[X] My Assistant

[Jaid]

It would have taken that much more space to put in a column labled Seating? Funny, they had the room width wise in previous books, I fail to see how this would have been a problem this time.

actually, i'm looking at my PDF of the SR3 core rulebook. they didn't put seats on the same line at all... it's actually got it's own, separate, line. well, to be fair, that line is shared with the entry points i guess, but i think that just further makes the point that they didn't have width for seating and entry/exit points =P (to further illustrate the point, cost and availability take up yet another line, and finally street index takes up a third line, sometimes shared with 'special features')

[Tarantula]

Yes, but look at all the space in the SR4 tables for vehicles. Very easily they could've added seating and entry points.

[vladski]

Yes, but look at all the space in the SR4 tables for vehicles. Very easily they could've added seating and entry points.

I don't have Arsenal, but I agree, entry points and seating should have been included. Arguing "no space" as a reason jsut doesn't cut it. Nor does "it's unimportant." I can not imagine not being able to at least include such things in the master "table."

Vlad

[O'Donnell Heir]

I remember Rigger 3, played it quite a bit as well. Took up at least a paragraph on each and every single car's description to say something along the lines of:
"The (Car name) has (y Volume), can have six bucket seats or it could have 2 bucket seats (front) and two benches. Benches (hold X number) of people. Alternatively the Cargo model has 2 bucket seats (front) and (x Cargo Volume), and costs (X) extra. The (Car Name) has (#) doors, (#) sliding doors and (#) doors at the rear."

Then after that there was the rules for volume: how much can it hold? What size is it? How big are the doors?

Personally, I always knew what a Truck looked like inside, how many seats a car could possibly have, roughly how much a van could hold if you took out the back seats, ect. Unless you're filling your car up will jell-o and absolutely positively have to know how much it can hold, you're being a wee bit ridiculous (Which also goes without saying for the Jello).

You know what a jackrabbit is, think of an old car (or any car nowadays), and you're there. 2 seats and a bench unless you want the off brand or older model one with only 2 and large trunk. With everything from dwarfs to trolls in existence you're going to have 4 doors on a car. 2 doors and a sliding door on a van (with doors on the back for anything even near the word "Cargo" on the page). 2 doors on a truck with an open back end or hitch. Quite a few of these babies even have pictures in Arsenal. If you need them to label what a door is, you may need a magnifying glass.

A troll will fit inside even a jackrabbit, no he won't be comfortable, but he can wait it out. A Troll will fit in a Van or Truck with little complaint, I know people who're going on 7foot and I doubt a troll is going to complain about not being able to "sit up straight" in your Bulldog. There's no magic force stopping the troll from getting in a vehicle not sized for him (unless the driver is a mage, and he likes the upholstery on the car ceiling).

Anything that flies is a big purchase in the first place and likely comes in any model from 2 door to four door to cargo without much of an extra cost. If it's being introduced, the GM's probably got something planned for it, or the runners are getting in over their heads (literally (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ).

[Tarantula]

My point about space, is that it wouldn't take much to add a seating column, and a half paragraph explaining what various things would mean in said column. Not so much the half a paragraph per vehicle of its space/seating.

[Wesley Street]

A troll will fit inside even a jackrabbit, no he won't be comfortable, but he can wait it out.

Only if it had some seriously reinforced shocks! Might be a bit suspicious seeing a Jackrabbit bottoming out on Intercity-5, sparks flying this way and that. I know if I sit more than two people in the back of my Focus the damn thing scrapes the ground. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[CanRay]

Only if it had some seriously reinforced shocks! Might be a bit suspicious seeing a Jackrabbit bottoming out on Intercity-5, sparks flying this way and that. I know if I sit more than two people in the back of my Focus the damn thing scrapes the ground. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Actually, that gives me an idea on how to interrogate a Troll.

First, Narcojet him. This may require multiple darts. I suggest a modified, full-auto Narcojet Rifle.

Then, cram him into a Jackrabbit that's been armoured, with re-enforced doors.

Refuse to let him out until he talks.

[O'Donnell Heir]

Only if it had some seriously reinforced shocks! Might be a bit suspicious seeing a Jackrabbit bottoming out on Intercity-5, sparks flying this way and that. I know if I sit more than two people in the back of my Focus the damn thing scrapes the ground. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I would assume, and we all know what assumptions make you, that the jackrabbit would be somehow reinforced to hold metahumans of differing types by this point, or at least more than two regular humans. If the GM decides it wouldn't, they can always toss a couple extra (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) on the price, again the entire rules are up to the GM here. My arguement is that we don't need rules for common sense things like that, or vehicles that are so far beyond the need of runners that it's up to the GM anyways.

I was always surprised they took up the page space to add a freakin zeplin in Rigger 3.

[CanRay]

There's rules for adapting vechicles to Trolls. Part of that would be a stronger suspension.

According to legend, the infamous Andre the Giant (Who now has a Posse!) drove a Mini due to the Hydrolic Suspension being able to take his weight.

[Wesley Street]

I was always surprised they took up the page space to add a freakin zeplin in Rigger 3.

I was VERY surprised they took up space to add aircraft carriers, nuclear subs and such. What the who-ha-huh!?!?

"Captain Turbo Bunny! Fire the starboard batteries!" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohplease.gif)

[Fortune]

There's rules for adapting vechicles to Trolls.

That is correct. I believe though, that they only remove the penalty the troll receives for using a non-modified vehicle. As far as I know a troll could still use a non-modified vehicle with a penalty.

[CanRay]

That is correct. I believe though, that they only remove the penalty the troll receives for using a non-modified vehicle. As far as I know a troll could still use a non-modified vehicle with a penalty.

By steering with his knees.

Actually, I have characters that would pay to see that!

[Tarantula]

Could be because he has to look around the front seat to see (since he'd be in the backseat to drive and reach the controls comfortably.)

[DMK]

I just had a flash to the original Police Academy, when Mahoney was teaching Hightower how to drive. They ripped out the front seat and Hightower drove the car from the back seat.

[Tarantula]

And thats an example of succeeding to troll modify a compact in about 10 seconds. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[IQ Zero]

For what its worth, in Rigger 3, the Banshee seats 3 people (3 positions) and can carry 805kg of cargo.

I liked the fluff descriptions of Rigger 1 and Rigger 3 myself.

[CanRay]

So, who here wants to see how many Trolls we can fit into a C-N Jackrabbit for the Guinness World Record book?

[Wesley Street]

For what its worth, in Rigger 3, the Banshee seats 3 people (3 positions) and can carry 805kg of cargo.

Is a milspec Banshee the same thing as a smuggler T-Bird?

[Tarantula]

A Banshee is one of the few T-Birds statted out period.

[IQ Zero]

Is a milspec Banshee the same thing as a smuggler T-Bird?

Could be, I'm not sure.

A Banshee is one of the few T-Birds statted out period.

Rigger 3 statted out 3 T-Birds, the Aztechnology Lobo, the GMC Banshee, and the GMC Harpy. But then again they added several "similar" models that used more or less the same stats. McDonnell-Douglas Precursor (Lobo), Ares Firebird (Banshee), McDonnell-Douglas Interceptor (Banshee), Ares DR-270 (Harpy), USS Caravan Class (Harpy).

[Tarantula]

"Similar models" aren't statted out. They're the same T-Bird with a different name. The stats make the vehicle, describe it however you feel like.

[Kerris]

I had a problem where a player of mine was putting a bunch of drones, as well as the team, in his van. I felt like I couldn't tell him "no", because there were no rules for it. So, the rigger had his full supply of drones in his van. Which was kinda broken.

[Tarantula]

I had a problem where a player of mine was putting a bunch of drones, as well as the team, in his van. I felt like I couldn't tell him "no", because there were no rules for it. So, the rigger had his full supply of drones in his van. Which was kinda broken.

You're the GM. You get the final say, especially when its not covered in the rules.

[CanRay]

First rule of GMing: You can always say no.

My suggestion, get a GM Device Of Retribution. Mine is a Highway Snowplow due to my first group's history.

Many years later, that player got to have revenge on a Highway Snowplow that was demonically possessed and ran on the blood of innocents.

We felt sorry for the poor demon.

[Fix-it]

I had a problem where a player of mine was putting a bunch of drones, as well as the team, in his van. I felt like I couldn't tell him "no", because there were no rules for it. So, the rigger had his full supply of drones in his van. Which was kinda broken.

I find violence to be helpful when people are being dumb. Also: hardcover books.