 Drawbacks of not getting SR4A, Voting No with your wallet... |
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 Apr 2 2009, 11:29 PM
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#26
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Great Dragon  Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935  |
What? You mean you're willing to miss out on the two (2) short stories I wrote for SR$A? I am hurt, yea, e'en wounded...
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Apr 2 2009, 11:31 PM
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#27
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 10,289 Joined: 2-October 08 Member No.: 16,392 |
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Apr 2 2009, 07:29 PM)  SR$A? Ah, SR$A, that's what we should call it. TBH, I don't read much of the fiction in the source books. |
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Apr 3 2009, 02:32 AM
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#28
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Grand Master of Run-Fu Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,840 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 178 |
QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 2 2009, 04:31 PM) Ah, SR$A, that's what we should call it. TBH, I don't read much of the fiction in the source books. I don't think I even fully read Buzzkill; and I flat-out ignore the opening chapter pieces. |
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Apr 3 2009, 03:35 AM
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#29
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Apr 3 2009, 07:29 AM) What? You mean you're willing to miss out on the two (2) short stories I wrote for SR$A? I am hurt, yea, e'en wounded... Not as wounded as I am for you to admit that it is indeed a $ edition. |
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Apr 3 2009, 03:52 AM
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#30
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 220 Joined: 15-March 09 Member No.: 16,972 |
QUOTE (toturi @ Apr 3 2009, 12:35 PM) Not as wounded as I am for you to admit that it is indeed a $ edition. That damned caps button, revealing all dark secrets! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/spin.gif) |
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Apr 3 2009, 04:29 AM
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#31
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
Did I accidentally log onto the WotC boards?
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Apr 3 2009, 05:21 AM
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#32
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 664 Joined: 3-February 08 Member No.: 15,626 |
QUOTE (eidolon @ Apr 2 2009, 08:29 PM) Did I accidentally log onto the WotC boards? Nah, all the Nerdrage left there. I think it came here. |
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Apr 3 2009, 11:44 AM
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#33
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,245 Joined: 27-April 07 From: Running the streets of Southeast Virginia Member No.: 11,548 |
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Apr 2 2009, 06:29 PM) What? You mean you're willing to miss out on the two (2) short stories I wrote for SR$A? I am hurt, yea, e'en wounded... I read *EVERY* short story in SR4A. I liked them. So nyah! |
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Apr 3 2009, 01:14 PM
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#34
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,653 Joined: 22-January 08 Member No.: 15,430 |
One thing I've enjoyed about SR4A is that they fixed some of the inexplicably bad choices about layout that the first version (was it Catalyst or FanPro?) made. For instance, the way you have stock commlinks on one page in the Wireless World section instead of the gear section, stock operating systems on another page, software upgrades on another page, and hardware upgrades on ANOTHER page... SR4A takes all that stuff and puts it in the same place in the gear section where it rightfully belongs. It also codifies the fixed sensor rules that allow you to upgrade sensor packages, as well as giving ratings and capacities for hearing and vision aids. It's still a little confusing, but it's nice to have. Overall, it's just an easier book to use, especially with the master index that greatly helps when finding stuff when you're not even sure where to look for it.
As for voting 'no' by not buying it... Well they can't de-publish the book, can they? I think a 'no' vote is a day late and dollar short at this point. Obviously, you don't have to buy it if you think there are more bad rules changes than good ones, but then again Catalyst has stressed that nobody has to buy this book in the first place -- it's not much more than an errata with a new format and some new art. It's an updated shiny new version of the same book, it's not Shadowrun 4.5. I don't think they expect everyone to buy this book, especially seeing how they're releasing an errata for free that contains all the changes. I think they're simply banking on the fact that no matter if a few dozen dumpshockers hate whatever they do, they continue to sell out of each printing of the books. If you want them to hear your voice, I'd suggest you contact them directly. Not buying the book is something that millions and millions of people who've never heard of Shadowrun do -- they're not paying attention to who doesn't buy it. And carping on dumpshock is only sporadically attended to buy the devs, and it's hard for them to take it seriously when it's just a small group of people who seem determined to complain no matter what. |
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Apr 3 2009, 01:26 PM
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#35
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,706 Joined: 30-June 06 From: Fort Wayne, IN Member No.: 8,814 |
I'm not currently running an SR campaign, but I just pre-ordered the hardback. I figure that my current core book has enough changes to it that getting a new book that's up to date will be a good thing. Plus, it sounds like I'll be starting up a game later this year, so it will be nice to have a new starting point.
Plus, based on what I have read, the rules that have changed, I either like or they really never came up enough in game to warrant venom spitting at our table. And, the re-org of the sections and a master index...all worth the $30 to me. What I have never been able to understand is people thinking they have to change additions or rules just because something is published. I don't know, maybe I just play with too many people that are into WoW. And when they change something, for better or worse, you just work with it and move on. Developers don't make changes to intentionally ruin our fun...they make changes to better balance or simply fix problems. Most of us don't like them because we've been used to playing a different way, and most people don't like change and will find negative in almost anything. |
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Apr 3 2009, 01:30 PM
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#36
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
QUOTE (Larme) As for voting 'no' by not buying it... Well they can't de-publish the book, can they? I think a 'no' vote is a day late and dollar short at this point. Obviously, you don't have to buy it if you think there are more bad rules changes than good ones, but then again Catalyst has stressed that nobody has to buy this book in the first place -- it's not much more than an errata with a new format and some new art. It's an updated shiny new version of the same book, it's not Shadowrun 4.5. I don't think they expect everyone to buy this book, especially seeing how they're releasing an errata for free that contains all the changes. I think they're simply banking on the fact that no matter if a few dozen dumpshockers hate whatever they do, they continue to sell out of each printing of the books. If you want them to hear your voice, I'd suggest you contact them directly. Not buying the book is something that millions and millions of people who've never heard of Shadowrun do -- they're not paying attention to who doesn't buy it. And carping on dumpshock is only sporadically attended to buy the devs, and it's hard for them to take it seriously when it's just a small group of people who seem determined to complain no matter what. I vote this "best post made to Dumpshock in the last few weeks", and I wish it would fit in my sig. |
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Apr 3 2009, 01:48 PM
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#37
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 992 Joined: 23-December 08 From: the Tampa Sprawl Member No.: 16,707 |
Seconded... the motion is up for general vote.
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Apr 3 2009, 07:08 PM
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#38
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 10,289 Joined: 2-October 08 Member No.: 16,392 |
I'd just like to point out a flaw in the argument here:
"I don't want to buy the book, I don't like the changes." "You don't have to, the changes are going to be released free as errata." Excuse me. But I don't want the damn errata. That's the exact part of why I'm NOT BUYING the damn book! |
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Apr 3 2009, 07:51 PM
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#39
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,706 Joined: 30-June 06 From: Fort Wayne, IN Member No.: 8,814 |
You can buy my gently-used un-errata'd printing of SR4. I'll sell it cheap.
Seems to solve all problems:) |
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Apr 3 2009, 07:58 PM
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#40
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The ShadowComedian Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,538 Joined: 3-October 07 From: Hamburg, AGS Member No.: 13,525 |
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Apr 3 2009, 01:29 AM) What? You mean you're willing to miss out on the two (2) short stories I wrote for SR$A? I am hurt, yea, e'en wounded... you added two short stories to SR4A? ok, just for that i am buying . . i allready have very first printing of 4th ed, and i don't even play, so yeah, fanboy here *g* |
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Apr 3 2009, 09:02 PM
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#41
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 10,289 Joined: 2-October 08 Member No.: 16,392 |
QUOTE (deek @ Apr 3 2009, 02:51 PM) You can buy my gently-used un-errata'd printing of SR4. I'll sell it cheap. We have a copy, thanks. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) |
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Apr 3 2009, 10:47 PM
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#42
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Grand Master of Run-Fu Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,840 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 178 |
QUOTE As for voting 'no' by not buying it... Well they can't de-publish the book, can they? As a matter of fact, they can. The hardcopies haven't even reached the printers yet; I'll bet that errata and changes discovered on Dumpshock are going to make it into the final version. But indeed, they still could scrap the entire print run at this point, and refund the pre-orders. As for voting with your wallet: if the book languishes on shelves, that's going to say something. Every dollar spent is a vote. If people don't buy the pdfs and hardcopies, preferring to stick to the errata and/or resorting to piracy, that's going to say something as well. Really, all SR4.5 has got going for it is that it's shiny. It's got some cool artwork, more fiction, and just enough rules changes to keep things from being backwards-compatible. |
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Apr 3 2009, 11:20 PM
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#43
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The ShadowComedian Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,538 Joined: 3-October 07 From: Hamburg, AGS Member No.: 13,525 |
how's that positive at all?
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Apr 3 2009, 11:28 PM
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#44
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Grand Master of Run-Fu Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,840 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 178 |
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Apr 3 2009, 04:20 PM) how's that positive at all? Huh? |
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Apr 3 2009, 11:46 PM
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#45
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 |
QUOTE (Stahlseele @ Apr 3 2009, 08:58 PM) you added two short stories to SR4A? ok, just for that i am buying . . i allready have very first printing of 4th ed, and i don't even play, so yeah, fanboy here *g* Yeah. There's a story in how the stories got in there...but I'll save that for another time. |
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Apr 4 2009, 12:30 AM
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#46
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,228 Joined: 24-July 07 From: Canada Member No.: 12,350 |
My favourite is the one AH wrote where FastJack fights the Crash Worm. Very, very good.
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Apr 4 2009, 12:36 AM
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#47
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 |
QUOTE (Malachi @ Apr 3 2009, 05:30 PM) My favourite is the one AH wrote where FastJack fights the Crash Worm. Very, very good. Where is that? |
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Apr 4 2009, 12:42 AM
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#48
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Grand Master of Run-Fu Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,840 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 178 |
QUOTE (Tyro @ Apr 3 2009, 05:36 PM) QUOTE My favourite is the one AH wrote where FastJack fights the Crash Worm. Very, very good. Where is that? Right next to the sidebar advertisement for Holostreets. |
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Apr 4 2009, 12:52 AM
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#49
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 732 Joined: 21-July 05 From: Seattle Member No.: 7,508 |
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Apr 3 2009, 07:46 PM) Yeah. There's a story in how the stories got in there...but I'll save that for another time. That story involves some winsome begging on my part. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
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Apr 4 2009, 12:52 AM
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#50
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 732 Joined: 21-July 05 From: Seattle Member No.: 7,508 |
QUOTE (Malachi @ Apr 3 2009, 08:30 PM) My favourite is the one AH wrote where FastJack fights the Crash Worm. Very, very good. My favorite too. |
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