Arsenal Qs, and typos, if you find any Options

[Elve]

Another question came up yesterday on a German board: Discussing the question, wether you could choose to still inflict stun damage with bone density augmentation/bone lacing. From my point of view this is just an issue of not hitting so freakin' hard but then Rotbart hinted at the description of the Sai (p. 39) which states explicitly that the special thing about this weapon's specialty is that one may choose which damage track he wants to fill.
He derived from that description that you generally can't choose to do stun damage in melee combat by RAW, even though common sense suggests that at least in unarmed combat or with blunt weapons you could aim to knock your opponent out rather than kill him.
Since I didn't come across any other passages concerning this in the rules, this case is rather unclear to me now.

I always ruled it as impossible, which lead to runners using boxing gloves...

[Dashifen]

Some more errors I ran into, to whom it may concern:

1. There are no statistics (in the tables or in the modification descriptions) for an Amenities vehicle mod at the Low-lifestyle level. However, these are referenced in the description of the Hughes Aerospace Emblem (the shuttle helicopter).
2. The Black Mariah has a "Closed Circuit System" modification which isn't in the tables or in the modifications list.
3. The Mimic modification is not in any of the tables that I could find which means we don't know how many slots it takes up, etc.

[Fortune]

Another question came up yesterday on a German board: Discussing the question, wether you could choose to still inflict stun damage with bone density augmentation/bone lacing. From my point of view this is just an issue of not hitting so freakin' hard but then Rotbart hinted at the description of the Sai (p. 39) which states explicitly that the special thing about this weapon's specialty is that one may choose which damage track he wants to fill.
He derived from that description that you generally can't choose to do stun damage in melee combat by RAW, even though common sense suggests that at least in unarmed combat or with blunt weapons you could aim to knock your opponent out rather than kill him.
Since I didn't come across any other passages concerning this in the rules, this case is rather unclear to me now.

There was a rule in previous editions whereby a character could choose to do Stun damage by taking a penalty to his attack (reflecting holding back a bit, or trying to hit the right spot, etc.). I am sure it wouldn't be too out of line to give a -2 Dice Pool penalty for any such attempt.

[Fortune]

THE UNDERGROUNDECONOMY in bookmarks is not aesthetically pleasing.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

There was a rule in previous editions whereby a character could choose to do Stun damage by taking a penalty to his attack (reflecting holding back a bit, or trying to hit the right spot, etc.). I am sure it wouldn't be too out of line to give a -2 Dice Pool penalty for any such attempt.

No such rule.

In CC, you simply could choose to do stun damage - but that was a tim where blunt weapons always did stun damage. (And both points are not the general case in SR4 anymore)
And you could pull punches and reduce damage with a penalty.

[Fortune]

No such rule.

I am sure I remember a rule similar to what I wrote, but I may be mistaken, or it may have been in an even earlier edition.

[Ancient History]

I am sure I remember a rule similar to what I wrote, but I may be mistaken, or it may have been in an even earlier edition.

You might be remembering the reverse of that rule, the prequel to the Vicious Blow maneuver, in Fields of Fire.

[Kanada Ten]

Another question came up yesterday on a German board: Discussing the question, wether you could choose to still inflict stun damage with bone density augmentation/bone lacing. From my point of view this is just an issue of not hitting so freakin' hard but then Rotbart hinted at the description of the Sai (p. 39) which states explicitly that the special thing about this weapon's specialty is that one may choose which damage track he wants to fill.
He derived from that description that you generally can't choose to do stun damage in melee combat by RAW, even though common sense suggests that at least in unarmed combat or with blunt weapons you could aim to knock your opponent out rather than kill him.
Since I didn't come across any other passages concerning this in the rules, this case is rather unclear to me now.

Well, you can resort to subduing (SR4, pg 152), which would allows you to specifically inflict stun damage; though it would take at least two Complex Actions to even begin inflicting damage...

[Whipstitch]

That's not really that big of a problem though; the end of the first action they can't fight back through normal means until they break the lock, and once you do start dealing damage you get to use your full strength rather than strength/2; not all that great for the lighter metas who are depending almost completely on the lacing/density for their damage, but for any troll or ork with 6 strength or higher it means that you'll be dealing damage comparable to what you'd do with bone lacing and one or two net hits. It's not perfect, but it does mean that trolls in particular are perfectly capable of bullying weaker opponents quite effectively.

[Fortune]

You might be remembering the reverse of that rule, the prequel to the Vicious Blow maneuver, in Fields of Fire.

Probably. Still a good idea.

[Prime Mover]

After hearing Narcoject ™ dart guns were left out of Arsenal while this type of weapon was mentioned already in bbb, I had a thought. Could you replace Yamaha Pulsars ammo with chem darts. They seem to have all right components, propellant, capacitor/chem reservoir and needle. Doable?

Found another reference to "dart guns" in arsenal under heavy armor entry, guess someone did'nt realize they got left out of BBB.

[Kanada Ten]

Found another reference to "dart guns" in arsenal under heavy armor entry, guess someone did'nt realize they got left out of BBB.

Dartgun: This cyberweapon fires small darts, usually containing
a chemical compound, at the target. If the target takes
damage from a dart it is affected by the chemical compound or
toxin delivered (see Using Toxic Substances, p. 245, SR4). The
dartgun uses light pistol ranges.

[Prime Mover]

I know theres cyber dart gun and bolt/arrow injector but was wondering if they missed narcoject weapons or just tossed them out of 4th.

[Kyoto Kid]

...the Cyber Dart Gun is the Oral Dart (kind of silly if you ask me). The issue with bows, even the pistol crossbow is they are too cumbersome (try to conceal a Jennings™ compound bow under your longcoat).

The original dart/Narcojet pistol had a concealbility of 7 which in 4th ed would place it in the light pistol class. Now if they grouped the Ares Super Squirt under Pistols skill (as it was in 3rd ed) that would be fine. As a matter of fact I am seriosuly considering doing just that in my campaigns for it is a way too useful weapon to limit to a "special" skill.

[Abbandon]

If you take the two weapon style fighting does that negate the -2 to your off hand or would you still need the ambidextrous quality or off-handed training manuever??

[Whipstitch]

You need ambi/off-hand.

[Ravor]

If you lump dartguns, squirters, ect under pistols then lasers should get the same love as well. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif)

[hobgoblin]

not sure if anyone have asked yet, but have people find any kind of battletac like software or hardware in the recent books?

it seems to have gone the way of the dodo, replaced by a generic +1-3 when cooperating using comlinks and ar...

[Fortune]

As far as I know, something akin to Battletac will be included in Unwired.

[Ravor]

I seem to recall Synner teasing us about it awhile back, in one of the AUG threads if I remember correctly when a poster asked if it was going to appear in ARSE.

[hobgoblin]

heh, i should have guessed given how its most likely just a software addon to the comlink now.

something like a specialized im/collaboration tool or something.

[knasser]

R3ds4muri wishes to join your network. Accept / Reject?

[jago668]

R3ds4muri wishes to join your network. Accept / Reject?

That would make me want to have a automatic return message of troll on orc gay sex for my rejects. Then you just start shooting towards the screaming.

[hobgoblin]

ugh, my leetspeak is out of practice. i had to read that 3-4 times before it got the joke (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Rotbart van Dain...]

I know theres cyber dart gun and bolt/arrow injector but was wondering if they missed narcoject weapons or just tossed them out of 4th.

If they were ruled like the cyber-dartgun, it's better they are gone:
Darts doing Damage themselves is just... wrong.