Minigun Recoil, Is this thing even usable? Options

[Stahlseele]

no you would not . . with enough recoil-compensation you add the burst/fa-damage to the precision . . and if anything, i would try to ADD that mode instead of replacing SA with BF or FA . . maybe for those time when you need to make one desperate attempt to make something not like being where you're aiming at . . one of those edge-situations maybe for example *g*

[CanRay]

Anyone strong enough and massive enough to manage the M2's recoil won't mind the M2's weight. (90lbs + ammo)

That's what I was thinking.

I can just see some NAN Troll Soldier with an ancient M2HB modified for personal use with a Pistol Grip and a Shoulder Brace. Probably working with the Wildcats...

[ornot]

Actually, with a tripod, (instead of a gyro harness) one is able to get full recoil compensation on the minigun without need of strength enhancement.

Tripod 6
Gas vent 3
Folding Stock 1
Electronic Firing or Personalized Grip 1
Cyberarm Gyromount 3
= 14 RC, and able to fire full auto from the Vindicator with no penalty. Of course, then you have to lug a tripod around and set it up.

Is the tripod RC stackable with gyromount RC?

I seem to recall there was quite a lot of stuff that would not stack according to Arsenal, but I don't have my book with me to check.

[Stahlseele]

i don't really know why it would stack . .

[Tarantula]

I didn't include a gyromount in my recoil figures. Rather, a cyberarm gyromount. Which is in fact a gyro system built into the cyberarms wrist, which would stabilize the users arm more so than the gun, which is where I believe the bonus comes from. Also, I did check with arsenal, and they do stack by RAW.

[Stahlseele]

hmm . . would 2 cyber-arm gyromounts and the gyromount harness stack?

[Tarantula]

No. The cyberarm gyromount states it is not cumulative with the harness. I'd even argue that 2 arm mounts don't work together, but nothing forbids it. Hrm, one cyberarm with 3 cyberarm gyromounts anyone? +9RC in the arm? (Hell, make it a bulky arm and it can fit 4 for a +12 in your cyberarm alone!)

Its too good if you let it stack with itself, thats why I don't think it does.

[WearzManySkins]

If you are using a Tripod, gyro mounts(Harness or Arms) not attached to the tripod do not stack. Weapon mount gyrostabilizaton is a different matter.

Stacking a Tripod with any Gyro mount is PURE CHEESE. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

WMS

[Serial_Peacemake...]

The Best part is with the Military Armor you can put in cyberarm gyromounts in, and not have to worry about the essence.

[Tarantula]

Hrm, interesting.... Looking it over, the harness is called gyro-stabilization, and the cyberarm is a gyromount. So, a strict reading, you can't combine tripod + cyberarm gyromount, but you can combine a tripod + gyro-stabilization harness.

[CanRay]

Stick the Gyro-Harness onto the Tripod, and there you go. Better degrees of fire! Like the old Anti-Aircraft set-ups for Bren Guns.

[WearzManySkins]

Augmentation page 148
Emphasis mine

Recoil compensation from an auto-adjusting weight, bipod, foregrip, gyromount, sling, tripod, or underbarrel weight are
not cumulative with each other (except that the compensation from a foregrip and sling can be combined into an overall recoil compensation of 2).

Note gyromounts is not defined by "some" interpretations. To me it means all gyromounts, harness, arms and weapons gyromounts.

WMS

[WearzManySkins]

Obviously some here do not know what gyrostablizaton is and how it works.

WMS

[WearzManySkins]

RAW page 311
emphasis mine

Gyro Stabilization: Th is is a heavy upper-body harness with an attached, articulated gyro-stabilized arm that mounts a rifle or heavy weapon. Th e system neutralizes up to 6 points of recoil and movement modifiers. Attaching or removing a weapon takes a Simple Action. Getting into the gyro-mount takes 5 minutes, while using the built-in quick release to get out of it takes a Complex Action.

Says Gyro-mount to me. So it does not stack with tripods. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

WMS

[Tarantula]

Yes wearz, that is the exact passage I was referring to. Gyromount = Cyberarm Gyromount. Gyro-Stabilization = Harness. Though, Looking at it again, the tripod and harness both take the "Under" slot, and so aren't compatible either.

Edit: You posted while I was looking in the books. The Harness is not named a gyro-mount, but it is described as one. Regardless, they don't work because they take the same slot.

[Daier Mune]

(which I'll handwave away by saying that Mr Ventura didn't have a 2050s gyroharness...)

oh i think that a troll with a gyro-harness could heft and fire a vindicator, but they're still going to suffer recoil when firing at things. technology may have progressed over 70 years, but the laws of physics remain the same.

as for heavy barrels and gas vents on a gattling gun, i'd only allow it if the cost was mulitplied by the number of barrels. its only fair.

[aussie elf]

It can be useful but you have to "want it" as a friend says. For a man potable way to use the Vindicator it MUST be used with a gyro harness. A character I've had been playing for a long time got one. With skill 5 + 8 modified agil. and a 6 mod. strength (one point of natural recoil comp.) you start with zero dice. Then you add the gyro and if you have the money a smart link and you can have 8 dice to hit something with 20P, or take away 14 defense dice from the target with a wide burst.
Now because there are more efficient and cheaper ways to shoot stuff I refer you to the begining of the post, "you have to want it", I know I did (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Critias]

I recall that the mini used in preadator was modified to use .22 rounds as anuthing larger made it impossible to manuver & fire but Jesse "Sgt. Slaughter/The Body" Ventura. Jesse is big but, he ain't no troll so if it can work IRL I don't see why it can't be modded in SR for man portable use. At worst (stat wise) it would be similar to a machine pistol, just with a greater ROF and no conceal.

For the record -- just as a child of the 80's, I have to clear this up -- Jesse Ventura wasn't Sgt. Slaughter. The two were completely different wrestler/entertainers, who both just happened to have ridiculously awesome giant chins to match their steroid-enhanced muscles.

[IC-Pick]

For the record -- just as a child of the 80's, I have to clear this up -- Jesse Ventura wasn't Sgt. Slaughter. The two were completely different wrestler/entertainers, who both just happened to have ridiculously awesome giant chins to match their steroid-enhanced muscles.

Lol, I was going to if you didn't!

[DocTaotsu]

oh i think that a troll with a gyro-harness could heft and fire a vindicator, but they're still going to suffer recoil when firing at things. technology may have progressed over 70 years, but the laws of physics remain the same.

Well technically speaking... with magic having returned in 2012... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[CanRay]

That's a way to do it! Get a Troll Mage to make a Spell that handles the Recoil. Then he handles the bloody thing like it was a really fast assault rifle!

[Tarantula]

You mean enhance aim?

Though, with double uncompensated recoil, an actual recoil comp spell would be better.

[CanRay]

An actual Recoil Comp spell would be better indeed. Then lock an Enhance Aim spell, and there you go! Sniping and firing Full-Auto at the same time!

Whereupon we have the third spell: "Transmute Security Goon To Hamburg"

[Stahlseele]

hmm . . would levitate keep the minigun in place if you were to fire it? would you let the force or net successes of levitate count as recoil compensation? O.o

[ornot]

I'm pretty sure the force dictates the strength of the telekinesis spell.

To have a high enough strength to reach the RC thresholds in Arsenal you're looking at bloody high force.