2070... can you lve without a wireless connection?, Life without networks Options

[Malachi]

I would also note that in conflicts stylisticly with the cyberpunk theme of Shadowrun. The powers that be (the Megacorps) have a large amount of control on the computer software world. It is, after all, a very profitable buisness to them. This gives them every incentive to take measures to stamp out movements such as the Open Source Movement which will have a measurable impact on their bottom line. Given the means and the ruthlessnes the coporations have been willing to resort to, being a modern day Linus or Stallman in the 6th world would be a very dangerous proposition indeed.

Now this does not mean that home grown software could not exists. But, its wide spread disemination is likely to pose a 'serious health risk' to its authors. Meaning its not likely to happen, at least, not for free.

Right... I've seen Antitrust

[Hagga]

Yeah, the modern open source movement has really done a lot to the obttom line of corporations.

[MaxMahem]

Right... I've seen Antitrust

Hmm... I haven't, but after a quick google, it does appear it would provide some good material for a potential shadowrun.

[KCKitsune]

Yeah, the modern open source movement has really done a lot to the obttom line of corporations.

Were you being facetious or were you being serious?

[Hagga]

A little of both. Some of it has, but the vast bulk of it is people howling about how terrible "micro$oft" is and that apple "$old out" and that they're all going to fall to this awesome operating system and wow isn't Linux killing Leopard/Vista.

Actually, just make it Y open source software is killing x evil corporate empire, hooray for us! and you'll have it.

[Blacken]

I don't have any evidence to contradict you, so I will assume that Microsoft finally got it's act together and got Windows Server to actually be worth something.

Yes, it was called Windows 2000. Welcome to this century. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

[TheOOB]

Comlinks are a fairly new technology in 2070, and the protocols of the matrix 2.0 are likewise new, and possibly not entirely declassified yet, which is a pretty tough blow for open source code. With how quickly the technology is advancing (degrading 1 point every month), and the difficulty of patching a program(logic+software (difference between current and normal grade) test with a 2 week interval) that means that many programs without corporate backing will have spotty updates and quickly fade into obscurity, while corporate made programs stay on the bleeding edge until planned obsolescence kicks in. And thats assuming the corps play nice, making their hardware and software work with code not watermarked from a major corp.

[Cabral]

Yes, it was called Windows 2000. Welcome to this century. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

Then there was Vista ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead.gif)

I've not noticed too many problems with 2k and XP but Vista is a resource hog and it's idea of "security" is spamming you into autopilot with pop-ups. I get more blue screens with Vista than 98.
I am not looking forward to Windows 7

The core of the problem is that Windows doesn't do All-In-One well. Ideally, you'd have your Work Box, your Hobby Box, your Gaming Box and your Don't Tell the Ethics Committee box (which you can expect to format and reinstall regularly). It's when you try to make one box do all of the above that Windows craps its pants.

No experience as to whether other OSs are more pants crappage resistant

[TheOOB]

We could get into an endless debate about what operating systems are good and which ones suck and whether or not Microsoft is an evil corporation, but I think whats important here is that all the megas in shaowrun are evil corps and that most the stuff released to consumers is complete crap that people pay for because they feel they have to.

[MaxMahem]

A little of both. Some of it has, but the vast bulk of it is people howling about how terrible "micro$oft" is and that apple "$old out" and that they're all going to fall to this awesome operating system and wow isn't Linux killing Leopard/Vista.

Actually, just make it Y open source software is killing x evil corporate empire, hooray for us! and you'll have it.

As you say, in some industries the impact of OSS has been very large. One particular example would be internet servers where Apache has over 50% of the market and IIS remains a distant second. Another would be web-browsers with Firefox closing in on 20% of the market, CVS (and other OSS code repositories), MySQL, and let us not forget Sendmail either. Indeed on the Server side of the world, *nix variants continue to dominate, despite an improvement in microsoft offerings, and Linux has a healthy portion of those *nix systems out there.

But weather or not OSS could make an actual dent in the bottom line of corporations in the 6th world is largely a matter of speculation as it would greatly depend upon the state of software development and networks in 2070. Thre may be factors (such as interoprability) that make its implementation difficult to impossible, or there might not.

However, (and this is an idea I imagine Hagga will like) the development enviroment is likely to be very different. In particular, the large coporate sponsors of OSS would likely not exist in 2070. Its hard to imagine the likes of Renraku, SK, Azetechnology, or any of the mega-corps just giving their source code away for free. Without its major corporate sponsors OSS is unlikely to be in the same position it is today, and those sponsors are unlikely to exist in the future.

---

But all this is a bit to arcane for my games. I would focus on the much more fun possibility Antitrust like game runs (I have got to see that movie). Getting hired by a corp to go track down some open source guy, kill him, and steal his code. OR being hired by said guys rich widow/GF to break into the corporation and steal the source code back and prove their dastardly deeds.

[Ogrebear]

Given the timeline of Shadowrun starts at a very different point in time and technology would the Open Source Community even have got the foothold that they have managed in Real Life? Would the Resource Rush and rise of the early Mega's - probably inc Microsoft- killed the whole thing off?

[Bira]

The reason software works the way it does in Shadowrun is purely because of game balance. SR was built around the very traditional assumption that gear has to cost money, and better gear is more expensive. Which leads to a whole bunch of clunky balance mechanisms when they try to factor in open-source, or even home-cooked software.

For example, the flavor text say evert hacker worth his salt builds his own programs, but the intervals for doing this are so large it would take longer than the average shadowrunner's career to actually build something decent. And the only reason open source software is difficult to obtain and keep updated is because they had to compensate for the fact that it doesn't cost anything - it doesn't work like that at all in the real world.

This is not something exclusive to Shadowrun, either. Most popular science fiction RPGs were written before open source really took off - it's one of those marvels of the future no one could predict because they were too busy imagining laser guns and flying cars (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

I think the best way to take these things into account would be to change things to that it's always assumed that hackers use the best software they can get their hands on, and that they didn't pay a dime for it, either because it's cracked, or because it's free to begin with. This may or may not involve some heavy changes in the Matrix rules.

[Mickle5125]

So this thread has given me ideas for my next character. OSS programmer, baby. OSS FOR EVERYONE! BRING DOWN THE MEGA CORPS! VIVA LA REVOLUTION!

[hobgoblin]

I think the best way to take these things into account would be to change things to that it's always assumed that hackers use the best software they can get their hands on, and that they didn't pay a dime for it, either because it's cracked, or because it's free to begin with. This may or may not involve some heavy changes in the Matrix rules.

the basic stuff can still be used. rather then skill+app, use stat+skill (many do so already).

there could maybe be some kind of limiter based around hardware (a a-list hacker being held back by sub-standard hardware). could be something like there being X cycles available for different tasks. the hacker can allocate those cycles to a task just like loading software right now. the tasks basically being the same as the software, maybe plus firewall.

so if the hacker wants to really slam that IC (a dog-brain task with extra cycles allocated to it to handle its sub-tasks), he can re-allocate cycles from the firewall and maybe stealth tasks to add to the attack task.

yes, that would make him easier to spot by the automated systems, and also leaves him more open for counterattacks, but also gives him a higher chance of taking down that there IC.

a botnet could be a cycle-farm, but at the same time, if its really maxed out its performance, it ups the chance of being detected and closed down by the powers that be.

an AI running a bot net could be really scary in that it could funnel that cycles into running its core being, giving itself a stat bonus dependent on the cycles alocated. but at the same time, doing so basically screams that there is a uber-AI in the matrix, bringing out the heavy guns of the corp court and others.

[The Jake]

Lone Star and other security outfits may feel a bit nervous about you because your SIN cannot be verified. Downtown Seattle is a definite no-no as that area expects all people to be broadcasting their ID from the Commlinks. The team not having a way to call you could also pose difficulties in team communication. I would suggest your character get a Commlink, but with no accessories. So you don't go VR and you don't use AR, which is still pretty unusual in 2070, but at least the team will be able to get ahold of you when the don't know where you are, and security companies won't freak out because you have no identity.

Sounds to me like the real question is "Can you get away without a fake ID in 2070"? And the answer is a no... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

- J.

[hobgoblin]

i suspect the barrens are a option...

[ahammer]

the basic stuff can still be used. rather then skill+app, use stat+skill (many do so already).

I would think if you do it that way with caps as so many do. I would give it a -somthing(base on the level of the program somthing like (l-3)) to you stat+skill for being open souce(as they are never as user frendly as close) but keep the cap the same.

this would get the affect that users could same out of free open souce code but would need to be more skilled to do so.

(seems to fit into real life).

[Bira]

(seems to fit into real life).

Not in my experience (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) . Even if open source software was universally less user friendly than the closed kind, SR hackers would be precisely the sort of people who would care more about power than user friendlyness.

Besides, my suggestion had the opposite goal - I want it to make no difference whether someone's using an open or closed program. I want them both to be equally effective, and I don't want to penalise shadowrunning hackers for not behaving like good little wageslaves and paying for their software licenses.

[ahammer]

Not in my experience (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) . Even if open source software was universally less user friendly than the closed kind, SR hackers would be precisely the sort of people who would care more about power than user friendlyness.

Besides, my suggestion had the opposite goal - I want it to make no difference whether someone's using an open or closed program. I want them both to be equally effective, and I don't want to penalise shadowrunning hackers for not behaving like good little wageslaves and paying for their software licenses.

user interface then to be the last thing most project work on as such then tend to be less user friendly(as open souce tend to be always ongoing). power user(those with lots of dice) will not know the diffrence and will alow it to be more powerfull(higher cap) without caring that it is less user fendly(less dice).

thats with I was trying to get accross with the rules.

you could also invert this for highly user frendly focus programs lowercap then grade woud sugject but with more dice.
(on this note thinking that you could also up the cap higher then the grade on the other one)

note: I have not read unwired.(background note im a computer programer if that make a diff)

edit: many changes to make it readable