Fake License, How do you handle it in your game... Options

[Slymoon]

As the GM what do you require, how anal are you?

Licenses for:
Pilot Ground Craft
Pilot Water Craft
Pistols
Longarms
Automatics
Exotic Melee Weapon (elbow spur)
Spellcasting
Summoning

or

Firearms (full skillgroup)
Sorcery (full skillgroup)

or

Security Specialist (activity license to cover all appropriate gear)


It seems the rules are written very open ended and it would depend on the GM in question. However how does this work in public missions games? ie: you start and play several SRMs under one GM who is loose but play the next few under another who is anal.

p.323

Each type of item/ activity requires a separate license.

In this case what does 'type' mean. Firearm, Melee weapon? Pistol, SMG, Katana? Holdout Pistol, Light Pistol, Heavy Pistol?
Rockclimbing, Hunting, Bodyguard?


How do you as a GM determine license requirements?

[nezumi]

Firstly, depends on the particular area. In Seattle, each non-military grade weapon requires its own permit. Each spell over force 3 requires its own permit. Each spirit or elemental over force 3 probably requires its own permit. You need permits to drive certain vehicles by class, but not to possess them. There's no permit requires for most other activities. I stick to real world rules when I can, though.

[Slymoon]

to add:
Is it down to the specific Item?
AK-97 Carbine
Ingram Smartgun X
Wired Reflexes 2
Retractable Spur


Rating 4 Fake License = cost of the AK-97 o_O


Edit:
Yow talk about a money sink, I suppose that is the cost to be 'legal'

[Edge2054]

For anything not listed as restricted I figure a license can be built into a fake SIN (your driver's license for example).

For weapons I think concealed/carry by weapon type makes sense. Cyberware I might let all fall under a Security Grade License just to keep it simple.

So a character sheet might look like this.
Fake SIN Jack Brown (4)
pistols conceal/carry license (4)
sec-grade cyberware (4)

[Dashifen]

Licenses only usually come up in my game when someone's caught carrying that which they aren't supposed to. As a result, most players have a license for a pistol and any of their more obvious gear that they keep on them. But I've not seen to many people permit their assault rifles and other such gear since if you're caught with that it's usually during a run. Not so much this year, but in the past when there's been more international travel (or intra-Denver travel, as the case may be), I've been more strict with permits for weapons since it was far more likely that such things would be found during border crossings.

[Eyeless Blond]

Firstly, depends on the particular area. In Seattle, each non-military grade weapon requires its own permit. Each spell over force 3 requires its own permit. Each spirit or elemental over force 3 probably requires its own permit. You need permits to drive certain vehicles by class, but not to possess them. There's no permit requires for most other activities. I stick to real world rules when I can, though.

And hacking programs? Do you need ~15 licenses, one for each program?

[b1ffov3rfl0w]

And hacking programs? Do you need ~15 licenses, one for each program?

If you're a "white hat" corp sec hacker, probably. If you're a real hacker, though, you've presumably either cracked or actually written the programs yourself, and scoff at the very idea of licensing them.

[Eyeless Blond]

That seems so silly though. Like having to get a separate license for working the gas pedal, one for the steering wheel, one for the brake, one for the turn signals (one for left, one for right), oh and don't get me started on all the licenses you'd need for cruise control...

[Edge2054]

Really I think the GM can be as nit-picky as he or she wants with it. For the character (not the player) all more licenses mean are more crap on whatever SIN they're connected to. It's not like the character really suffers any inconvenience beyond what it initially takes to get everything set up.

[Dr. John Desmond]

Generally you would want the Licenses broken up into classes. The way you do with vehicle liceses where a certain level of licesence allows you to operate a vehicle of a certain weight. You can also tack that on to weapons and cyberware (ie assualt weapons versus concel/carry of handguns and Alpha Licence for eyes ect, versus Delta grade military style enhancements). Magic use would probably just be a single licese to itself. In the end yeah you will still end up with an abnormally abusrd ammount of licesnses, but such is the way of a bureaucracy.

[Cthulhudreams]

I say every R class item you have needs a seperate license if you want the Police to not care when they find it in the trunk of your car. Every profession of dubious legality you purport to have should also probably be licensed.

However, if you are confident the cops will not find it (because, say, its a very difficult to detect implant, like synaptic boosters), then you can risk not having a license. I am quite happy to provide guidance on what you probably should, and should not have licensed.

[Sir_Psycho]

If it's got an R next to the availability. It needs a license.

Maybe you could get your GM to give you profession licenses, such as a bodyguard license, that legalises you to carry concealed and for your wired reflexes.

If a cop or corpsec gets into your commlink far enough to check that your hacking programs are unlicensed, you'd better hope that he's there to fry your brain. Because you're going away for quite some time for all those programs, unless they let you serve concurrently. Luckily for us, A Lone Star Gridsec (are they still called gridsec in sr4?) needs a little thing called a warrant to dig that deep, or at the very least, a flimsy pretense of probable cause.

Then they fry your brain. Or load a suite of BTL code into your commlink and shout "Dealer! Menace to society!", then fry your brain.

[Fortune]

The way things work in my games (and most of those I've played in) is that things with an 'R' need a license. Things with an 'F' need a license and an appropriately supporting ID (occupation, etc).

[nezumi]

to add:
Is it down to the specific Item?
AK-97 Carbine
Ingram Smartgun X
Wired Reflexes 2
Retractable Spur

If we go by current rules (which I do), yes. Your AK-97 permit is connected to the AK-97 with this serial code and these features. In the US, for me to get an automatic weapon I have to pass a background investigation, pay the $200 tax stamp, and find one made before a certain date. I believe the background investigation is per weapon. It's really not an issue for cyber, since you will likely never have two versions of the same cyber, but yes, for weapons it adds up fast.

Yes, computer programs require their own licenses, however I rule that only applies for programs which would have a reason to be illegal. There is absolutely no reasonable reason why read/write should be restricted. So that basically means the only programs you're going to have to pay for are things like deception, spoof and attack programs (and of course, your masking chip).

[WeaverMount]

I do it by job.

PIs get to have micro drones, and concealed carry
'trix analysts get to have exploit and attack
Contractors get to have demolitions and B&E gear
etc.

The way I think of it is whatever a beat cop would likely believe. Cops beat cops basically just smell out "fishy". A license helps de-escalate the fishy-o-meter. Does a PI need to be packing an eve's dropping comlink and an over modded predator in a skin pouch ... well maybe. Do they need black IC and an Alpha ... well no.

[paws2sky]

I break it down by skill, more or less.

Automatics License allows you to carry and automatic weapons.
Blades License allows you to carry bladed weapons.
And so on.

Private citizens cannot own licenses for "F" rated items. Those are available only to valid corporate entities.

[fatal2ty]

I don't require my PCs to have licenses for anything, its their choice, the problem arises when they drive or walk past a Lone Star, he may scan their commlinks and check for licenses, which could lead to problems.

[deek]

I'm not very nit-picky in my games on this. I also go by the "R" means you need a license, and for weapons, it is by each gun, not a type of gun. So, its really just an additional cost to get the weapon.

Now once the fake license is purchased, I allow that to be cloned onto all their SINs...again, this would only come up during security checks and its only an issue if the player hasn't purchased one. And this normally only happens when they acquire the weapon...it really just makes the Availability go up a bit, which means waiting a little longer to get it.

[Eyeless Blond]

I guess this begs the question: how many licenses do your characters typically buy, and how many would you consider to be:

-not enough?
-too many?

[deek]

I guess this begs the question: how many licenses do your characters typically buy, and how many would you consider to be:

-not enough?
-too many?

Well, I don't require any player to have them...I mean, its not like I try to hit them with a Lone Star pull over on the way to the run. And even if they did get pulled over without a license, I'm either going to force a bribe or confiscate the item in question. Granted, most of my players would rather run and if necessary, end the chase in a shootout. So, "not enough" is really never an issue.

On the same side, "too many" is kinda hard to do. I mean, most of the time we are dealing with weapons, so if you just make it a part of the purchase, then its pretty easy. Every time you get a gun, you want to get a fake license for it...you deal with that once, and then forget it...kinda like all the Ronco products:)

[nezumi]

I guess this begs the question: how many licenses do your characters typically buy, and how many would you consider to be:

-not enough?
-too many?

My players generally believe concealability is better than licenses. Whether they have a permit for a weapon or not, it's going to attract unwanted attention, the officer will have a record, possibly a video record, including the character's face, ID, etc. pinning him to that location, and the cop will be watching the character for a bit as he continues on about his business. Hiding it in a duffel bag greatly reduces that problem. Plus, a stack of permits means Lone Star knows, if a crime was committed with this sort of a weapon, this person is worth checking out and hey look, we have the pattern of the firing pin so if the runner does use the weapon, it's mapped pretty easily. And when Lone Star decides to pay you a visit, they know all of the cyberware you have, all the equipment you have, and how best to deal with it. Better to be the 'grey man', totally unremarkable and forgettable.

The only case my runners will buy permits is when they MUST have a particular piece of equipment, and it can't be hidden.

[Nightwalker450]

I usually don't deal with licenses, concealability over licenses. The only time a license is necessary is if you plan on being caught with something illeagle, or otherwise not something that every wage-slave has. Drivers license, that's part of your SIN, likewise if your SIN has you as a truck driver, you don't need a license. If you've heavily modified your rig with weapons mounts, those you need a license for, or don't get caught. In this world most people are probably packing a pistol or taser, unless you go to the high class areas then you probably shouldn't carry it around the mall with you.

Licenses are more of a per run item. So if we need to get into someplace with equipment we normally wouldn't have, and we don't want to raise an alert in check points, you get licenses. Otherwise most runner gear is going to stay hidden, and just hope its not in your apartment if you get hit by a random search (or not so random).

Software, yeah if someones hacking your commlink and is worried about the legality of your programs... The license isn't going to help you. Maybe write up a worm for your own commlink if someone puts in the wrong password it starts fragging itself. So if it is confiscated its got a databomb in its login script (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) .

"User must goto furry website within 3 seconds of logging in or frag everything."

Yeah check my commlink, login access, here you go.

[nathanross]

If my character ever gets to the point where his license is being checked, he's boned anyways. I do not waste money on licenses because it is not worth the money. I have enough F gear that there is just no point in trying to play it off legal. Basically, if I ever get caught, pulled over, etc., it is much safer for me in the long run to plug the officers brain with a bullet than to try and play it off.

Basically, don't get caught!

EDIT - As for what a license covers: I say each piece of ware requires an independent license. You wanna play it legal, it's gonna cost ya.

[kigmatzomat]

Until SR4 setting books appear, it's up to the GM. And really, there's no "wrong" way to do it. From my limited experience with weapons licenses, the approaches vary significantly from state to state or country to country.

IMO, each piece of "R" cyber needs a license. Weapon permits are by type (pistol, SMG, rifle, assault rifle, etc). The biggest thing, IMO, is having the license attached to a solid enough SIN. A rating 1 SIN can buy you a soy latte or even a used car but Great Spirit help you if the Star runs a weapon license check on that SIN since that's definitely worth a situational penalty.