 Need information on Yomi, You know..Japanese Prison for Metas |
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 Jan 6 2008, 09:16 AM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 992 Joined: 2-August 06 Member No.: 9,006  |
OK, well my GM and I are getting ready for a new game to celebrate the release of Corporate Enclaves, and neither of us have anything other then the brief mention of Yomi in the Year of the Comet.
Since my GM is planning on the game being set in Neo-Tokyo, one big question has come up: When was a Meta sent to Yomi? Was it over a certain age? At birth? If they failed to keep their heads down? Can you have a meta over 6 years old who was born in Japan and not have been sent to Yomi? Or is it an automatic that if you were alive and in Japan during the time that the Japanese were sending Metas to Hell, that you were sent, no ifs, ands or buts about it? If a character DID go to Yomi, what skills/attributes would be recommended? (Note: My GM avoids here like the plague because of how everyone wants to house rule everything..something about "Official Sites should not have House Rules", so, please keep the compunction to change the game out of this. The site my GM uses, which is for a Shadowrun MU* in the process of converting to 4th Edition, seems to have frustrated her because they don't answer the questions asked on this. They said the processes started in 2021 or 2022.) |
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Jan 6 2008, 10:57 AM
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#2
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Great, I'm a Dragon... Group: Retired Admins Posts: 6,699 Joined: 8-October 03 From: North Germany Member No.: 5,698 |
You do know that Yomi has changed a lot in Shadows of Asia? It's no longer a prison island, but ruled by the inhabitants iirc.
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Jan 6 2008, 11:20 AM
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#3
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,311 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Calgary, Alberta Member No.: 2,062 |
This is not an official site. It is (iirc) owned/operated by Neuron Basher out of pocket and the kindness of his own heart.
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Jan 6 2008, 12:05 PM
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#4
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,314 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lisbon, Cidade do Pecado Member No.: 185 |
As Large Mike has correctly pointed out, while Dumpshock is the premiere English language Shadowrun portal/forum and several of the authors and devs (myself included) hang around here it is not an official site.
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Jan 6 2008, 12:39 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 992 Joined: 2-August 06 Member No.: 9,006 |
ghouls, Vampires, and Wendigo? Yeah...real vacation spot(that is what is stated in Corporate Enclaves PDF as all that was left on the island). So, basicly, Yomi was never a prison island? Despite a more recent source then Shadows of Asia saying it was? Or is it just that no-body knows the answers to the questions I asked because they are not rules related? The information I have from the references in Corporate Enclaves(including a side bar of someone describing life there!) was that it was a bad place, where if you got cut, you gave serious thought to whether it would be better to be infected with HMMVV or die of the imminent infection, since there was no medical support given there. Now, that does not sound right to me...especially when it is considered that moving to the Yokohama Ward was only trading one Hell for another, just one with a semblence of freedom. So, basicly, though, since there are no canon answers, my GM should either abandon running a game in Neotokyo, because some of the players want to play metahumans, or say that all Metahumans have to be 6 years old, or from another country? Oh, and as for the people who say this is not an official website, allow me to point out 1)Dumpshock is run by Adam Jury, the same guy who runs Catalyst's main page and the shadowrun webpage, 2) is where the line developer himself refers people to discuss the game in the same capacity as the official CBT forums. While it may not have Catalyst and Wizkids stamp on it, this is where the people in charge tell us to go, and, you know, Developers and Writers for other catalyst products don't post on unofficial forums(never seen a post from Randall or Herb on Sarna.net or Solaris7.com), so this *is* an official forum. If it walks alike a duck, talks like a duck...(If it is maintained by TPTB, is where TPTB speak, and is where TPTB tell us to go, then it is the defacto official site) |
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Jan 6 2008, 12:56 PM
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#6
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Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
Well I'd say that if developers or representatives of a company tell you that something isn't an official site, that's a pretty unshakeable argument that it isn't. And aside from which, whilst the developers are accorded huge respect on these boards (stop laughing, you lot! ) when you ask a question on Dumpshock you are in no way entitled to expect the responses to represent official rulings. I'm not a developer, but I imagine they don't particularly want every comment they make here to be regarded as an official proclamation. All that said, I first recall reading about Yomi in the SR fiction line in Choose Your Enemies Carefully by Robert N Charrette, second volume in the Secrets of Power trilogy. I don't have it to hand, but it seemed that anyone who goblinised was shipped off to Yomi which was briefly described as a lawless barrens, where ghouls ran riot. I can't be certain, but am pretty certain that the metas shipped there wasn't just the goblinised, but included elves at least. You can find more information on it in the Sixth World Wiki here (that may or may not be sufficiently "official" for you). It says that there's information available in Cyberpirates. Hope this helps, -Khadim. EDIT: Fixed link as Ryu pointed out. |
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Jan 6 2008, 01:21 PM
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#7
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
What Knasser said. DS is close to an official forum by the quality of its membership alone (YOU WERE TOLD TO STOP LAUGHING!).
Repaired Link: here But anyways. Grinder told you that Yomi was a prison island, not that it wasn´t. If you want older Japanese metahumans without Yomi experience, you have -returned expatriates --who have fled the country --who were protected by the megas because they were valuable -SINless --hidden by their families/friends --hidden in lawless areas of town -SINners --hidden by their families/friends --hidden in plain sight (Human looking advantage, magic) |
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Jan 6 2008, 02:23 PM
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#8
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 992 Joined: 2-August 06 Member No.: 9,006 |
My understanding of what Grinder said was: When he said alot was changed in SHadows of Asia(remembering that there was always precious little devoted TO Asia before then), and that it was no longer a Prison Island(without providing an answer to any of my questions) was that Shadows of Asia was a Retcon that had been Retconned by Corporate Enclaves.(After all..this is FASA/FanPro/Catalyst..things that were accepted for a long time tend to get changed out of the blue sometimes) Admittedly, I do find it hard to see how the Japanese could justify sending INFANTS to a prison island(as Elves and Dwarves, as I have always understood it, were born elves and dwarves originally, while Orks and Trolls Goblinized). But, OK..so things my GM and I should tell players is that if they want to play a Meta, they need to either explain how they stayed out of Yomi, or they need to have decent combat and outdoors skills to represent that they spent all but the last 6 years in a place where they were being hunted by rape gangs, ghouls, vampires, Wendigo(the mention of the laser fence to keep the Wendigo in), hardened criminals, corps wanting to grab them for experimentation, and guards just wanting to have some fun, right? As much as my GM and I loathe houserules, I could almost see making Human Looking 5 points more in Neo-Tokyo, just because it is so..useful. |
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Jan 6 2008, 03:29 PM
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#9
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Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
Shadowrun almost never retconns anything. Perhaps minor tweaks on the height of trolls, but usually the designers go to enormous lengths to preserve continuity or justify something that a previous mad developer did in a fit of "creativity" as something that actually makes sense. ;) A revolutionary group called the HUK overthrew the Japanese control of Yomi, freeing the inhabitants, with the aid of the Great Dragon Masaru. Unless someone has something more recent, then I presume they're still in control. Anyway, everything Ryu said. -K. |
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Jan 6 2008, 05:56 PM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 858 Joined: 25-August 03 From: Braunschweig, North German League, Allied German States Member No.: 5,537 |
Nope, it wasn't retcon. Yomi used to be a metahuman prison island before it was liberated by the Huk rebels and the Emperor abolished the anti-metahuman laws (detailed in "Shadows of Asia").
The point is that to the Japanese metahumans were not human! They were something unnatural, lesser even than animals. Hence no qualms about sending these creatures to some giant concentration camp. At least removing them from sight would take a bit of the shame from the poor parents who gave birth to such a monstrosity... |
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Jan 6 2008, 06:50 PM
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#11
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 |
There is reference to Yomi in Corporate Enclaves, but keep in mind it'll be the Japanese perspective on things.
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Jan 6 2008, 06:58 PM
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#12
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,078 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 67 |
The simple answer is yes. You just need to have an explanation for what they were doing, and it can't be that they were just living a casual life strolling down the streets of Tokyo whistling a happy tune. As has been mentioned, they could have had someone protecting them, shielding them from the public. Perhaps out of compassion or perhaps out of shame. Maybe they left Japan and are just now returning, following the Emperor's promises to change the nation (and learning that it's not quite that easy). Or maybe they joined other metahumans and fled to the tunnels underneath Tokyo, forming inclusive communities that hid from the Japanese government (see the Sub-Tokyo entry in Corporate Enclaves). |
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Jan 6 2008, 09:36 PM
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#13
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
On a positive note, in a setting like this the points value of "Human looking" should indeed be higher! Like the points cost adjustment for allergies (common/uncommon), and quality costs for hackers/non-hackers.
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Jan 6 2008, 09:43 PM
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#14
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,883 Joined: 16-December 06 Member No.: 10,386 |
That's only really a positive note if you're a GM that gets their rocks off by raising the point cost on things. In which case I pity them and their players. Considering the high social penalty for being "outed" if anything I'd consider lowering the cost.
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Jan 6 2008, 09:51 PM
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#15
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
Hmm. After everyone was satisfied with 400BP, I simply gave them another 50BP. They would not object. I would generally weaken several negative qualities, from the same fairness POV. Human-looking is already a very common quality for our Seattle-based group. I did not want to come across as limiting GM. I´m quite the opposite.
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Jan 7 2008, 12:09 AM
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#16
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Street Doc Group: Admin Posts: 3,508 Joined: 2-March 04 From: Neverwhere Member No.: 6,114 |
It seems like you have an unusual perspective on the relationship between the people that write the game and the people that play it. Shadowrun has had a long and tumultuous history of changing hands from one company to the next, and most of the people who originally wrote the story have long since moved on to other things. The point here is that the freelancers (note the use of that term) are just long time players like you and me that have taken up the cause to ensure that the game lives on. They do a great deal of work, and the time they spend around here is just a bonus for the rest of us. We should all be thankful to have such unprecedented access to them. But it is a privilege, not a right. |
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Jan 7 2008, 12:23 AM
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#17
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,883 Joined: 16-December 06 Member No.: 10,386 |
Yeah, I should have phrased things better anyway, Ryu; in hindsight my tone was a touch needlessly confrontational. I guess the "problem" is my (ever so slight) beef with the Neo-Tokyo setting in general; at a fundamental design level, it's neither an inclusive setting nor one that is easy to reconcile many character backgrounds with. It's a well done setting, just not one that I'm in a position to take advantage of with any of my current groups, which makes me kind of grumpy anytime I think I see anything that looks like it may make life even trickier for a player in a Neo-Tokyo setting simply because they're curious about trying an ork for a change. So I apologize; any testiness wasn't purposely aimed at you.
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Jan 7 2008, 12:52 AM
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#18
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
No problem, I just wanted to put it my opinion into perspective. Unfortunatly I do not have the chance to read Corp Enclaves so far. There is not even a german publisher as far as we know...
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Jan 7 2008, 01:04 AM
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#19
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 992 Joined: 2-August 06 Member No.: 9,006 |
Welcome to the American side of things...You germans got so many sourcebooks that we never got...with information that we only get peripherally, that it is kind of sad. I would have loved reading about the fight between Lofwyr and that other Great...but, that was for Germans only. :( Maybe when Holostreets emerges oneday(My current bet: december 24, 2012, if we are REALLY lucky), we Americans will see the English Translations of the german sourcebooks. Of course, you could always do what I did: go to the Battleshop, and buy the PDF. It is not quite as nice having it in dead tree, but...it is a way to get it before I have to spend 2-3 weeks for my FLGS to get it in after I have to special order the dead-tree version. |
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Jan 7 2008, 01:10 AM
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#20
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,883 Joined: 16-December 06 Member No.: 10,386 |
CE is alright, although it's hard for me to be too enthusiastic about it simply because I have never in my life given a crap about what happens to LA or been remotely curious as to what goes on there, IRL or in Shadowrun. I would have much preferred Vladivostok or expanded information on Dubai and Tenochtitlan (yeah, I know the Azzies have been covered a lot; I don't care :D). I want to know more about how the Russians are coping with China's ongoing fracturing and how EVO and Buttercup operate, but that will have to wait for further books, I suppose. I too suffer greatly from Germany envy when it comes to the number of sourcebooks there are out there.
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Jan 7 2008, 12:45 PM
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#21
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Great, I'm a Dragon... Group: Retired Admins Posts: 6,699 Joined: 8-October 03 From: North Germany Member No.: 5,698 |
I didn't have problems to find Corp Enclave in several webshops. |
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Jan 7 2008, 12:47 PM
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#22
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Great, I'm a Dragon... Group: Retired Admins Posts: 6,699 Joined: 8-October 03 From: North Germany Member No.: 5,698 |
Exactly. For the record: I didn't know that there was reference to Yomi in Corp Enclaves, 'cause I haven't read the book thus far. I'm sorry for the confusion I caused with my first post. |
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Jan 7 2008, 01:31 PM
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#23
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
You might know that buying the english dead-tree version in Hannover should not really be a problem either (Fantasy Inn at Aegidientorplatz has english products in stock). My basic problem is that the rather low priority of german SR products CGL demonstrates will only increase with the number of german books sold (sound business decisions assumed).
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Jan 7 2008, 06:31 PM
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#24
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 573 Joined: 17-September 07 Member No.: 13,319 |
I don't know Japanese culture all that well, but I can readily imagine attitudes about metas such that if a pregnant woman goes to a hospital in Neo-Tokyo to give birth, and the child is elf or dwarf, the doctors tell her that the child is "deformed" and they're very sorry but they have to take it away for "special treatment" and she should not expect to see it again... or they just say "stillborn" if she didn't hear anything showing that the birth was live.
They could then treat the infant as if it were stillborn. Nursing and caring for a newborn takes a lot of effort; why bother, if you don't consider it human? Did the JIS built a pediatric medical facility on Yomi to make sure all the "little monsters" got immunizations and checkups? This is grim, gritty stuff here, and I imagine it along the lines of the worst that humanity has shown in our real history. When there is hope, it's the kind of hope by which Anne Frank managed not to give up on humanity while she was in hiding. (What she thought after she was captured, is not recorded in her diary.) |
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Jan 7 2008, 09:50 PM
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#25
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 830 Joined: 3-April 04 From: Columbus, Ohio Member No.: 6,215 |
Another thing to keep in mind about the age of people going into Yomi is that not every metahuman is born a metahuman. Orcs and Trolls goblinize. And I'm not entirely sure, but I think the book says it usually happens around puberty. Puberty itself is a variable age, and if it can happen after puberty, then goblinization can occur relatively late in life (maybe late teens or early twenties, even?). I mean, I'm not sure of this, not being a--well, whatever word they come up with to mean "doctor that specializes in metahumanity"--cryptogeneticist? Whatever, I'm not one. But neither is anybody you're ever going to meet. Ever. So it is well within the bounds of your GM to okay someone's backstory of "I was a human until last week!" If the GM wants, that is.
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