypter succeeds and before he starts reading the transmission). Once the Decrypter wins, he can decrypt everything sent, until the connection is closed.
2. Low-density transmissions can be decrypted once enough data has been accumulated. When the GM decides that enough data is accumulated, it can be Decrypted by using a Complex action against the hits that were scored on the Encrypt. This roll is not repeatable.
3. Data can be Encrypted, similar to the use of a Data Bomb. The base time for Decrypting said data is Encrypt rating x (hits on the Encrypters rolled) / (hits the Decrypter rolled) in hours. The GM may increase the base time up to infinity when dealing with small amounts of data. Note that any data that is read or used by anyone is considered a transmission.
* Master Control: I don't see anyone buying this program as it's use is too situational, yet, it's a very nice way to resolve the problem without too many dice rolls. Why not make it a standard schtick of Hacking, along the lines of Forge Credentials. (That is not supposed to work on Humans, is it? It does have a D. )
* Did I miss anything or is the actual Exploit missing from the Exploit program list? How do I force a connection on a node, without knowing someone that node knows? Taxman? I thought that only gives me data but not a connection.
* Terminate Connection; I guess instead of "The user rolls Logic + Operations... " it should be "The user rolls Logic + Computer " Operations not having a rating and all.
* Registry Dump is a really nice idea, but poses the problem of bookkeeping all hits of all programs. Besides you might want to except Encrypt and Data Bomb or specifically mention that you can use it for that purpose.
* Reset is another one of those... Maybe you have to set a reset point first and only icons, connections and data still on the node are affected.
* Again my congratulations for making TMs really special with their compiling and decompiling cfs without nerfing Hackers too much or vice versa. Consider everything not mentioned as appreciated very much.

I hope you find my criticism constructive, if not, ignore the part you don't like. It was meant as a suggestion or was a mistake due to a misunderstanding on my side.

Sorry to everyone for the wall of text it started out quite innocently as a few paper scribblings (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

[ornot]

Whew! Finally read this whole thread. I only found it a week or so ago, and since then I've been busy.

I don't quite get the range thing. Can someone post some kind of summary/list of the ranges, and what they mean. I keep seeing connection, handshake and signal range, but I don't know how they relate to each other.

Re: Brainhacking. Love it.

I would say this; I think connecting an orphan brain from any kind of distance should require some special expensive highly forbidden piece of kit. Personally I'd consider it to be a tech banned by the Corporate Court, at least openly, who I presume want to be seen as a benevolent force, rather than Big Brother complete with Thought Police. I rather like the idea of planes flying over non-tech peoples beaming mind control rays at them, a 2070 version of dropping propaganda leaflets on enemy troops (eg. Aztlan in the Yucatan), providing they can avoid CC oversight.

[Cthulhudreams]

Okay, basically you missed a range (Matrix) and they breakd won like this

Signal: This means that you are within the 'signal' range of my transmitter, which ranges from 'really close' to '10,000 kms' There is a table in the equipment section that details transmission distances and costs for various signal ratings

Note: Signal usually has the (LOS) tag - which means line of sight. Exactly like a spell, I have to be able to see you Unlike a spell, I can use electronic targeting googles and shit to do that, but I still need to trace a line to you.

Handshake: Handshake range is, I am in Signal range of you, and you are in signal range of me. If both are true we are at 'handshake' range (because we can both send signals to each other'

Connection: When two devices are in 'handshake' range, they can establish a connection with each other.

Matrix: You are both within handshake range of a matrix node.

[HentaiZonga]

Unfortunately Frank, a radio frequency in the megahertz range or in all of the radio frequency range, have no effect upon the human brain. EEG waveforms are not in the radio frequency range at all. What mean no effect I mean produces any mental effects besides microwaving brain tissues.

Actually, setting up multiple megahertz signals with slightly different frequencies, phase shifts, and points of origin can cause beat frequencies at whatever frequency, amplitude and phase you want at pinpoint-accuracy, if you have enough processing power to figure out how to adjust for all the local interference.