Drones and proximity, How close do riggers have to be to their drones? Options

[Kurrel]

I've been running a game for a month or two now, with everyone adjusting to the game.

However, a new player has brought some interesting challenges to the table by electing to play a rigger. This person has played before and is something of a rules enthusiast. This has, in many cases, been helpful with a few issues we had before (damage of spells, notably).

However, in trying to master the rigging concept we've started to butt heads over how far away the rigger must be in order to jump in and / or issue commands to his drones.

The rigger drives by in a van, drops off drones and then simply goes away. Usually far away. In reading I figured that they had to be withing signal rating but the player countered that drones are controlled through the net. In further reading, I figured out that they are then devices and the proximity rule still applied. Being told "That's absurd, they can be controlled from anywhere." was not the best way to get an answer. Now, the insistence is that "Where in the rules does it say that?"

I'm more of a roleplay-master than technicali. The rules regarding Rigging seem very distributed and linking each rule in a coherent argument is beyond my current familiarity with the relevant section or sections.

In essence I'm hoping someone here can give me a clear proof, one way or the other, as to where a rigger must be to control drones. If anyone can give me a step by step proof, or even just where to find each relevant rule, I'd be very happy!

Personally, I don't much like the rigger having to be anywhere they please... they might as well stay home and why don't all runs get done this way?

[streetangelj]

They have to be within Signal rating, but the wireless matrix makes that range practically unlimited

However there are easy ways around the "rigger in a bunker" problem. If he travels beyond the signal rating of his own commlink (and repeater if he has one) then he's hotsimming his signal through public nodes (which is ILLEGAL) that can be slowed down by "traffic" or SPAM, monitored by people he doesn't want to know what he's doing (like cops and mob hackers who like blackmailing shadowrunners), or could just fail due to technical reasons (brown-outs, rationing, shoddy maitenance, etc.). Worse yet, his signal could be completely lost due to an intervening Matrix dead zone or could be hijacked by others (shadowrunners, Matrix gangs) and his drones used for something other than he planned or stolen entirely. Also, a shutdown (triggered by someone else) in any of the nodes he is "surfing" would immediately dump him leaving the drones on their own (hope they have good pilot ratings).

[DWC]

Technically, all those problems you've suggested also apply to every hacker in the game. As long as the drone is within its' Signal range of anything connected to the matrix, the rigger can run the drones with no penalties. The hacking rules are scattered and confusing, but drone hackers really are that good.

Intercepting his wireless traffic means knowing exactly where his traffic is being routed, which can't be done given the meshed nature of the matrix. The vulnerability comes from spotting the rigger's persona when he's jumped into a drone, running a trace back to his meat body to get his Access ID, cracking his signal encryption, and spoofing fake commands from his commlink to the drone to do things like crash, fly straight up until they leave signal range, or just turn themselves off.

Or you can hack the drone on the fly and attack the jumped in rigger's persona in cybercombat, where he's probably extremely vulnerable.

Edit:
If the rigger is really paranoid, he can put a satellite link on all his drones, and run them through low earth orbit satellites from anywhere in the world, with no bandwidth limitations, and no issues with physical matrix infrastructure at ground level.

[DocTaotsu]

Two words:

Area jammer

Directional jammers as well but nothing says "Your drones are on auto pilot" like having security kick off a rating 6 (very reasonably priced) area jammer (or better yet a smart jammer so their own riggers can keep working).

I'm fairly certain jammers work against satcom links so they'll be none of that madness either. The only way to compensate for frequent jamming is to be close enough to pound your way through jamming with some good EW rolls.

So sure, he can drop his drones and drive to Mars to run them but if he wants to actually do anything interesting with them, he'll have to stick around to keep someone from turning on a 500 nuyen jammer and kicking the shit out of his drones. It's the same reason hackers actually have to run with the team now. It's all well and good to be stuffed into a coffin hotel somewhere, running your team from orbit but the minute they step into a room with wi-fi inhibiting paint, they might as well be on the moon. Actually, the wi-fi paint thing works against drones as well (if I recall). If he's pushing some drones behind the team and they step into one of these wi-fi blind spots... he's boned. A wiley security spider rigger will probably set these places up specifically so he can try and hack enemy drones while their distant rigger scrambles to figure out what the hell just happened.

One other thing though I'm not sure if it's canon or not. The Matrix and wireless and distributed but that doesn't mean it's like driving around looking for free wi-fi. Out on the street there are plenty of public nodes he can exploit to run his drones through but on a run all those nodes inside R&D are going to be private. Unless he wants to run all the drones through his teams commlink (because that's not a weak link or anything) he'll have to hack those private nodes so he can use them to carry his signal further into the complex.

Do let him know about jammers before you drop them on him, sounds like you're both new to the rules.

[Kurrel]

Thank you for the input. It does make a lot more sense filtered through more experience.

I'll be sure to warn beforehand, possibly via Legwork, but I'll definitely be using these.

[hobgoblin]

hmm, it just dawned on me, wi-fi inhibiting curtains that drop into place over windows and similar the moment some alarm goes off.

so everything is looking just fine until someone trips something and the building turns into a matrix black hole.

[Jaid]

it is worth noting that satellite links on the drones combined with ECCM will pretty much ignore most jamming and wifi inhibiting materials. with rating 5 ECCM (not too improbable imo) you're looking at an effective signal rating of 13 for jamming purposes. which requires rating 13 wifi-inhibiting material or jammers to cut off.

but in any case, yes you can pretty much operate your drones through the matrix, provided the matrix reaches to where the drones are. in most corp facilities, that will not be the case; wifi-inhibiting walls up to about rating 4 (at least, for the kind of building shadowrunners should be trying to get into) should be more or less the standard. now your rigger can still be fairly far away, even with 'only' rating 5 signal, but if he wants to take those drones inside a building, especially a high-security building, he's going to need to be prepared for a physical insertion.

[Kurrel]

I've given them small time stuff, so far. Jobs where there isn't a mage or spider on site, where the defences are minimal. They've started working for a crime group against another but it's to expand quickly into something big and nasty with overtones of city warfare, magical omens and all that.

Can magic interfere with communications, come to think of it?

[Cain]

Can magic interfere with communications, come to think of it?

The Chaff spell might do it; but even if not, there's no reason why you couldn't create a custom spell to scramble communications by causing an EMP.

[Fortune]

I believe that the Pulse spell causes an EMP burst.

[Cain]

Just looked it up. Pulse specifically says it "will also disrupt wireless reception and radio communication for a brief instant." So, that would definitely work to scramble communications, if only for a moment.

[Starmage21]

Just looked it up. Pulse specifically says it "will also disrupt wireless reception and radio communication for a brief instant." So, that would definitely work to scramble communications, if only for a moment.

That disruption will make hacker/rigger/everyone else spend actions to reconnect. Its effing brilliant.

[Zaranthan]

That disruption will make hacker/rigger/everyone else spend actions to reconnect. Its effing brilliant.

It's an instantaneous spell that halts wireless communication. It doesn't scramble everybody's access IDs, so I don't see how it could wipe everyone's subscription lists. The spell's effect would be identical to a couple lost packets, and any transmission protocol that can't handle a few stray bits & bytes certainly can't support the mesh network that defines SR4's Matrix.

At best, I'd say everyone's AR goes blank and all devices within range are in spaghetti mode (no wireless signal) until their (or their owner's) next initiative pass.

[Neraph]

Not if you target the drones with Pulse.

[Ravor]

Personally I figure that wi-fi paint would be relatively common in the Sixth World, but as it has been pointed out, a high enough signal will blow right through it. Still, a sustained version of Pulse is useful enough I can see the formula being researched.

[knasser]

That disruption will make hacker/rigger/everyone else spend actions to reconnect. Its effing brilliant.

Not to mention the dumpshock for those who are hot-simming (e.g. that rigger of yours).

But while there are numerous ways to require a hacker or rigger to attend, there's also the nasty threat of what happens to them if they're tracked down when they're all alone away from the party. Okay, you can probably pull it once before the rigger surrounds herself with Steel Lynxes everytime she rigs, but it's a nasty surprise when all the muscle is an hour's drive away. Tracker IC is your friend.

[JudgementLoaf]

Has anyone ever tried loading a supersquirt or paintball gun with wireless inhibitor paint and then spamming them at drones? I dont think it would work, but if you got a good coating on a minidrone or a microdrone it could be really funny.

[Ravor]

Why not just spray them with lead?

[hobgoblin]

more noise...

[damaleon]

I see no reason that you can't log onto a public node and controlling the drones from there, as long as the drone is within both its signal rating and the node's signal rating. If it's going to pass beyond either, you have to find a new node to connect through, as the data connection is no longer two way. A precaution to take would be to subscribe to 3 or 4 nodes (the drone as well), allowing commands to be sent from different or simultaneous points.

Another way of control; if the drones are supporting meat runners, buy a second commlink and have the runners carry it. Subscribe to it, and slave the drones there. Once you connect to it you can control them. This also lets you have a low signal rating on the drones to keep them from being hacked/spoofed (anyone trying to take it has to be within the drone's signal rating). You also can control the firewall level (likely raising it to 6), so when someone detects where the drones are getting there instructions from, they've got to hack in or (likely) break the encryption before being able to spoof.

Don't forget that jammers can reach rating 10 (for a pittance of 5,000 nuyen, 500 for a one-shot jammer) and that a satlink, according to SR4 p.318, is only rating 8. Once that is within 15 meters of the drones, they are cut off.

Also, a faraday cage blocks all wireless signals. Cover a drone completely with a tight enough metal netting or sheet (it's got to be fairly tight, enough that a net launcher version would be practically useless) and it will stop incoming connections, though it could cut/drive/shoot its way out. The added benefit to this is when the rigger is "jumped in", as they will immediately loose the connection (suffering dumpshock). You could even work it into the walls, so when security shutters drop and the door closes, it completes the cage.

[DocTaotsu]

Hehe... lead sprayers...

I suddenly have this image of corpsec carrying wi-fi curtains and trying to chase down a riggers drone like an errant dog...

[Tachi]

Hehe... lead sprayers...

I suddenly have this image of corpsec carrying wi-fi curtains and trying to chase down a riggers drone like an errant dog...

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

Talk about a humiliating day at work.
"What'd you do at work today, Honey?"
"I spent 3 hours chasing a drone, then spent another 5 hours trying to figure out how he out-smarted me."

[hobgoblin]

make it the corps own biodrone and it may make a bit more sense (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Mordinvan]

Which is why you get one of those micro spider drones to work wires, and retransmitters into the buildings air vents before you go on the run. To allow you a signal in, even when they drop the shutters.

[Ravor]

What ever happened to simply blowing a rather large hole in the wall with high explosives? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif)