Full Bursts / Multiple Targets Options

[Prime Mover]

How is everyone doing this. One short and one long burst against two targets or three short against three targets. Are you making your players roll two or three separate times or using one roll with modifiers for each burst?

[Irian]

A short burst also takes a simple action (afaik), so can't shot 3 of them in a phase. For two targets, simple add recoil and +2 for the new target.

[Eryk the Red]

He's talking about Full bursts, which can be fired at up to 3 targets. I have them roll once, with the Full Burst recoil penalty, and each target defends against the result.

[Irian]

As the extra targets modify the pool, rolling once seems a little bit less apropriate. So I personally would roll three times. As I don't understand how "long burst" vs. two targets works (I don't find anything in the rules), I would use 3 short bursts.

[Moon-Hawk]

I roll them separately. Modifiers will be different for each, so it's the only way that isn't absurdly complex. (and I'm pretty sure it's the right way, too) They use a complex action and get three rolls; I really don't see the problem.
Let's see if I can find help in the book...........
Here:

[Starmage21]

related question

All other instances of bursts mention a -2 penalty for firing at additional targets, but the full auto burst does not. Does that mean if youre firing in a full-auto burst attacking multiple targets penalty does not apply?

[Moon-Hawk]

[Eryk the Red]

I prefer making one roll, simply for speed of resolution and because it reinforces the idea that it's one shot, one spray of bullets at multiple targets, rather than three separate shots. They get the -2 for multiple targets, as normal. (That's a standard shooting modifier.) It's never gotten "absurdly complex" in practice. It keeps things moving. So far, so good.

The rules are unclear about whether you make one or multiple rolls. I lean toward the one that doesn't contribute to the game's already very slow combat resolution. Personal priorities.

[Prime Mover]

Keep seeing reference above to a -2 mod to burst fire for targeting second target...this is were it gets confusing. Separate bursts at separate targets are two attacks and hence the mod. Full auto burst is once attack just sprayed through multiple targets, treated as bursts due to the fact theres more then one target in the sprayed area, not due to any second or third new aim and fire issues.

And for our games I've been treating it as single roll, just using burst rules given for determining final damage code. Keeps combat from dragging.

[malichai]

How are folks handling this now? Has SR4a clarified how full auto against multiple targets works?

[Marwynn]

p 154, SR4A. Multiple Targets (Full Burst): Full bursts may be made against more than one target as long as they are within one meter of each other, but in that case treat it as separate burst fire attacks against each target (one short and one long against two targets, or three short against three targets).

p 154, SR4A. Multiple Targets (Short Bursts): Bursts can only be fired at one target for each burst. If a burst-firing attacker engages two different targets in the same Action Phase (either with two separate short bursts or one short burst and one long burst), there is an additional –2 dice pool modifier when attacking the second target.


So that means treat is as 1 Long, 1 Short, or 3 Short bursts, with a -2 mod as normal.

[Falconer]

But on the flipside, unlike normal attacking w/ 2 weapons. Nowhere in there does it say to split the pool.

I believe the proper way to handle it is roll your full pool for each target attacked. But don't forget to put a -2, or -4 multitarget penalty mod as well as individual visibility mods (depending on if you attack 2 or 3 targets, and if each one is standing in different lighting... unlikely but possible).

Considering it's a complex action in it's own right, competing against 2 simple actions each at full pool... it's definately well inside the power curve.