Question about Hot Sim Module and Internal commlink Options

[Shadowfox]

Alright, so I'm making a new character, when you install the commlink cyberware, is that automatically linked to your mind? (a.k.a, give commands to it using thoughts alone)?

Also, if a Hot sim rig is set up (internalized) can the commlink have a datajack, and the hot sim module have a data jack (with no wireless functionality at all, and have the link be through a fiber optic cable?


To give you a better picture of what I'm trying to accomplish:


Here is my Shadowrunner's head:


EDIT: hold on a second, im just going to draw something in MS paint

LINK HERE


The basic idea here is, if you are running hot, and get jammed signal, or are afraid of a hacker using your sim module against you (Somehow hacking into your commlink and switching you over to hot sim right before attacking) that you can simply unplug the fiber optic cable and no longer have that functionality.

Also: would it be plausible to (a) while on a hot sim run, have a connection jammed open by black hammer or the like, and message one of your buddies standing near you to pull the plug, and (b) would pulling the plug while under cold sim / hot sim incur a dumpshock?

[Neraph]

From what I understand, the internal commlink itself does not use a datajack. The datajack is a standalone piece of headware that cannot be included into other things. However, you can get things strung together for no additional cost, but that does not require datajacks; it's just an optional setting.

In any sort of VR, if you pull the plug, you get dumpshock. Also, it's really hard to pull a plug on something inside your head... You might be able to say there's an external power switch that your friend can physically reset it (like described in the Magic Item section of the Street Magic book).

I'm kinda tired, so I hope that not only makes sense but helps a bit.

[TheOOB]

It might be a good idea to turn off the wireless link on your internal comlink, use a datajack to connect to a device with a signal(or a satellite uplink), so that you can pull the plug.

[Ryu]

Question1: Declared developer intent is that Cybercommlinks don´t come with a SimModule. You can give simple mental commands via DNI(main book), or you have full data access (Unwired on hacking cyberware). That´s one of the issues the next errata will hopefully clear up.

Question2: Opt-in on wired cyberware connections, disable SimModule wireless link. Don´t install a datajack, and give your comlink a mental shutdown command via DNI if attacked.

[Neraph]

Get a skinlink and as soon as you get hacked, send a command to switch to skinlink. You're not logging off (technically), but you cancel the wireless signal.

[Malachi]

Get a skinlink and as soon as you get hacked, send a command to switch to skinlink. You're not logging off (technically), but you cancel the wireless signal.

Skinlink doesn't help you if an intruding Hacker breaches your Commlink, as everything else is connected to it. If an intruding Hacker gains Admin access to your Commlink, they can force you into full-VR in Hot Sim mode. If you want to shut down at that point I would make an opposed test between you and the intruder.

[DireRadiant]

Alright, so I'm making a new character, when you install the commlink cyberware, is that automatically linked to your mind? (a.k.a, give commands to it using thoughts alone)?

p. 330
"In addition to wireless functionality, most cyberware devices
are equipped with a direct neural interface (DNI) that
allows the user to mentally activate and control their functions.
Th ey can also be linked to other cyberware implants."

An implanted commlink comes with DNI.

A hot sim module needs to be added to the commlink in order to have the commlink with Sim.

[Neraph]

Skinlink doesn't help you if an intruding Hacker breaches your Commlink, as everything else is connected to it. If an intruding Hacker gains Admin access to your Commlink, they can force you into full-VR in Hot Sim mode. If you want to shut down at that point I would make an opposed test between you and the intruder.

I meant if he got nailed with black IC. I was tired and not posting clearly.

[Malachi]

I meant if he got nailed with black IC. I was tired and not posting clearly.

Fair enough, but I still don't see how switching to skinlink prevents a Black IC attack. The Commlink itself is still wireless and presumably that is how the attacker has gained access to the Commlink or that is how the player has gained access to the node where they are being attacked. Now, if there were some way to rig the Commlink so that its connection to the Sim Module could be disconnected (which I think is what the original poster is getting at) then we're basically talking about the exact same thing as "jacking out" of the Commlink altogether since the user would be dumped from VR back to AR. Dumpshock would apply, as well as the Black IC's ability to prevent jacking out while under attack.

Also to address the OP's question about having a buddy jack out for you: yes this is perfectly reasonable and would avoid the opposed test with the Black IC. Keeping a friend nearby is a good thing.

[Jaid]

i would probably allow the above as a custom job, but honestly... why are you even carrying around a hot sim mod in your head? it's ridiculously cheap to have it external, and then it really just removes any question. especially if it's connected to you through a datajack cable.

[Neraph]

Fair enough, but I still don't see how switching to skinlink prevents a Black IC attack. The Commlink itself is still wireless and presumably that is how the attacker has gained access to the Commlink or that is how the player has gained access to the node where they are being attacked. Now, if there were some way to rig the Commlink so that its connection to the Sim Module could be disconnected (which I think is what the original poster is getting at) then we're basically talking about the exact same thing as "jacking out" of the Commlink altogether since the user would be dumped from VR back to AR. Dumpshock would apply, as well as the Black IC's ability to prevent jacking out while under attack.

Also to address the OP's question about having a buddy jack out for you: yes this is perfectly reasonable and would avoid the opposed test with the Black IC. Keeping a friend nearby is a good thing.

It goes like this: You are hacking with a commlink modded for hot sim. You have a skinlink. You get stuck in hot sim by black IC and can't jack out. You turn on your skinlink. You did not pull the plug, but you switched the wireless connectivity off. Dumpshock only happens when you pull the plug. Therefore, no dumpshock, and no more node.

[DireRadiant]

It goes like this: You are hacking with a commlink modded for hot sim. You have a skinlink. You get stuck in hot sim by black IC and can't jack out. You turn on your skinlink. You did not pull the plug, but you switched the wireless connectivity off. Dumpshock only happens when you pull the plug. Therefore, no dumpshock, and no more node.

The media by which the Black IC is interacting with you doesn't matter. Killing the connection matters. Disconnecting from the Matrix matters. Switching from skinlink from wireless and vice versa doesn't necessarily lead to disconnecting from a Node.

My laptop today easily uses both wireless and LAN connection, switching from one to the other I can still connect to the internet. In fact, it's a seamless transition. My phone can use wireless or the 3g connection when browsing the internet. Switching the mode I use to access the data doesn't kill my connection.

p. 231
"Once Black IC is used to make a successful attack on
the target (even if the hit does no damage), his connection
is jammed open and he cannot log off that node until the
Black IC is crashed"

[Malachi]

I agree with DireRadiant. Any attempt to kill the connection through which the Black IC is attacking you would result in having to win the opposed test.

[Shadowfox]

I agree with DireRadiant. Any attempt to kill the connection through which the Black IC is attacking you would result in having to win the opposed test.

Alright, but my whole idea is, if I have a way to pull the plug of the Hot mod full sim AR, then I wouldn't be forced to risk brain damage. Sure my icon might still be crashed, but any black hammer attacks will do nothing to me.

[Malachi]

Any attempt to "pull the plug" on any part of your Commlink connection after you've been hit by a Black IC attack would be subject to the rules for "jacking out" as detailed in SR4.

[Shadowfox]

Any attempt to "pull the plug" on any part of your Commlink connection after you've been hit by a Black IC attack would be subject to the rules for "jacking out" as detailed in SR4.

Yes, but the whole point being, I'm not trying to jack out, I'm effectively switching from hot sim to AR (which under normal circumstances can't be done after a Black IC attack because it's a switch initiated by software or a command) but in this scenario you are simply disabling the hot sim connection altogether. How would attempting to switch to AR be stopped or opposed if you're manually pulling the plug?

[DireRadiant]

Yes, but the whole point being, I'm not trying to jack out, I'm effectively switching from hot sim to AR (which under normal circumstances can't be done after a Black IC attack because it's a switch initiated by software or a command) but in this scenario you are simply disabling the hot sim connection altogether. How would attempting to switch to AR be stopped or opposed if you're manually pulling the plug?

As long as you don't mind taking the dumpshock just like anyone else would if suddenly dropped from the node that's fine.

[Malachi]

Yes, but the whole point being, I'm not trying to jack out, I'm effectively switching from hot sim to AR (which under normal circumstances can't be done after a Black IC attack because it's a switch initiated by software or a command) but in this scenario you are simply disabling the hot sim connection altogether. How would attempting to switch to AR be stopped or opposed if you're manually pulling the plug?

Well, I'm reading the "spirit" of the rule I guess.

Any attempt by the user to jack out takes
a Complex Action. In addition, the user must engage the
program in an Opposed (Willpower + Biofeedback Filter)
vs. (Black IC rating + Response) Test. If the Black IC scores
more hits, it prevents the user from jacking out. Users who
jack out immediately suff er dumpshock.

Although you may not "technically" be "jacking out" in your case, I believe the spirit of the rule indicates that any attempt to server/alter your connection to prevent the Black IC from doing further damage to you would apply to this rule.

[Jaid]

jacking out = exiting full VR. switching to AR is definitely jacking out.

[Cain]

Sorry for the thread necro, but a question popped up in my last game.

To set the stage: Black IC is really nothing more than an agent program with a Black Hammer program, right? That means the Black Hammer is the only part of the program that's special. Therefore, it's something to do with the Black Hammer program that forces connections open, preventing people from jacking out.

So, the sixty-four thousand nuyen question is: Does the same hold true for deckers using the Black Hammer program?

I mean, when it comes down to it, Black Hammer really is only useful against other deckers using hot sim. It's worthless against agents/IC; and I don't even know what it'd do to a sprite. So forcing their connection open seems like it'd balance out-- it'd make the program really dangerous.

What'd you all think?

[Fortune]

Why not?

[Backgammon]

My understanding was always that it was the program, yes.

[Jaid]

My understanding was always that it was the program, yes.

as was mine.

[hobgoblin]

yep, its the program.

as for the original topic, i would say that a black hammer or blackout is like being at some party or other with a person trying to convince you to stay.

its feeding you BTL level signals that makes you want to stay connected for some reason, and you have to force yourself to jack out, either by mental command or physical action.

and that makes me wonder if one can be hooked on black hammer damage, kinda like being hooked on the essence sucking of a vampire...

[Heath Robinson]

Short term conditioning effects are more likely given that we already have the Psychotropic option as a guide to what Biofeedback can do. It's just a fundamental feature of the algorithm that it supresses the flight aspect of the fight-or-flight response.