Unwired Questions, Now with Merge-y Goodness Options

[Ryu]

http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...st&p=703988

[Tarantula]

I see, so basically, you can have them all linked via DNI if you want, but you don't have to. Though, this means just because you have a datajack, it isn't automatically linked to all your cyberware either.

[Ryu]

I think the idea of this new "feature" of DNI may be that all implants are susceptible to hacker attack, once the PAN of the user is connected to the matrix.

If that is considered a desireable change, what with all the discussion about opting out, it would have been fair to at least make the obligatory link for computerised implants fully functional. As it stands, you need to figure out on your own that there is only one route to go, risk and utility-wise: wireless adapters turned off, full optional wire, all implants clustered into one node. Anyone who wants to hack your cyberware has to pass the comlink, which has access to the processing power of the implant cluster. Alphaware has a device rating of 4. Think about it: cybereyes, ears, datajack, skillwire, wired reflexes...

[Tarantula]

I think the idea of this new "feature" of DNI may be that all implants are susceptible to hacker attack, once the PAN of the user is connected to the matrix.

If that is considered a desireable change, what with all the discussion about opting out, it would have been fair to at least make the obligatory link for computerised implants fully functional. As it stands, you need to figure out on your own that there is only one route to go, risk and utility-wise: wireless adapters turned off, full optional wire, all implants clustered into one node. Anyone who wants to hack your cyberware has to pass the comlink, which has access to the processing power of the implant cluster. Alphaware has a device rating of 4. Think about it: cybereyes, ears, datajack, skillwire, wired reflexes...

Until someone tags you with some activators.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

I see, so basically, you can have them all linked via DNI if you want, but you don't have to.

Not quite - each implant has it's own DNI, and they can be linked without relying on DNI.
(Of course cou can hack the next implant using that link...)

Though, this means just because you have a datajack, it isn't automatically linked to all your cyberware either.

Per Unwired, a Datajack has a mythical forced link to any DNI implant.

[Ryu]

Until someone tags you with some activators.

Several k¥ for getting straight access to my implant cluster? You are not facing "three" Musketeers there. But if you are afraid of that, remove the wireless links instead of disabling them.

[Wasi]

Hi there,

my premiere posting on dumpshock, yay. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

I will soon start my first shadowrun game (as a gm) after many years of not playing at all or playing something else, and my first sr4 game ever. At the moment my players (2 of them completely new to SR, one familiar with the 2nd edition rules and one familiar with the 3rd edition, no one played the 4th yet) are digging through the corebook to build their characters, and one of them wants to roll a dronerigger. We where able to put most of the rules for him together, but there is one thing that kind of drives me mad, because i think the answer is right in front of me but i can not find it:

- Do you need to buy an autosoft ONCE and install it on every drone you want, or are they "one-use-only" and you do have to buy an additional autosoft for every drone.

(A source of the answer would be much appreciated)

Thank you

[Cadmus]

Depends, some autosofts are made for a certain type of drone, like an manuver autosoft for a roto drone won't realy work well on that steel lynx (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

granted the rest is up to you, for starters on a home game I would say, just make up a roll and have them crack teh soft ware and then copy and paste to your hearts delight, simply becouse the rules in unwired for programs degrading ect. realy suck for software heavy char's like riggers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[Ryu]

Hi there,

my premiere posting on dumpshock, yay. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

I will soon start my first shadowrun game (as a gm) after many years of not playing at all or playing something else, and my first sr4 game ever. At the moment my players (2 of them completely new to SR, one familiar with the 2nd edition rules and one familiar with the 3rd edition, no one played the 4th yet) are digging through the corebook to build their characters, and one of them wants to roll a dronerigger. We where able to put most of the rules for him together, but there is one thing that kind of drives me mad, because i think the answer is right in front of me but i can not find it:

- Do you need to buy an autosoft ONCE and install it on every drone you want, or are they "one-use-only" and you do have to buy an additional autosoft for every drone.

(A source of the answer would be much appreciated)

Thank you

Turn to the page on autosofts (German edition pg. 240). The headers tell you that Maneuver is per type of drone and Targeting per type of weapon. Be advised that you will later learn that Pilot is drone specific, too (Unwired pg. 52, no earlier hint besides logic).

Almost forgot: Welcome to DS! May your participation be long and fruitfull.

[Wasi]

Thank you (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Oenone]

Phew, glad I'm not the only new poster starting out with questions about how Unwired works!

I was just skim reading Unwired and was trying to work out how AI home systems would work when they're in something other than a commlink / nexus.

For example if the AI set up shop in (drone picked at random) a Bust-A-Move toy what Response, Signal, System, and Firewall attributes would it have? Do you just make something up on the fly?

Or would you just use the standard device ratings for a drone sized object using the rules from the BBB P214? (In which case how would you work if someone was running a rating six pilot program on the drone? As the drone now isn't able to actually run the pilot anymore.)

This is mostly from a GM'ing point of view, although with Runner Companions due out soon I guess it'll be important for if/when someone in my gaming group decides they want to play an AI evolved from a drone or something equally weird.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

BTW - given that as per Runner's Companion you can spoof not only whole lifestyles, but also parts:

What exactly keeps a hacker from using Hacking + Spoof to order other goods?
Or, even easier - trick upgrade servers into believing everything is fine with his pirated copies?

[Ryu]

In my game? Absolutely nothing.

[Jaid]

i assume that if the hacker can get into the database that says he's allowed to patch his attack-5 program, he can also just hack into the database and 'buy' a new attack-5 program. this isn't likely to be easy, by any means, but if the hacker can pull it off i suppose they would be able to update their programs free of charge.

as far as buying themselves new programs using the 'spoofing the lifestyle' rules? imo it doesn't work for some things... it *especially* doesn't work for buying hacking programs, because you are not spoofing joe blow's information, you are spoofing Uncle Sam's military special forces account (the hacking kind of special forces, at that) to get hacking programs... and *that* is what i like to call a Bad Idea™

imo, you can't spoof something that requires a license (ie has an 'R' in the availability line) unless you can spoof it as someone who has a license for that piece of gear. such people will likely be a little bit more cautious with their information, though not necessarily overly so; you could probably get most restricted items with a bit of extra time/research involved. you can't spoof something with an 'F' in the availability line unless you can spoof it as someone who can buy forbidden gear... which is mostly going to be militaries and corporate black ops, or in the case of hacking programs, corporate/military hackers... given that hackers are far more likely to protect their information than Joe Blow is, and given they probably aren't licensed to buy it so much as they are licensed to carry it (ie the company/government owns the software and buys it through a centralised person who is responsible for a corporate/goverment account rather than Bob the Hacker buying his own), this makes it hard to access those accounts, and it is far more dangerous to steal from the local Ares Firewatch team then it is to steal from Joe Blow.

so if you wanted to get a restricted handgun? yeah, you could probably spoof that. if you wanted to get a T-Bird? well, you're gonna have to find someone who can buy T-Birds already, and spoof yourself as them. and hope that they don't send a T-Bird to go blow you up. considering the budget that entity likely has, and the political clout, you may wish to invest in a hefty life insurance policy and start planning your funeral before you try.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

i assume that if the hacker can get into the database that says he's allowed to patch his attack-5 program, he can also just hack into the database and 'buy' a new attack-5 program. this isn't likely to be easy, by any means, but if the hacker can pull it off i suppose they would be able to update their programs free of charge.

Getting yourself free updates should be easier than getting yourself a free lifestyle. In fact, it's been suggested to incorporate update cost as a lifestyle add-on.

[Jaid]

Getting yourself free updates should be easier than getting yourself a free lifestyle. In fact, it's been suggested to incorporate update cost as a lifestyle add-on.

i didn't say anything about making it hard to get program updates. i just said you don't want to be spoofing it the same way you spoof a lifestyle. i am assuming that you are dealing with legitimate sources when you spoof to buy stuff, i admit, but really shadow sources are probably not going to be very happy about you leaving a data trail to their commlink, which means you can't spoof directly to them (if 500 people all have illegal transactions pointing to the same person, and that person is the guy you buy programs from, he's gonna be just a little bit mad at you i think). i suppose you could theoretically spoof a lifestyle and sell it (netting you 50% of the value of the lifestyle, except for the fact that when you sell it as a player you typically get around 20% of it's actual value... so for every high lifestyle you spoof for someone, you get 1k (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) probably, and start drawing a little bit more heat from lone star) but i tend to not see that as a good idea, because sooner or later something unpleasant is going to happen.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

i didn't say anything about making it hard to get program updates. i just said you don't want to be spoofing it the same way you spoof a lifestyle.

There is nothing else than 'Hacking + Spoof' to do so.

i am assuming that you are dealing with legitimate sources when you spoof to buy stuff

Going with that assumption - there are ton's of people out there that use exactly the same program legally that you got cracked.
On the other hand, the rules are not that specific/restictive - you just spoof things.

[Jaid]

Going with that assumption - there are ton's of people out there that use exactly the same program legally that you got cracked.
On the other hand, the rules are not that specific/restictive - you just spoof things.

yes, there are tons of those people. many of them probably are licensed to use them, but not to buy them (that is, a military hacker may have authorisation to carry and use a hacking program, but he probably doesn't have authorisation to buy them for personal use, he probably has to requisition them from the quartermaster or be issued them.).

and those who are able to buy those forbidden items are not going to be like the random idiots you're stealing from. it is one thing to commity identity theft on joe wageslave, who's resources to do something about it consist of reporting it to lone star (or their local corpsec forces, or whoever). if you are stealing from someone who has legitimate authorisation to use hacking programs, odds are good you are dealing with an organisation (not a person) and that said organisation will not much appreciate you stealing from them. whereas you might be able to easily find 20 people that you can charge 1 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) each to, and not attract much attention to yourself when you're paying your MSP bill, it's a bit harder to find dozens or hundreds of organisations you can spoof your purchases as coming from when you want to buy a hacking program. and those dozens or hundreds of organisations probably have times where their employees occasionally have nothing better to do than spend 20 minutes with their hackers tracking you down and doing extremely unpleasant things to you.

i'm not saying it's impossible, i am just saying i don't think buying forbidden items using the spoofing lifestyles rules should not be abstracted. if someone wants to steal from the UCAS military or something like that, they can do it, but you don't just turn it into an extended test, because it's not like normal spoofing the lifestyle rules where you're basically just looking for a bunch of random people with limited resources to strike back at you with to steal from. in the case of spoofing a lifestyle, you're hacking a bunch of nodes which probably can't do anything more threatening than shutting down. in the case of spoofing your way into getting a rating 6 stealth program, you're probably looking at hacking systems that have defensive IC, maybe even some patrolling spiders, and so forth, and it isn't just risk-free hacking. the whole point for the spoofing lifestyle rules is that it's designed to abstract away something that is quite frankly very boring and would otherwise just uselessly take up time that could be otherwise dedicated to actually enjoying the game. that works for buying a package of jumbo-sized soydogs, because everyone is authorised to buy those. it doesn't work for buying forbidden gear, because you have to spoof yourself as being someone who is legitimately able to buy forbidden gear, and those people likely have defenses against identity theft in place.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

yes, there are tons of those people. many of them probably are licensed to use them, but not to buy them (that is, a military hacker may have authorisation to carry and use a hacking program, but he probably doesn't have authorisation to buy them for personal use, he probably has to requisition them from the quartermaster or be issued them.).

But hardly for update.

if you are stealing from someone who has legitimate authorisation to use hacking programs, odds are good you are dealing with an organisation (not a person) and that said organisation will not much appreciate you stealing from them.

Just that you aren't stealing from them - updates are free to legimate users.

i'm not saying it's impossible, i am just saying i don't think buying forbidden items using the spoofing lifestyles rules should not be abstracted. if someone wants to steal from the UCAS military or something like that, they can do it, but you don't just turn it into an extended test, because it's not like normal spoofing the lifestyle rules where you're basically just looking for a bunch of random people with limited resources to strike back at you with to steal from.

Honestly, once you manage to spoof luxury lifestyles, that changes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Jaid]

as i read it, that wouldn't work. before it patches anything, it will check if the program has it's copy protection intact. if it's intact, you don't need to spoof anyone, because you are also getting free patching. if it isn't intact, it won't patch it and will probably mark that account as having invalidated it's free patching, assuming you can even fool the patching service into thinking your program is the one the organisation you're spoofing yourself as has (it stands to reason that each program has a digital equivalent of a serial code. you could probably fake it if you had the serial code of a legitimate program from the organisation i suppose, but you'd still have the problem that your copy still shows up to the patcher as being an illegal cracked copy, and it won't update your program but *will* flag that account as having cracked a program and therefore invalidated their agreement. see above about the organisation you steal from being ticked off, tracking you down, and doing unpleasant things to you).

[Rotbart van Dain...]

as i read it, that wouldn't work. before it patches anything, it will check if the program has it's copy protection intact.

..a check which you could use Spoof to make it look intact. That's my whole point.

[Jaid]

..a check which you could use Spoof to make it look intact. That's my whole point.

what are you spoofing to make the service accept it as intact? there isn't anyone around who is authorised to make the patcher patch an illegal cracked copy of the company's software, so you can't be possibly spoofing the access ID of someone who's authorised to do that. you can't spoof the program to make it look like it's not cracked either. that isn't what spoof does. spoof disguises orders as having come from a different user. it doesn't change what programs look like. you don't roll hacking + spoof to change the image in a camera, unless there is already an authorised user who has authority to make the camera show nothing interesting happening. now you could probably spoof an order for the camera to shut down for maintenance, provided you happen to know the access ID of someone who has authority to order the camera to shut down for maintenance.

in short, if you want to make the patching service patch your illegal cracked program, you're going to have to hack into the node of the company that sells the program and install some kind of virus, and hope that they don't find it. and i'm not convinced hacking those nodes is going to be trivial enough to abstract away in the same manner as spoofing a lifestyle is.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

what are you spoofing to make the service accept it as intact?

The copy protection responce, to look like it's still intact. Like I said, that's the whole point.
The SR4 Matrix has no secure identification short of passkeys - and those are explicitly only used for protecting Rating 7 programs.

there isn't anyone around who is authorised to make the patcher patch an illegal cracked copy of the company's software, so you can't be possibly spoofing the access ID of someone who's authorised to do that.

No need to do that - Spoof can do more than stealing Access IDs.

it doesn't change what programs look like.

In fact it can - that's what Spoofing Protection is all about.

[Jaid]

spoofing protection is all about changing your access ID to be one of an already existing set of IDs that a program is limited against attacking. it doesn't say anything about making a cracked program look like anything other than a cracked program.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

spoofing protection is all about changing your access ID

No. Changing your Access ID with Spoof will disconnect you from all Nodes - that's on the same page.

it doesn't say anything about making a cracked program look like anything other than a cracked program.

In fact, Spoof can change apperances, without aquiring any Access ID at all:

To do this, the hacker must be aware that the program has that specific option, via an appropriate Matrix Perception Test.
He can then attempt to spoof his persona so that it appears to be something it’s not.