HOW DO STAT PULSE RIFLE!?!, Bug hunts require pulse rifles. Options

[Wounded Ronin]

Considering how the theme of bug hunts come up every now and then in Shadowrun, I cannot believe that we haven't had more discussion on how to stat a Pulse Rifle from Alien. Here's the wikipedia entry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M41A_pulse_rifle

The M41A Pulse Rifle is an air cooled, fully automatic, short- to mid-range combat rifle. Made of light alloy plates, it fires 10x24mm Armor Piercing Caseless Rounds from a 100 round U-bend magazine in either semi automatic, four-round burst, or fully automatic rates of fire. Even though it is supposed to fire caseless ammunition the rifle appears to have a shell ejection port for unknown reasons. In the Aliens versus Predator computer game, the rifle can practically hold 99 rounds; according to the Aliens: Colonial Marines Technical Manual, the weapons were usually underloaded to 95% capacity to avoid jamming. The pulse rifle has a battery-powered digital display that displays the number of rounds left in the magazine. With a retractable stock and an underslung 30 mm PN grenade launcher, this weapon can be used as a carbine and an assault rifle.

In the first place, LOL at the shell ejection port, and also how you saw casings coming out in the movie. That's clearly a goof.

Secondly, wouldn't a caseless weapon theoretically be characterized by high reliability compared to one that needs to extract and eject a casing after each round fired? It seems weird that a caseless weapon would need to be underloaded for reliability reasons.

Thirdly, where are the sights on that thing? http://uscmc.wikispaces.com/space/showimage/M41A.jpg

Forthly, it lists a cyclic rate of fire of 900 RPM. That's pretty high, but shouldn't a casless weapons have an even higher ROF? IIRC a micro uzi and a FN Minimi today can have 1000 RPM, and they're both cased.


In terms of SR3, I'd consider statting a pulse rifle so as to have the ability to fire up to 20 rounds per Automatic Fire action, to kind of abstract the high ROF and to sort of abstract the explicitly stated caselessness. Would the damage code for the Pulse Rifle be better potrayed as ~6M or more like a Ruger Thunderbolt at 9M? Maybe a GM could set the damage code as 9M which would justify the rifle being some kind of super prototype designed for bug hunting, which is why pulse rifles are not widespread in the SR world as a whole.

Would the 4 round burst feature override the SR3 3 round burst rule? I guess you could treat it as a Burst with a +1 Power bonus, like a burst and a short burst all rolled into one.

Probably it shouldn't be smartlinked, with that feature reserved for the "smartgun".

[Sma]

Ares Alpha is the Pulse Rifle in our games.

[nezumi]

Thirdly, where are the sights on that thing? http://uscmc.wikispaces.com/space/showimage/M41A.jpg

The rifle was designed only for use by space Marines who, a) all have smartlinks and b) are so intimidating the bullets dare not hit anything BUT the designated target.

Forthly, it lists a cyclic rate of fire of 900 RPM. That's pretty high, but shouldn't a casless weapons have an even higher ROF? IIRC a micro uzi and a FN Minimi today can have 1000 RPM, and they're both cased.

The RoF may have intentionally been slown down for a number of possible reasons, including reduced recoil, accuracy, heat concerns or simply to ration ammo while on an alien planet.

Probably it shouldn't be smartlinked, with that feature reserved for the "smartgun".

I don't understand that line of thought. It most certainly should be smartlinked.

[reepneep]

The smartgun would probably be a smartlinked MMG with gyromount, an IFF rig and a motion detector. As for the pulse rifle, just use the Ares Alpha. It really fits perfectly aside from the magazine capacity.

[kigmatzomat]

In the first place, LOL at the shell ejection port, and also how you saw casings coming out in the movie. That's clearly a goof.

Not necessarily. Dud rounds need to be cleared somehow and an ejection port is faster than the marine removing the magazine, fishing out the dud, reseating the mag, and cycling in a round.

Second, an "ejection port" may double as a vent. The blow-back mechanism could create a small air jet that clears & cools the chamber. One of the biggest problems of caseless rounds is heat dispersal; ejecting hot brass is a good way to vent chamber heat.

Secondly, wouldn't a caseless weapon theoretically be characterized by high reliability compared to one that needs to extract and eject a casing after each round fired? It seems weird that a caseless weapon would need to be underloaded for reliability reasons.

You're comparing the reliability of the firing mechanism to the reliability of the magazine feed mechanism; two different things entirely. A reliable caseless firing mechanism is worthless when the magazine fails to provide ammo.

Thirdly, where are the sights on that thing? http://uscmc.wikispaces.com/space/showimage/M41A.jpg

They could be holographic or AR/HUD. Or crappy artwork.

Forthly, it lists a cyclic rate of fire of 900 RPM. That's pretty high, but shouldn't a casless weapons have an even higher ROF? IIRC a micro uzi and a FN Minimi today can have 1000 RPM, and they're both cased.

Faster is not really better. With a 100 round mag you're looking at 6.7 seconds of full-auto firing at 900RPM. Caseless or not, ammo is heavy and this thing will eat it quick.

[Daier Mune]

caseless ammo has been making alot of checks that they havn't been able to cash for a long time.

and yeah, i figure the Ares Alpha is the best Pulse Rifle look-alike you'll get. especially since thats what Firewatch used to clear out the hives in cannon.

[Dumori]

Just make a drum feed Ares Alpha. 100 rounds of fun.

[DWC]

Wasn't the sight for the pulse rifle in the carrying handle?

[KCKitsune]

If you look at a Alpha, It's just a bullpup version of a M41A.

[psychophipps]

When I had done a 3G3 conversion using the bullet weight and muzzle velocity from the CMTM for this weapon back in the day I came up with a performance level approximating the 7.62 NATO cartridge. Of course, this weapon fires nasty little EX-type rounds so it's a bit beefier for that but it makes for a decent baseline to start your stats with. I would treat the 30mm GL as a standard SR 4th GL for ease of use.

[Zaranthan]

If you look at a Alpha, It's just a bullpup version of a M41A.

If it ain't broke...

[Dumori]

http://www.rayguncharlie.net/sr/firearms/assault/car44.html

looks like Raygun beat you to it.

[Ed_209a]

+1 for the reskinned Ares Alpha idea.

From the pic off of Raygun's site, it looks like there is a groove running along the top of the carrying handle, which probably contain the sights.

Incidentally, the only reason the G11 had that 2000RPM burst mode is that it could buffer the recoil until the last round had left the barrel. I think 7-900RPM is a better range for controllability.

[Electric Nomad]

Thirdly, where are the sights on that thing? http://uscmc.wikispaces.com/space/showimage/M41A.jpg

I'd say they are place in the "handle" just like on the FA-MAS: FA-MAS

[Wounded Ronin]

http://www.rayguncharlie.net/sr/firearms/assault/car44.html

looks like Raygun beat you to it.

Damn, I wish I could be as smart and cool as Raygun. He even has a little narrative to go with it.

[CanRay]

OK, first off, you take a Thompson M1A1 SMG, put on a lot of stuff.

Done, one Pulse Rifle ready to rock. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Shiloh]

OK, first off, you take a Thompson M1A1 SMG, put on a lot of stuff.

Done, one Pulse Rifle ready to rock. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Hence the ejection port and the brass...

[CanRay]

Exactly. Hollywood Prop Departments hardly have access to real Caseless weapons (Not that many H&K G11s were made after all!). (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Thompson M1A1s and Calicos are popular prop guns for movies to dress up, as are Ingram MAC-10s.

But, back to how to stat a Pulse Rifle. The main thing about a "Pulse Rifle" is that it uses caseless ammo and is set off with an electric charge. You can order weapons in Caseless or Cased in Shadowrun (Apparently), and there are rules in Arsenal to allow for the second.

[Starmage21]

Exactly. Hollywood Prop Departments hardly have access to real Caseless weapons (Not that many H&K G11s were made after all!). (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Thompson M1A1s and Calicos are popular prop guns for movies to dress up, as are Ingram MAC-10s.

But, back to how to stat a Pulse Rifle. The main thing about a "Pulse Rifle" is that it uses caseless ammo and is set off with an electric charge. You can order weapons in Caseless or Cased in Shadowrun (Apparently), and there are rules in Arsenal to allow for the second.

Put a large bulky surpressor in the MAC-10/11 and youve got an ingram smartgun. Look at the picture!

[WeaverMount]

The main thing about a "Pulse Rifle" is that it ... is set off with an electric charge.

I totally believe you. What is your source?

[masterofm]

The HK XM30 looks more like a pulse rifle I think then the Ares Alpha. That and it can either have a shotgun or a grenade launcher on its underbarrel mount.

[Dr Funfrock]

Put a large bulky surpressor in the MAC-10/11 and youve got an ingram smartgun.

A large sound suppressor eh? Kind of like this one?
http://www.airsoftatlanta.com/images/mac-10_jpg.jpg

Best picture I could find, but it's not just an airsoft thing, the real sound suppressor also looks like that.

[Wounded Ronin]

A large sound suppressor eh? Kind of like this one?
http://www.airsoftatlanta.com/images/mac-10_jpg.jpg

Best picture I could find, but it's not just an airsoft thing, the real sound suppressor also looks like that.

Yes, you see, the big suppressor is what makes it have the same effective range as an AK carbine. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/spin.gif)

[Method]

I'm sure you all saw this site in your googling, but it has detailed technical drawings about a quarter of the way down the page. Pretty cool.

[CanRay]

I totally believe you. What is your source?

Science Fiction. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

The "Pulse" can refer to many things. In this context, it's the electrical pulses that set off the charge. Technically, Metal Storm is a "Pulse" weapon.

It could also be "Pulse" laser weapons, pulse plasma, and so on. Sci-Fi isn't exactly known for keeping nomenclature standardized. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)