Upgraded Character Generator, Updated Generator Based on work from Autarkis and Blakkie Options

[Whizbang]

I recently had a problem where under the vehicle tabs, it was only counting the nuyen for the drone in the first box.

[Dakka Dakka]

I just noticed that the shock gloves (SR4A p. 315, SR4 p. 306) are missing in the melee weapon section.

[DamienKnight]

I recently had a problem where under the vehicle tabs, it was only counting the nuyen for the drone in the first box.

Not sure about this one. The copy I am working on does not have this problem, so either I have already fixed it, or it is just not having this problem for me.

I just noticed that the shock gloves (SR4A p. 315, SR4 p. 306) are missing in the melee weapon section.

Thanks, added these to melee weapons in version 1b.

[Tachi]

Any idea of an approximate date of 1b delivery?

How is the multi-arm thing going? Saw your thread on the other forums, I got curious, thought I'd ask.

[cndblank]

Speaking of arms, how do you buy a full Modular Arm?

You can get a modular hand or lower arm but I don't see how to get a full Modular Arm (obvious or synthetic)

And thanks for all your hard work.

This is a wonderful aid.

[Phoenix (A-Team)]

Hey DK,

I was wondering if we'd see more of the armored clothing choices in the next CG edition. I have a character that wants to purchase some Moonsilver line dresses and accessories. Maybe even the Second Skin Line (good time to wish the charisma 8 elf maiden in the group were coming to the party!)

The Zoe Heritage line seems a tough one to orchestrate, seeing as there are so many types available (not listed because they design so many custom variants) and yet some shadowrunners are likely to spend the cred to look good. Maybe a box that allows the user to unlock one row on the clothing section to add a customized piece of armor/clothing to their gear? After all, I know there are some things that even the books don't list that I like to remind myself that I have (ski-masks, a few sets of clothing I wear around the apartment when I'm not running the shadows... etc.)

[Mordinvan]

I'm curious if it would be possible to add an option to the karma gen system so stat costs are calculated before racial modifiers as opposed to after? Or if this is already in does anyone know how to turn it on?

[DamienKnight]

I'm curious if it would be possible to add an option to the karma gen system so stat costs are calculated before racial modifiers as opposed to after? Or if this is already in does anyone know how to turn it on?

Nope. The karma system is intended to be used with post-racial-mod costs. If there are enough askers, I will consider adding a house-rule switch for it.

If you are wanting to create more powerful characters, think about setting the rule for higher attribute costs to FALSE. This will change it to 3 karma x new rating instead of 5. 5 karma per rating is the errata price, and makes characters a bit closer in power to the BP system, but if you want to start as a Heroic runner...

I was wondering if we'd see more of the armored clothing choices in the next CG edition.

After all, I know there are some things that even the books don't list that I like to remind myself that I have (ski-masks, a few sets of clothing I wear around the apartment when I'm not running the shadows... etc.)

If there is a specific piece I am missing, please refer me to the book and page so I can add it in.

Or are you asking for more room on the Gear tab for armor options?

As for ski masks, random clothing etc., I suggest using the Custom Gear section at the bottom of the Gear page. Its hard to miss... its all blue, indicating the values must be chosen by you. Put 'Ski Mask' in the gear, and put '5' in the cost if you like. It should show up with your gear on the Charsheet.

Now you make a strong point about outfits! I am not sure if this is what you are talking about, but what about this:

A column in gear where you can enter in custom text (basically the name of the outfit), working very similarly to cyberware suites. Then the Charsheet will not display individual items if they are part of an outfit, but instead display their total armor value.

This could be neat for stacking helmet and pants with a vest and coat etc.

I think I would also have to include a house rule for using 3rd edition armor stacking rules. 4th seems kinda like they just didnt wanna mess with it, so they said 'NO ARMOR STACKING! Oh... except for this one, oh, and that one...' bleh.

Speaking of arms, how do you buy a full Modular Arm?

No idea. The books do not provide for it. Start a discussion in the discussion forum, and when the community comes up with some reasonable rules, link the thread here and I will see about adding it into the sheet.

Any idea of an approximate date of 1b delivery?

How is the multi-arm thing going? Saw your thread on the other forums, I got curious, thought I'd ask.

Sorry about the wait. I was out of town... then my son got sick, then I got sick...

I would like to release 1b very soon. Maybe this week.

After the response I got in the discussion forums about having Shiva cyber arms, I basically realized that only a very RARE character would ever make use of them, since the essence cost is SO high, that it does not seem like the payoff (usability for 1 or two people) would not be worth the effort. Maybe someday I will get in the mood to play a Cyber shiva and do the work...

[Phoenix (A-Team)]

Arsenal. pg 47 has all of the following...

Zoé, maker of fine clothing and HIGH fashion.

Executive Suite Line:

• Long Jacket* (4/1); availability 9; cost 1,000¥
• Short Jacket* (3/1); availability 9; cost 750¥
• Plain Blouse/Shirt (1/0); availability 9; cost 400¥
• Skirt/Trousers (1/1); availability 9; cost 550¥

Heritage Line:

• Pueblo (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Navajo (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Salish (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Spanish Courtesan (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Italian Renaissance (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Fifteenth-century French Royal Court (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Hanseatic trader (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Russian Cossack (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Confederate Aristocrat (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Indian Maharajah (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Aztec (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Mayan (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Imperial Rome (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Feudal Japanese (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Traditional Chinese (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Nubian (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Victorian-era Colonial Gentleman (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Scottish Highlander (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥
• Traditional Tir (?/?); availability 14; cost 10,000+ ¥

All of the above range in armor from 2-6/1-4
If anybody knows what each of them is, or would like to once and for all make canon what their armors and official prices should be, I'd be interested to know.

Moonsilver Line:

• Evening Gown* (4/1); availability 10; cost 7,500¥
• Cocktail Dress* (3/1); availability 10; cost 5,000¥
• Shawl (1/0); availability 10; cost 500¥
• Scarf (1/0); availability 10; cost 500¥
• Stole (1/0); availability 10; cost 500¥
• Latest Fashion of Accessories; cost +500¥ to the original cost

Second Skin Line:

• Bodysuit* (4/1); availability 12; cost 5,000¥
• Bodysuit w/ Ruthenium Polymers* (4/1); availability 12; cost 6,000¥

*While most items can be mixed and matched, you cannot pair up two items tagged with asterisks. It is my understanding that no two Heritage Line outfits can be worn at once either, though small accessories (and perhaps helmets... though this may diminish the fashion statement of said outfit) can be added.

[Phoenix (A-Team)]

A column in gear where you can enter in custom text (basically the name of the outfit), working very similarly to cyberware suites. Then the Charsheet will not display individual items if they are part of an outfit, but instead display their total armor value.

This could be neat for stacking helmet and pants with a vest and coat etc.

That's be pretty cool. Could make up my "standard clothing/running gear" list. BTW, thank you for pointing out the custom gear section to a guy who never scrolls down far enough :chuckle: I appreciate it.

I think I would also have to include a house rule for using 3rd edition armor stacking rules. 4th seems kinda like they just didnt wanna mess with it, so they said 'NO ARMOR STACKING! Oh... except for this one, oh, and that one...' bleh.

Hehe, yeah I think they saw some of the scary numbers resulting from stack-abuse in 3rd ed. I kinda agree with their choice to trim it down, although it means a low bodied magician's definitely not gonna be wearing layers. Though... I don't see how wearing three bulletproof blankets over a longcoat only gives you the protective ballistic value of the longcoat or just one of the blankets. Movement and action modifiers yeah I can understand that— but man. Scratchin' my head on that one.

[Tachi]

After the response I got in the discussion forums about having Shiva cyber arms, I basically realized that only a very RARE character would ever make use of them, since the essence cost is SO high, that it does not seem like the payoff (usability for 1 or two people) would not be worth the effort. Maybe someday I will get in the mood to play a Cyber shiva and do the work...

Yeah, I kinda figured that would happen. It's cool. The player I mentioned before hasn't created a nartaki with cyber arms at CharGen, though he would usually get the Biocampatibility (Cyber) quality then make them later with beta (or in one case delta) grade parts after some Adapsin, otherwise it's just to much essence loss.

Like I said, it's cool, I wasn't sure how much work it would actually take, and if it's a problem there is no point wasting your time on specialty stuff when there are so many more normal entries to add (^^like that big list o' stuff two posts up^^) for regular gear and options.

[Ayeohx]

First, I love this program! Thanks to all contributors; this tool rocks.


We ran into a few issues so far:

• Auto-Injectors appear to be missing.
• Cyberparts do not appear to have an option for Suites.
• Slap patches are not giving a correct cost. I fixed this on my sheet by going to the Gear_Data sheet and taking the quotes (') out of the cost.
• Antidote should have a 1 -6 rating.
• The "Weapon Accessories" option should be taken out. I took the workbook apart before I learned that everything was moved to "Firearm Accessories". Oops. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Once again I am incredibly impressed!

[Phoenix (A-Team)]

Found a problem, and I am wondering if I just don't have a correct errata:

Making a cybersam, I did lots of research in the books and found that their rules aren't matching up with the character generator in the Cyberparts section.

p. 44, Augmentation:

Customized cyberlimbs come with Body, Strength, and Agility attributes that may exceed the standard cyberlimb attribute rating of 3. Each customized cyberlimb may have a starting Body, Strength, and Agility attribute of up to the character’s natural attribute maximum (see pp. 62 and 73, SR4). Each point of increment to an attribute above 3 raises the limb’s Availability rating by 1 point and adds 1,500¥ to the final cost, but does not take up any Capacity. Further increases above the natural attribute maximum and up to the augmented maximum must be handled as cyberlimb enhancements, with the standard Capacity and nuyen costs (see Cyberlimb Enhancements, p. 335, SR4).

However I found that the CG wants to charge Capacity slots for anything beyond the normal attribute rating of 3. As I read the above section, I take it to mean that one may upgrade their cyberlimb body/agility/strength from 4 up to 6 without having to sacrifice Capacity slots. Then if they wish to upgrade from 7 to 9 they must spend Capacity on it. Is this a correct interpretation?

If so, then the generator needs to understand the math involved.

P.S. Hope you and your family are feeling better! I am on the mend from a pretty nasty cold too, there's something bad going around right now.

[DamienKnight]

Found a problem, and I am wondering if I just don't have a correct errata:

Making a cybersam, I did lots of research in the books and found that their rules aren't matching up with the character generator in the Cyberparts section.

p. 44, Augmentation:



However I found that the CG wants to charge Capacity slots for anything beyond the normal attribute rating of 3. As I read the above section, I take it to mean that one may upgrade their cyberlimb body/agility/strength from 4 up to 6 without having to sacrifice Capacity slots. Then if they wish to upgrade from 7 to 9 they must spend Capacity on it. Is this a correct interpretation?

If so, then the generator needs to understand the math involved.

P.S. Hope you and your family are feeling better! I am on the mend from a pretty nasty cold too, there's something bad going around right now.

Customized Cyberlimb Attributes and Cyberlimb Enhancements are two very different things.

Customized costs 1500 per rating, and cannot exceed your racial limit, and cost no capacity.
Enhancements are MUCH cheaper, but cost capacity and CAN exceed your racial limit, up to your Racial MODIFIED limit.

IE. A human could increase their limbs attributes to 9 in two different ways:

Customized limb 3 points = 4500 cost, no capacity cost
Strength Upgrade 3 points = 600 cost, 3 capacity

OR.

Strength Upgrade 6 = 600, 6 capacity, MUST have cybertorso.

Customized limbs are alot more expensive, but their upgrade takes no capacity, and cannot go above racial limit (6 for humans).

Normal Upgrade is cheap, takes capacity, and can possibly go above your racial limit up to your Modified Racial Limit (9 for humans).

If you have a torso and dont plan on having alot of other upgrades in your limbs, its cheaper to just use standard strength upgrades. If you want to save capacity, it is going to cost you!

[Phoenix (A-Team)]

Aha, thank you.

Does the 1,500¥ get modified when a cyberlimb becomes Alphaware or greater? Man that'd suck price-wise

Hmm... upon reviewing the generator, I'd take that as a wallet-thinning "yes" ...dang.

BTW, I haven't found rules on it either way, but do Wired Reflexes and Move-By-Wire have reduced essence cost for metahumans with cyberlimbs up the wazzu? I recall 3rd edition taking off a percentage of the essence cost since there was no meat to take essence from with some of the equipment. The new rules regarding cyberlimbs seem to skirt around that subject without approaching it.

[SpellBinder]

It would seem to make sense, in a fashion, that Wired Reflexes, Move-By-Wire, and even Skill Wires would have a reduced essence or factored essence along with a capacity cost for those with cyberlimbs.

I also flipped through my old 3rd Ed Man & Machine and core book, and did find a note about certain bodyware implants (cyber & bioware) that got a reduction on essence cost based on the number of replaced limbs (5% per partial, 10% per full limb), but the Move-By-Wire was not listed among them. Man & Machine, page 32; listed items are Bone Lacing, Dermal Armor, Dermal Sheaths, Muscle Augmentation, Muscle Replacement, and Orthoskin.

I would think that there will not be an essence cost reduction for Move-By-Wire and the sort, based on it reflecting extra reinforcement necessary to the meat body to handle the stress of boosted cyberware. Likely, actually, an increased essence cost for SURGE characters with extra arms and/or a tail (maybe even if said tail is vestigial) due to the extra meat from those extra limbs. I think rules like this have been intentionally left out to help make the math easier.

Don't know if there's a discussion thread for something like this, but I think anything further should be done in a new thread.

[DamienKnight]

It would seem to make sense, in a fashion, that Wired Reflexes, Move-By-Wire, and even Skill Wires would have a reduced essence or factored essence along with a capacity cost for those with cyberlimbs.

I also flipped through my old 3rd Ed Man & Machine and core book, and did find a note about certain bodyware implants (cyber & bioware) that got a reduction on essence cost based on the number of replaced limbs (5% per partial, 10% per full limb), but the Move-By-Wire was not listed among them. Man & Machine, page 32; listed items are Bone Lacing, Dermal Armor, Dermal Sheaths, Muscle Augmentation, Muscle Replacement, and Orthoskin.

I would think that there will not be an essence cost reduction for Move-By-Wire and the sort, based on it reflecting extra reinforcement necessary to the meat body to handle the stress of boosted cyberware. Likely, actually, an increased essence cost for SURGE characters with extra arms and/or a tail (maybe even if said tail is vestigial) due to the extra meat from those extra limbs. I think rules like this have been intentionally left out to help make the math easier.

Don't know if there's a discussion thread for something like this, but I think anything further should be done in a new thread.

It is interesting that you mentioned this, as this is a new feature in the next sheet. I had not realized the books addressed it at all, and had made some extreme houserule available (essence cost factored directly by real limbs/total limbs). This was an extreme houserule, and I will probably reprogram the sheet to use the Books rule of 5 to 10% per limb.\

Edit: Ok, finished revision. Discount (when Houserule is applied to the sheet) is 10% per full limb, 5% per partial limb, 2.5% for a hand or Foot, and 10% per Torso or Head replacement.

In the Wares_Data sheet I added a 27th column of booleans called 'Whole Body'. If marked true, the sheet will apply limb discounts to that ware.

I did NOT include wired/move-by-wire etc to the discounts. Here is my opinion: A cyberlimb moves with a reaction/init passes as fast as the whole, and does not dampen your speed. So long as you are getting all the benefits of the speed, I am not a fan of giving price discounts. If you disagree with this, I recommend posting a thread in the main Shadowrun Discussion forum, and linking it here.

I was very excited to include this option. As a GM I see too many magic characters, and am a FAN of any reasonable houserule that lets cyber characters get a leg up (or a leg out of the price, har har:)

[Sengir]

A couple of things I noticed when toying around with a TM build:

- Matrix initiative should be intuition*2 + 1, not min{intuition;resonance}*2 +1...the "can't exeed resonance" should only apply to response, system etc.
- Natural Hardening quality has no effect
- The charsheet does not display the Living Persona's stats, or am I missing an option?


But great work besides those minor flaws (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

[Radical-B]

Could you add the Auto-Injector from Augmentation to the cyberware section?

[WhiteReaper]

is there a way to activate the Metagenetic Qualities without changling quality?

[Dakka Dakka]

not for all custom guns the CharSheet shows the number of times a cerain setup has been bought.

[cndblank]

Could you add the Auto-Injector from Augmentation to the cyberware section?

Remember that they can be added to a cyberlimb and cost zero capacity.

[DamienKnight]

is there a way to activate the Metagenetic Qualities without changling quality?

Check the cell comments in the optional rules area. There is a rule that can be set to 'TRUE' to allow metavarients to select metagenetic w/out surge. Otherwise, you can select surge, then select all metagenetic qualities you desire, then remove surge if your dm allows it.

[Cthulhudreams]

It would be nice to have checkboxes to enable some of the more common house rules (I'm specifically thinking Franktrollman's stuff that was in the orginal .xls

[WhiteReaper]

for technomancer the custome complex from boxes are protected