[X] My Assistant

[Fortune]

Hey there ...

So, I haven't played an awful lot of video games in the last 20 years or so, and have just started to remedy that mistake. I have recently gone through GTA: Vice City, Hitman 2, and Deus Ex, and am looking for more. Which brings me to the purpose of this thread ...

Which game on the market would you think would be the closest to representing Shadowrun (and why)?

In your opinion, which is the best 'Deus Ex style' game on the market?

[Mr. Man]

I have recently gone through GTA: Vice City, Hitman 2, and Deus Ex, and am looking for more.

GTA III
GTA: San Andreas
Hitman: Codename 47
Hitman: Contracts
Hitman: Blood Money

Also worth playing:

Mafia
Splinter Cell
Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow (some people say this one was sub-par, but I enjoyed it)
Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

And once you finish all of those:

The Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Butcher Bay

Which game on the market would you think would be the closest to representing Shadowrun (and why)?

The various Shadowrun MUSHs. I don't have the patience to play them (the novel writing you have to do for this and PbP/PBEM games looks more like work than play to me) but from what little I've read they seem to stick closest to the feel of the rules and the setting if not the letter.

In your opinion, which is the best 'Deus Ex style' game on the market?

System Shock 2?
BioShock?

Haven't played either one, but I intend to. Deus Ex is one of my favorite games.

[Wounded Ronin]

Deus Ex is in my opinion the best game ever made. Nothing else really managed to come close to it.

[Fortune]

Thanks Mr Man. I'll have to check them out. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

WR: Is Deus Ex 2 worth getting?

What about Max Payne?

[Blade]

It's hard to give you an advice about Deus Ex 2 because it's one of these love-it-or-hate-it games. I loved it (even if I have a few complaints), a lot of people hated it. I think the best way to sum it up is: more FPS, less 'RPG'. Some say the best way to enjoy it is to forget the first one, and play it as a new game instead of a sequel.
It's not a First Person RPG with stats and inventory management. It's a FPS with RPG elements. You don't have stats, and the only impact you'll have on your character will be the choice of his 5 bio-modifications (with 3 different possibilities for each slot). The inventory management is also a lot simpler. On the other hand, the action part is also much more action oriented, which I enjoyed (especially when I tried getting back to the first one afterwards).

Max Payne 1&2 are really good. Great storytelling, great gameplay, some excellents mods (especially Katana for Max Payne 1)... Really worth getting, especially considering the price.

About games close to Shadowrun, that depends on what aspect of Shadowrun you'd like to see. Here is my own list (minus what's already been mentioned). As I don't play a lot of recent games (and considering that a lot of the cyberpunk games are quite old), it includes a lot of old games. They can probably be downloaded on abandonware websites if you can't find them anywhere else.

Cyberpunk games
* The Genesis and SNES Shadowrun games, of course. The Mega CD one looks really great and faithful to the PnP game (down to the management of dice pools and rolls being shown on screen with associated TNs) but it's only in Japanese and no translation has yet been released.
* Blade Runner: a really nice adventure game based on the movie. The story is different yet very close to the movie's, you get to visit a lot of familar places and even use the Voigt-Kampf test.
* Bloodnet: very probably Shadowrun-inspired (I mean, they mention Ares guns here and there). Set in a 80's cyberpunk world (with neo-anarchists fighting the evil megacorp), you play a shadowrunner whose last Johnson happened to be a vampire. You start the game right after having been bitten with your cranial implant doing its best to slow down the vampire transformation. The game itself is some kind of point and click mixed with and RPG. The story is nice and the dialogs are quite good but the combat scenes and graphics (especially the perspective, which makes Arsenal's cover look normal) are a bit awkard.
* Bureau 13: I played this one a long time ago, so I don't really remember everything, but it's a point and click in a cyberpunk with magic setting.
* Burn-Cycle: A FMV (Full Motion Video) game, inspired by Johnny Mnemonic (the story is a rip-off to be exact). It was a great game, but with today's standard it looks quite awful.
* Chaos Overlord: A strategy game where you're some mob boss fighting others to control a city in a cyberpunk setting. The colorful and wicked gangs you hire (wanabees so useless they'll work for free, combat nuns, used cars salesmen) make this game a lot of fun.
* Circuit's Edge: Based on the cyberpunk novel When Gravity Fails by Georges Alec Effinger. Street-level cyberpunk investigation fun in the middle-east.
* DreamWeb: This game is a work of art, 100% pure atmosphere. It's an adventure game set in a gritty, gritty, gritty low-tech (no implants, no drones) cyberpunk world. The graphics (dated but still quite good, in their own way), the music (excellent albeit dated too) and most of all the attention to details bring the universe to life with a violent, gritty and sometimes strange story. I recommend you read the introductory book "Diary of a (mad?) man" first both for a better understanding of the story and the added atmosphere.
* Dystopia: A Cyberpunk mod for Half-Life 2. I haven't played it, but I heard that it's really good.
* Hell: A Cyberpunk Thriller. A point and click set in a cyberpunk universe where a portal to hell appeared in the middle of Washington. You play the role of two agents of the fundamentalist government, suddenly hunted by their own employer. The graphics are quite awful but the dialogs are quite good.
* Johnny Mnemonic: A FMV game with a story closer to the one of the movie. The action scenes are ok, but the rest is quite awful, the Matrix scenes being the worst. The gameplay can also be confusing at first. I won't recommend it.
* Neuromancer: Based on the novel. Has aged quite badly and isn't much fun.
* Rise of the Dragon: A very good (albeit short) cyberpunk adventure game.
* Snatcher: A japanese adventure game deeply influenced by Blade Runner. Fun, but much more story-oriented than game-oriented.
* Syndicate and Syndicate Wars: "Corporate Persuasion Through Urban Violence". Two tactical games set in a gritty cyberpunk setting where everyone is equipped with an "Utopia" chip that allows them to see life the way they want. The Syndicates (a mix between megacorps, secret society and criminal syndicate) can control those chips and fight for world domination. You control teams of 4 cyborg agents sent on missions all over the world to lead your syndicate to victory through any means necessary (including Thor Shots).
* Tarmak: A recently released freeware. A retro top-down action RPG set in a classic cyberpunk setting with some magic.

Non Cyberpunk games
* Jagged Alliance 1 and 2: A series of squad-based strategy/tactical games where you lead a team of mercenaries. Very good on the tactical angle and full of colorful PCs and NPCs with excellent one-liners.
* J.D Spy: A "puzzle" game that's quite original but very difficult (sometimes feel more like work than game). I think the beginning of the game is a good example: as you play the "start new game" button you have an error message box. Actually it isn't a real error message box, if you click on the "details" button, you see there's a message hidden in the details. Later on, you'll have to learn things about real-life encryption, programming and a lot more if you want to solve the puzzles.
* Kigpin: A violent street-level FPS.
* Operation Flashpoint/Armed Assault: Realistic war FPS. Interesting to get an idea of what war feels like (well I don't know if it's anything like that, but it seems quite realistic).
* Splinter Cell series: A series of Third Person Shooters with a great emphasis on Stealth and Infiltration. Can give a few ideas about infiltration methods or atmopshere.
* Spycraft: A FMV game where you play the role of a CIA agent. Supposedly realistic, it can give a few interesting ideas for Shadowrun.
* SWAT 3/4: Two tactical FPS where you play as a leader of a SWAT team on operations. Really good to see how SWAT teams act and a great inspirations for Shadowrun's HTR teams (or even well-coordinated runner teams).
* Uplink: A hacking simulation with a nice atmosphere. Closer to the real world than to Shadowrun's, but it can still be useful inspiration for hackers/deckers.

Have fun!

[Wounded Ronin]

Thanks Mr Man. I'll have to check them out. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

WR: Is Deus Ex 2 worth getting?

What about Max Payne?

Deus Ex 2? HA HA HA HA HA HA HEE HEE HEE HAR HAR HAR! That was a good joke.

If you Google Deus Ex 2 you'll find that most people seem to have felt very disappointed by it after expecting something on the magnitude of the first.

Max Payne, on the other hand, is a true classic, but it's not like Deus Ex at all. Max Payne is a straight-up action game with artistic cut scenes and well-done psycho-surrealism. They're very different games but Max Payne is excellent in its own way and genre. What's more is that there are some really terrific mods for Max Payne; so many that sometimes it's hard to find the best. If you download iirc Kenneth Yeung's Kung Fu mod version 3 that is one hell of an awesome ride. There's several Matrix mods and some are a lot better than others. Finally, there's a Katana mod that's very well done but you have to be careful because I encountered 2 Katana mods; an earlier one which was basically crappy and silly and a later one that was extremely refined and advanced and cool. Basically in the Katana mod you play through some manga-esque levels where you're a gun-and-katana toting renegade hitman. They modified the engine so that you could perform cutscene attacks with your katana as well as use bullet time, fancy dodges, and guns. The final boss could actually parry and reposte your cutscene attacks, which was amazing.

[Fortune]

Wow! Lots of info ... thanks. I don't know where to start. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

When you refer to 'mods', are you talking about separate 'full adventure-like' things, or merely modifications to the main game itself (or both)?

I have also heard heaps about Fallout (or more specifically Fallout 2), but have never had a chance to do more than watch a couple of minutes of some other dude's game. I understand that it isn't a FPS, but in your opinion(s), is it worth picking up?

[swirler]

wow I can't believe no one has mention Halflife 2 and its addons. One of my favorite series ever. If you get the orange box edition you will get HL2 and the next 2 chapters and one of the coolest games ever IMHO Portal
that game freaked me out. GlaDOS was awesome.

one cool thing too is the fan mod Dystopia, well if you like FPS multiplayer. Pretty much an attempt at making a shadowrun game w/o calling it that. even decking
I havent had the chance to play it much yet but it looked pretty cool

[Wounded Ronin]

Wow! Lots of info ... thanks. I don't know where to start. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

When you refer to 'mods', are you talking about separate 'full adventure-like' things, or merely modifications to the main game itself (or both)?

I have also heard heaps about Fallout (or more specifically Fallout 2), but have never had a chance to do more than watch a couple of minutes of some other dude's game. I understand that it isn't a FPS, but in your opinion(s), is it worth picking up?

Mods are modifications to a game. They could be anything from minor changes to the engine or internal parameters to full conversions with graphics and everything.

Fallout 2 is a classic computer RPG. It was originally under development as GURPS computer game but when that deal fell through the team developed their own rule system for the game and their own game world and quests. The setting is post apocalyptic and darkly humorous. Even better, if you play Fallout 2 you can play my very own weapons realism mod! Get it here: http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/dload.php...amp;file_id=887

Here's another download link with a cool screenshot: http://www.madbrahmin.cz/index.php?dir=fal...&id=vintage

[Fortune]

Now I have too many choices! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[fistandantilus4....]

Apparently I'm the only one that really liked the Punisher title that came out for PS2 a while back. A hell of a lot of fun even if you're not into the comic. Fairly long, great combat, scales well. The plot ain't bad either.

[Fortune]

Not having a console myself, it didn't even occur to me to specify my interest only in games that will actually run on my PC. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Mr. Man]

Apparently I'm the only one that really liked the Punisher title that came out for PS2 a while back. A hell of a lot of fun even if you're not into the comic. Fairly long, great combat, scales well. The plot ain't bad either.

[looking nervous and backing away slowly] Uhh...yeah! That game was great!

(Sorry, the torture mini-games and incredibly stupid enemy A.I. turned me off pretty early on. It did look like you could collect a lot of guns though...) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/extinguish.gif)

Not having a console myself, it didn't even occur to me to specify my interest only in games that will actually run on my PC. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

There is a PC port of this game (I don't have a console either) but Punisher is a straight-up third person shooter.

Since the games you cited were stealth shooters and sandbox titles (two genres of which I am a big fan) I refrained from listing games outside those genres -- even the really good games like Max Payne (third person shooter), Half-Life (first person shooter), Portal (first person puzzle), Barkley Shut Up and Jam: Gaiden (RPG), etc.

I'd also suggest you look for the PC version of Metal Gear Solid (the first one, I can't recommend the sequel). MGS is the original stealth shooter (at least as far as 3D games go) and a lot of fun.

[Wounded Ronin]

MGS: Sons of Liberty (the sequel) was blammed by a lot of critics because while it started out as a hard-nosed military sneaker set in a real world setting as it progressed it became more and more surrealistic until finally it was taking place in what was for all intents and purposes a Jungian duodenum.

Now, I actually liked it. I played through the whole game, paying about 2 or 3 bucks an hour at an XBox arcade, and enjoyed it. I think it's because I'm a huge fan of Freudian/Jungian/Campbellian storytelling so I really ate it all up. But I certainly don't have difficulty understanding how, for example, one of the bosses being an enormously fat flaming gay man on roller skates wearing an explosive ordinance disposal suit might have turned off the majority of US military video game consumers.

[Angelone]

Speaking of MGS games 3 had imo the best story line of them all. The ending, which I'll be nice and not spoil, broke my heart and had me crying tears of pure rage. It was the only game I've ever played that got me that emotionally involved.

[fistandantilus4....]

Not having a console myself, it didn't even occur to me to specify my interest only in games that will actually run on my PC. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

oops

[looking nervous and backing away slowly] Uhh...yeah! That game was great!

(Sorry, the torture mini-games and incredibly stupid enemy A.I. turned me off pretty early on. It did look like you could collect a lot of guns though...) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/extinguish.gif)

The game is easy to go through without the torture element. The AI wasn't stupid,just predictable. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

(and stop spraying me with a fire extinguisher. That stuff smells funny)

[Grinder]

So, I haven't played an awful lot of video games in the last 20 years or so, and have just started to remedy that mistake. I have recently gone through GTA: Vice City, Hitman 2, and Deus Ex, and am looking for more. Which brings me to the purpose of this thread ...

You won't reduce your daily time spent here, I hope? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

[Fortune]

Perish the thought! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif)

[swirler]

MGS Sons of liberty had the "Substance" revamp, addition whatever yu want to call it.
I have that for PC, picked it up at halfpricebooks for $5
I like it okay
it has other missions added to it. I couldnt tell you the differences because I never played the original release

[Fortune]

So, are there other 'games' (fan created whole game modifications like is available for NWN) out there for Deus Ex?

[Blade]

The exact word for such modifications is simply "mods".

There are a few mods for Deus Ex for single and multiplayer.
As for most games, you'll find them by searching '"game name" mods' on Google, on ModDb, or on websites dedicated to the game.

Some have not been released yet (such as the High Resolution Project).
As for the released mods, on the top of my head:
* Shifter is supposed to make the game better by adding a few elements and tweaking a few things.
* RedSun 2020 is a quite big new singleplayer "campaign".
* Burden of 80 Proof is funny and original.
* Multiplayer coop is fun, but last time I tried (some 5 years ago) it only worked with a few levels.
* I remember playing a few good singleplayer levels, but I don't remember the names.