SR4A and Ultrasound Sensor Options

[Stingray]

By to rules of SR4A..It is still possible to add Ultrasound Sensor to Cybereyes?

[Rotbart van Dain...]

It never was possible in SR4 - the implanted Ultrasound Sensor is and was headware in SR4.

Ihe external version only exists as a vision enhancement and thus is always coupled to goggles or camera sensors.

[Stingray]

It never was possible in SR4 - the implanted Ultrasound Sensor is and was headware in SR4.

Ihe external version only exists as a vision enhancement and thus is always coupled to goggles or camera sensors.

never possible??...BBB Bounty Hunter have it (cybereyes)..

[AllTheNothing]

never possible??...BBB Bounty Hunter have it (cybereyes)..

Sample character are not exctly rule abiding.

[Stingray]

Sample character are not exctly rule abiding.

Ultrasound is listed under VISION enchantments (BBB, page 328)(usually eyes..IMO)..Ultrasound Sensor= This is an implanted version of
the Ultrasound sensor. (BBB page 331)..it have essence and capasity costs...BBB page 330.. under cyberware it says: They can be also
to be linked to other cyberware implants.

[Doc Byte]

A little trick to save Essence's to build the US sensor into a smart (=with guncam) cybergun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif) For saving more Essence get the silencer as internal modification. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Stahlseele]

In SR3, Ultra-Sound was eyestuff, that much is true.
In SR4, neither US nor Radar have ever been Eye.
They are both HEAD-Ware . . . for some reason . . .

It is listed as Vision-Enhancement, because it is.
But it is not EYE-WARE.

[Stingray]

A little trick to save Essence's to build the US sensor into a smart (=with guncam) cybergun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif) For saving more Essence get the silencer as internal modification. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Sweet!! Ares Predator IV,Skinlink,Camera Upgrade (Ultrasound),Silencer and couple clips of AP's..then..
be vely vely siilent..it is invicible mage hunting season... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

[paws2sky]

Or you could get some Ultrasound Contacts...

Technically.

-paws

[MJBurrage]

As has been hashed out in other threads, Ultrasound and Radar are close enough to "vision" that that is how they are described both in much fluff, and in their basic rules mechanics.

However neither is actually "vision" in a magical "line-of-sight" sense.

I believe that is why they are specifically headware (and not eyeware) in SR4/SR4A.

[ICPiK]

You still can't locate a mage with improved invisibility right? Because it's still an electrical device.

[paws2sky]

You still can't locate a mage with improved invisibility right? Because it's still an electrical device.

Improved Invisibility bends light, it doesn't provide any protection against radar or ultrasound.

-paws

[ICPiK]

Yes. But it also states in the spell description that improved fools all electronic devices.

[Draco18s]

Yes. But it also states in the spell description that improved fools all electronic devices.

...that detect light.
Otherwise Imp. Invis. would avoid you setting off pressure senors in the floor.
Which is complete bullshit.

[Windling]

Yes. But it also states in the spell description that improved fools all electronic devices.

I have to agree with Draco18s that invisibility doesn't work against these devices because of how they function and how the spell "functions". On the opposite side, in the description of these kinds of "sense" it states it ignores invisibility....or was it "invisible mages"? Don't have the book on me. Truth is invisibility bypasses visual perception. While these sonar and radar based electronics overlay their results into a visually displayed format, the sense is in actuality "touch" based. Since invisibility doesn't protect against touch, sound, taste (although unlikely), or smell; it won't work against those types of perception. Sorry, just visual perception.

I hope that clarifies the point Draco18s was making about pressure plates in the floor.

[ReverendMo]

While Ultrasound is listed as a headware implant, it also does list a capacity and, as I run it, can be included in say, cyberears or cybereyes. It could also get squeezed into a cyberlimb or anything else that has enough capacity space to hold it. Datajacks are headware but it's been well-known and often-cited that some folks have them put in elsewhere.

Unless SR4A specifically notes otherwise, SR4 does state under the Headware section, "Items that have a Capacity rating may be installed in cyberlimbs instead, costing capacity rather than Essence."

Hopefully that clears it up a bit.

[Draco18s]

I believe that the capacity in cybereyes is not the same capacity that is in cyberlimbs.

[Mordinvan]

...that detect light.
Otherwise Imp. Invis. would avoid you setting off pressure senors in the floor.
Which is complete bullshit.

Radar works on almost the exact same principle as regular sight. Its detects objects using reflected photons just as normal sight does, and as IR goggles would. So it would be a GM call as to whether the spell can also bend IR and Radar wavelength photons. I'd personally rule yes, because to me that is the answer that makes the most sense. That said, I'd have to allow thermal ( the detection of emitted heat by a target ) to still be seen, as the spell only bends light and does not make it disappear.

[silva]

Radar works on almost the exact same principle as regular sight. Its detects objects using reflected photons just as normal sight does, and as IR goggles would. So it would be a GM call as to whether the spell can also bend IR and Radar wavelength photons. I'd personally rule yes, because to me that is the answer that makes the most sense. That said, I'd have to allow thermal ( the detection of emitted heat by a target ) to still be seen, as the spell only bends light and does not make it disappear.

It does make sense.

[Jaid]

but then you get into horrible, horrible discussions about whether invisibility protects you from laser tripwires, laser weapons, and how can you see anyways since light isn't reaching you?

[Mordinvan]

but then you get into horrible, horrible discussions about whether invisibility protects you from laser tripwires, laser weapons, and how can you see anyways since light isn't reaching you?

It should by the description of the spell. I would have no problem letting it do these things.
Just like I'd allow silence to provide protection against sonic weapons, and provide armor to soak roles or maybe just reduce the DV of explosions because it deadens the movement of air around you.

As far as how you can see... it would just have to let a small % of the light headed in the right direction through to your eyes. This would create a pair of dark spots on the area corresponding to the back of your head, and might be what people look for when they are trying to see someone who is protected by the imp invis spell anyway.

[Stingray]

Or you could get some Ultrasound Contacts...

Technically.

-paws

Hmm...cybereyes w/low-light+thermographic + basic helmet w/ultrasound...hmm..