Glamour possible as Transgenic Alteration? Options

[Meschler]

Hi Folks,

what do you think? Is the Glamour quality available as Transgenic Alteration? I am not sure if this is possible due to the existance of the tailored pheromones bioware. By RAW they function different but provides almost the same bonus. Would you allow this in your game?

Thank you for your answers.

Best wishes,
Meschler

[Mäx]

I would say not possible, as it's not a non-magical metagenic quality.

[Meschler]

huh....where does it say Glamour is a magical effect? Do you have a page number with the rule for me? I didnt find anything in the discription that hints about a magical nature of Glamour. Quite in contrary in the Dryad discription it is mentioned that the Dryad features are not fully understood and that they are not magical. Maybe i miss something here?

Thank you and best wishes,
Meschler

[Malicant]

I'm a little on the edge right now and mostly because of people who DO NOT BOTHER READING. Like you did. Glamour, first sentence. It's magic.

[knasser]

huh....where does it say Glamour is a magical effect? Do you have a page number with the rule for me? I didnt find anything in the discription that hints about a magical nature of Glamour. Quite in contrary in the Dryad discription it is mentioned that the Dryad features are not fully understood and that they are not magical. Maybe i miss something here?

Thank you and best wishes,
Meschler

There's nothing that I can see that says the quality of Glamour is a magical effect. The fluff under Dryad says that no physiological reason has been discovered and Quality description says that it is paranatural. But paranatural has been used in Shadowrun to describe things that are merely Awakened in nature, such as paracritters, rather than explicitly magical in effect. So it could be squeezed in there if a GM wishes, but all metagenetic qualities are only transgenic with GM approval anyway, so it's really the GM's call. In my game, I would disallow it as the fluff clearly says that the physical basis for the effect is not yet known. Hard to splice in the genes for something when you don't know which genes to use.

Not a definitive yes or no, but I hope it helps. Could be worth someone familiar with 3rd edition commenting on how the effect used to be played / described.

Khadim.

[Hagga]

"A character with glamour is paranaturally gifted.."

[Mäx]

huh....where does it say Glamour is a magical effect? Do you have a page number with the rule for me? I didnt find anything in the discription that hints about a magical nature of Glamour. Quite in contrary in the Dryad discription it is mentioned that the Dryad features are not fully understood and that they are not magical. Maybe i miss something here?

Thank you and best wishes,
Meschler

As has been said a chacter having glamour is desripted as paranaturally gifted and the word glamour to me attleast hints of a macigal treasons for the effect.

[Meschler]

aha......and paranaturally is the equivalent to magic?! Sorry, I didnt know that.

Malicant wrote:
I'm a little on the edge right now and mostly because of people who DO NOT BOTHER READING. Like you did. Glamour, first sentence. It's magic.

@Malicant
Sorry that english ist not my native langage and :sarcasm on: i was bold enought to ask a question :sarcasm out:

Best wishes,
Meschler

[knasser]

aha......and paranaturally is the equivalent to magic?! Sorry, I didnt know that.

It's debateable which is why I highlighted the word and emphasised that it was a GM call. The para- prefix has been used in Shadowrun rules and fluff many times to describe things that aren't exactly magic in the way that spells or innate powers are, but are the result of awakening when the mana levels rose. There are para-animals like Piasmae or Behemoths that don't have any magical powers per se, but are still "paranatural". There's no authority you can appeal to for a formal definition of the word because it has no such defined usage outside odd, specific contexts such as the Shadowrun role-playing game. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Could someone splice in Behemoth DNA and get qualities from that, like a dermal armour equivalent? It's reasonable flavour-wise to do so. Would it be reasonable to splice in a Barghest's fear ability? A GM could allow that if they really wanted, but in all probability you wouldn't feel that fit so well (even ignoring the game balance issues). So is a Dryad's +3 to social rolls similar to a behemoth's armour bonuses or is it similar to the Magic-attribute powers of the Barghest's fear? I would say the former, actually. But I still wouldn't allow it. The book is vague enough over the nature of the effect to argue over, but whatever you decide it remains subject to GM approval anyway, as do all metagenetic qualities. And I personally would not allow it both for game balance and because the fluff is quite clear that the source of the ability remains a mystery.

My thoughts,

K.

[AllTheNothing]

The discussion about piasmas being paracritters is like elves being metahumans, normal DNA that actes up due to mana; glamour is described as "preternatural quality" in the dryads description, and "paranaturlly gifted" in the metagenetic quality, because it can't be explained, dryads have it but they don't recive a magic attribute (wait lets check........ no they don't) nor do the changeling having it (at least not from it), it just isn't a magical quality.
As for obtaining it trough transgenic alteration I would say no, in order to replicate it you have to understand how it works first (just think about phisics, before being able to create certain devices humans had to understand certein basic principle of natural laws) and exactly in what glamour-positives differ from non-glamour-positives, otherwise you don't know what you have to do in order to obtain it, which happens (by canon) to be the exact in game situation.
It could be simulated with Tailored Feromones and biosculpting though.

[AllTheNothing]

@Malicant
Sorry that english ist not my native langage and :sarcasm on: i was bold enought to ask a question :sarcasm out:

Best wishes,
Meschler

I'm an non anglofone as well, it's not a problem (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) .
Just take it easy and remember:
Errare umanum est, chummer.

[Muspellsheimr]

Astral Hazing is very much a magical Metagenic quality, & it does not require a Magic attribute. There are 3 or 4 magical Metagenic qualities, & Glamour is one of them; none require the character to be Awakened.

[AllTheNothing]

Astral Hazing is very much a magical Metagenic quality, & it does not require a Magic attribute. There are 3 or 4 magical Metagenic qualities, & Glamour is one of them; none require the character to be Awakened.

I think we need AH to put his word on the matter.
Anyway we are all concording that it's not gene-engeneerable, aren't we?