Best Mage Spells and Why, Finding the bests spells for the Versitile Mage Options

[Earlydawn]

What ever happened to the errata that was coming down the pipe that would make mana static a slow ramp-up AoE instead of an instant spirit killer?

[Tarantula]

No clue. Maybe they decided the drain was appropriate to balance the effect. Maybe they'll define permanent spells to take effect at the end of their sustained duration instead of at the start.

[Neraph]

Combat Sense > Armor.

[AllTheNothing]

Sorry, it does stack, but only if you do first aid first.

I like it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Only if you're in the area of effect. And since you get to choose where that area is, chances are, no problem.

Yeah you could be right!

I'd say no on this. As fashion says, it doesn't change the protectiveness, just cut, color, pattern and fit. So that also means it can't change the material. Your flats might look like they are a custom tailored armani suit, but they still feel like flats.

I think flats are water-resistant and warm (which could translate in rating 2 chemical protection seeing the Greatcoat in Arsenal) being intended to be used to avoid that acid rain eates your good clothes, they are probably confortable too if gangers use them adding gang colors (don't remeber exactly where I've read it, I think it was seattle chapter of runner havens and sprawl survival guide). Turning them in chic clothes may be an exageration but turning them in good clothes that sell for about 50-100 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) is possible, think an elegant suit that is warm and water resistant that looks worth 1000 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) (when you reach high life-styles thing start becoming expensive) for 100 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) , not the real thing but grant a good first impression with little expenditure (think tailoring them to orks and trolls, nobody expectes them to wear Zoé clothes, and probably their wages are not the best, probably they would be willing to save the money to buy some clothes that fly in the face to the stereotype of the unrefined and somewhat brutish people. Ironicaly you might have problems with having to pay taxes for your profits.

Except with that whole, paid for with essence = part of him, and fix can only do non-living materials. In addition, it can only fix stuff weighing less than force x hits in KGs. So, force 6 with 6 hits is 36kgs, or almost 80 lbs.

Wait a second if it's part of him can be fixed with heal spell, if not fix should do. Well, this is my point of view.

[AllTheNothing]

Combat Sense > Armor.

Based on the same not-being-hit-is-better-than-resisting-damage-filosofy I think Deflection is nice too.

[Mr. Unpronouncea...]

I lolled

Also I agree, if another player can do it with their ares alpha or their drone than what's the point. Heal, and Fix are good. Turn to goo has been a personal favorite for my players. When the group mage stole a Corptech and tried to intimidate him by taking one of his stolen buddies, turning him into goo and than putting him in a number of emptied out beer bottles; which than finally went into the freezer. Well that guy spilled his guts like a recently spliced fish.

Turn to Goo description states that damage infliced to the goo translates to the subject of the spell, wouldn't that trip in the freezer kill the subject due frostbite?

Shouldn't think so - damage from frostbite is from lack of circulation...which a gelatin statue isn't going to have anyway.

OTOH, by SR4's rules, separating the guy into multiple containers is certainly going to kill him, goo or not. And quite a pain to do, too - the goo has a fairly high barrier rating.

[pbangarth]

Wait a second if it's part of him can be fixed with heal spell, if not fix should do. Well, this is my point of view.

Seems logical to me.

Peter

[Tarantula]

Well, considering heal says it removes boxes of damage, and any cyberware wear/tear damage stuff wouldn't be represented by boxes of damage, then I'd say heal doesn't work.

[Cthulhudreams]

I would never take fashion in any world in which I didn't already have Physical Mask.

Being able to change my clothes vs being able to walk through a metal detector in a high security environment while carrying a heavy machine gun while changing my clothes?

Yeah.

[Muspellsheimr]

Physical Mask doesn't do shit to MAD's. It is also limited to the same basic size & shape of the subject, so a HMG is very much pushing it.

[Tarantula]

Actually, it does. Since it changes all physical properties tangible via senses (it is multi-sense) and since it is a physical spell, you can make your heavy machine gun seem to be a bouquet of roses. And it won't register as metal if the spells hits exceed the detectors object resistance threshold.

[Kingboy]

Fashion and Makeover, because Style is everything. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Certainly favorites for my Mystic Adept Face (along with the Facial Sculpt, Melanin Control and Voice Control adept powers). If he weren't Aspected to Manipulation spells, he'd certainly be down with Healthy Glow as well, if only for style points.

Doesn't anybody talk to things they meet on a run??

How about Translate, so you can talk/con/negotiate with anybody on Earth, spirits, AIs. weird things 'out there'?

Hmm, somehow never noticed that one before, but then again I haven't looked at much in the Street Magic grimoire that wasn't Manipulation. Seems like a damn useful one for Faces (alright, my Face would love it at least); even if it's not going to let them use all of their mojo-juju, it's better than not being able to communicate at all...

I would never take fashion in any world in which I didn't already have Physical Mask.

Depends on your usage really. For my character mentioned above, it's much better to be able to change the look of an outfit on the fly and not have to worry about the sustaining penalty or the effects on the astral while going about his business.

For a generalist/utility mage though, I certainly agree that Physical Mask is going to likely be more universally useful.

[Muspellsheimr]

Physical Mask can change what something looks like, smells like, & even feels like. It cannot change the properties of that object - weight is unaffected, as is if it is metal or not. If you make an iron bar appear to be soap, a magnet will still stick to it.

The spell might allow you to bypass magnetic anomaly detectors, but until I can find a clear & full description of what it means to be multi-sense, I would say no (so far, all I have found is "affecting multiple/all senses"). I also need to check how, precisely, the detectors work.

[Earlydawn]

This thread is awesome. There's some wildly varied ideas of spell usage I never would have thought of.

[Tarantula]

To me, "all senses" means it fools everything. I'd say that includes weight (part of touch). Not in that it makes it weigh less, but it makes you perceive it to weigh less. (Yes, this doesn't make much sense, but its magic).
P.255 SR4 has the mad description. But it boils down to this, to detect the item, the mad has to succeed in its check. If the mads OR is exceeded by hits on the spell, its affected by the spell, and as far as it it concerned, the HMG is a bouquet of flowers for perception by all senses. Since flowers aren't metallic, it doesn't even roll, as it only detects metallic things, and as far as it can tell, its flowers.

[TheOOB]

Physical Mask can change what something looks like, smells like, & even feels like. It cannot change the properties of that object - weight is unaffected, as is if it is metal or not. If you make an iron bar appear to be soap, a magnet will still stick to it.

The spell might allow you to bypass magnetic anomaly detectors, but until I can find a clear & full description of what it means to be multi-sense, I would say no (so far, all I have found is "affecting multiple/all senses"). I also need to check how, precisely, the detectors work.

Make it so you have to beat the object resistance of the MAD in order to fool it, or if you want things to be more risky apply your hits on physical mask as a dice pool penalty to MAD tests.

[Cthulhudreams]

Physical Mask can change what something looks like, smells like, & even feels like. It cannot change the properties of that object - weight is unaffected, as is if it is metal or not. If you make an iron bar appear to be soap, a magnet will still stick to it.

The spell might allow you to bypass magnetic anomaly detectors, but until I can find a clear & full description of what it means to be multi-sense, I would say no (so far, all I have found is "affecting multiple/all senses"). I also need to check how, precisely, the detectors work.

I respect 'dissenting' opinions on this. For starters the workings of Magnetic anomaly detectors as they apply to military applications is classified today, so fucked if I know how the work in 2070, and drawing conclusions is going to be fun about a technology that may as well be magic.

MADs in military use can and have identified soviet subs made of non ferrous materials. So clearly there are side channels and stuff.

However, the multi-sense spells can beat drones who use Radar, so logically multi sense includes beating cyberware scanners. Incidentally, beating radar essentially requires it to change th base properties of an object.

Its undefined if it beats mag scanners, but as it appears to be the rest of the detection suite, why not?

[Whipstitch]

It's an easy issue to come to different conclusions on. Regular Mask is relatively easy to make a clear cut ruling on; the spell doesn't affect the object so much as it affects how people percieve the object. Physical Mask is problematic because it is described as manipulating light and matter in some nebulous manner. Personally, I believe Physical Mask can beat most types of scanners (after all, that allows it to fill a niche that is needed for many runner teams since an early Matrix intrusion can be a risky gambit at best), but I'd be loathe to claim that there are truly wrong answers in this case.

[AllTheNothing]

Shouldn't think so - damage from frostbite is from lack of circulation...which a gelatin statue isn't going to have anyway.

OTOH, by SR4's rules, separating the guy into multiple containers is certainly going to kill him, goo or not. And quite a pain to do, too - the goo has a fairly high barrier rating.

Frostbite causes damage also at cellular level due formation of ice shards that tear the cellular membrane (is it written this way? In italian is "membrana cellulare"); it also creates problems due to lack of the thermal energy necessary for bio-chemical processes to take place (chemical reactions are devided in tree fases: absorbtion of energy by reagents, this energy breakes the "status quo" putting the system out of balance, transition to a new molecular stucture and a new energy balance, relise of excess energy), freezing the goo you extract heat from it, maybe in goo-form you don't need to worry about frostbite but if goo is not brought back to 36 Celsius degrees the subject will probably be cold dead (pun intended) due it assideration.

In reguard to dividing the goo in multiple bottles I think it is like mist form put it back together befor dropping the spell and the subject should be fine; also I think that goo's high barrier rating is due goo's semi-liquid structure: when you hit it most of energy goes to move matter instead of doing damage, think abuot a bollet fired in the wather, not to that level but gives the idea.

[AllTheNothing]

Doesn't anybody talk to things they meet on a run??

How about Translate, so you can talk/con/negotiate with anybody on Earth, spirits, AIs. weird things 'out there'? It'll even work on the Astral/Metaplanes.

Peter

Isn't Translate a mana spell? It affects living beings (as life is defined by magical theory), how can it work on a purely digital entity such an IA? It can't, magic can't affect AR/VR/digital entities so no traslate for IAs.
I would also point that the spell description states that the spell is rather unrefined in delivering the message, it translates the intended meaning without any retorical form or embellishment, so it won't do for negotiation so face has better have a good rating linguasoft (or better know the lenguage). However it's still extremely usefull spell, just don't make it replace lenguage skills/softs, it would cheapen the game.

[Stahlkörper]

The most powerful spell is Analyze Device. Cast it on a focus or fetish to get some extra dices for your next spells. Best used on a multiple stacked focus/fetish or a talisman. Use edge for casting and put the spell in a F1 sustaining focus. You will get an incredible amout of extra dices for your Spellcasting. As soon as possible by means of karma, bind another sustaining focus and do it again. When you reach your active foci maximum, recast the spell on the first sustaining focus. You may get an unlimited amount of dices by doing this as long as you stay ouf zones with any background count.

[Stahlseele]

doesn't work like that, as far as i know, because only one focus can assit any specific test, as far as i remember

[Glyph]

Plus, the spell gives dice for using the device. Foci aren't used to cast spells - they add dice to the spellcasting. "Using" a focus doesn't even require a test, so analyze device would be useless for that.

[Whipstitch]

Yeah, a force 1 focus is just that: a force 1 focus. You're using it as well as it can be used. Analyze Device doesn't change something's operating parameters; you can use Analyze Device to have an instinctive understanding of how to ride your motorcycle but the base speed and acceleration ratings will remain the same regardless of how skilled you are in its use.

[Stahlkörper]

doesn't work like that, as far as i know, because only one focus can assit any specific test, as far as i remember

Thats right, but the foci dont give any bonus dices - they are only used to sustain the spell which gives the bonus dices.
You can sustain as much spells as you want to as long as you are able to manage with the -2 modifier or use a sustaining focus. And you can activate as much sustaining foci as your Logic attribute allows. By raw theres nothing against it (but I would strictly recommend to houserule that).

Plus, the spell gives dice for using the device. Foci aren't used to cast spells - they add dice to the spellcasting. "Using" a focus doesn't even require a test, so analyze device would be useless for that.

Yes, they are used much like this cleanup kit which also give some extra dices - not as the object of the action but as a tool.

Yeah, a force 1 focus is just that: a force 1 focus. You're using it as well as it can be used. Analyze Device doesn't change something's operating parameters; you can use Analyze Device to have an instinctive understanding of how to ride your motorcycle but the base speed and acceleration ratings will remain the same regardless of how skilled you are in its use.

Youre right, but indeed I dont want the spell to change the force of the focus but to change my Spellcasting dice pool. If you can cast it on a comlink to get extra dices for the skills it is used for (hacking, computer,...) or on a electronics toolkit then you can cast it on a focus, too. Raw dont excluse any magical skills for that spell.