how bad is this?, "my jack of all trades build" Options

[Red-ROM]

here he is, Kind of an ex- company man trying to make it as a runner, big talker, like a coked up 80's business guy

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human

-attributes-(265BP)

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bod 3 cha 3
agi 3 Int 3
rea 3 log 3
str 3 wil 3

magic 6(5) (phys ad 2/magic 3)
edge 6
essence 5.1

-positive qualities-(20BP)

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Mystic Adept
Ambedexterous
Restricted gear(skillwires 4)

-negative qualities-(+15BP)

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Mild addiction(Betameth)
Mild addiction(cram)
Mild Addictin(Psyche)

-Skills-(80BP)

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Spellcatsing(health) 3(+2)
counterspelling 2
summoning 1
Dodge(ranged) 2(+2)
Perception 3
Data Search(Pirated Software) 5(+2)
Etiquette(corporate) 2(+2)

(knowledge)
Ares Macrotech 4
Business 4
Street Drugs 4
Data Havens 3
Magic Traditions 3

-spells and foci-(18BP)

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sustaining Focus R3

Increase reflexes
increase charisma
increase Logic
increase intuition
increase willpower

-phys ad powers-(2PowerPoints)

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Body boost 1
Agility boost 1
reaction boost 1
strength boost 1
Multi tasking
Nimble fingers
linguistics

-Cyberware-(-0.9essence)

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Data Jack
Skillwires R4

-contacts-(12BP)

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Talismonger L3/C3
Fixer L2/C4

-gear-(18BP)

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Lifestyle middle

Pistols skillsoft R2 (I might save the 4BP here and look for pirated skillsofts in game)

the gear is standard fair, don't feel like typing it all
Decent commlimk w/ Browse 5 and a few other programs
pistol, hardware toolkit, armored suit, armored jumpsuit, medkit , etc..

[The Jake]

There is no focus in the design at all and your dice pools suck.

What are you aiming for exactly?

EDIT: Generalists are best served with high attributes in the skills they are supposed to be good at and a set of skillwires or MBW.

- J.

[Red-ROM]

I'm thinking that I'll log on to a few Peer to peer sites for Pirated software networks, and when i need to do whatever, I'll download the skill, boost the attribute, maybe spend some edge (for the att. boost test), and roll at least 10 dice. Plus, outside of combat, i get 3 free actions and can observe in detail as one of those actions without getting modifiers for distraction.he's like a manager. mostly just supervising, and lending a hand when needed. I think he fits the term Jack of all trades, master of none. I wouldn't rely on him for any particular job, but he's good at filling in the gaps. I know that he sucks in the min/max world of char gen. but I think he would find a use within any group. and over time he would have a library of skills, more spells, more foci, and would be a force to recon with, but thanks for the constructive critisism

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

There is no focus in the design at all and your dice pools suck.

What are you aiming for exactly?

EDIT: Generalists are best served with high attributes in the skills they are supposed to be good at and a set of skillwires or MBW.

- J.

But Hey... He has a LOT of room to grow...

[The Jake]

I'm sorry but I think its terrible.

He has base attributes of 3 across the board. Even with the spells, you then lose 2 immediately for having to sustain any spell because you can't afford a sustaining focus.

So to recap you're looking at around 7 dice, excluding any successes off casting improved <attribute> -2 for sustaining. Oh and you can't use Edge.

Alternatively, I could build a character with Agility 9+ and Logic 9+ without stretching with two pieces of bioware and still have gas in the tank if I want to make him an adept. Or if I want to go the cyber route, stacks left for MBW2 which would give Skillwires 4 and 2 extra initiative passes. I don't lose anything for sustaining either. With skillwires (4) and skillwires expert system, said character would be looking at LEAST 13 dice for most skills linked to those attributes and can use Edge to reroll failures if it is a skillsoft. Make said character human, get the Lucky quality, Restricted Gear (MBW2, Muscle Toner 4, Cerebral Booster 3) and you're looking at up to 8 edge too. Now you're cooking.

~12 dice makes life passable. 15+ borders on areas of specialty.

If anything I prefer skill monkeys and "jack of all trades" characters.This is reasonably difficult under SR4 with only 400BP. The only way to pull it off is with high attributes and/or high modifiers to attribute rolls (because they stack) and/or very selective use of magic (if at all).

My recommendation would be to try and build a picture in your head of what you are after and how you want to play him. This should help clarify in your mind what you want. Then you can decide whether you want to use cyber or magic or a bit of both to get there.

- J.

[Fix-it]

I'm gonna flame this character for the following reason:


Mild addiction(Betameth)
Mild addiction(cram)
Mild Addictin(Psyche)

THREE addictions? GTFO. you get ONE, tops. it's fine if you want to include all three drugs, but THREE milds? no no no no. there are a million good negative qualities in SR4 and RC. give him Records on File for 10. give him a criminal or regular SIN for 10 or 5. but don't take addiction thrice.

as a GM I would be nice enough to let you roll all three into a moderate addiction, but three milds = rejected.

[toturi]

I'm gonna flame this character for the following reason:


Mild addiction(Betameth)
Mild addiction(cram)
Mild Addictin(Psyche)

THREE addictions? GTFO. you get ONE, tops. it's fine if you want to include all three drugs, but THREE milds? no no no no. there are a million good negative qualities in SR4 and RC. give him Records on File for 10. give him a criminal or regular SIN for 10 or 5. but don't take addiction thrice.

as a GM I would be nice enough to let you roll all three into a moderate addiction, but three milds = rejected.

3 Milds are perfectly legal. May I suggest Mild (Betel) to replace one of your addictions instead?

[Red-ROM]

he has a r3 sustaining focus, so thats mental attributes at 6 w/no -2, physical attributes use phys ad powers, 6 easy, more with edge, so 10 dice, not great, not bad.


if I just had high logic and agility, I can't drive, or negotiate or climb. the point is to have a shot at EVERYTHING. which clearly is a bad idea to begin with, but I'm giving it a try.

as far as the drugs, that was more of a character idea, he's always looking for an edge, and turned to drugs for that at some point(they don't really help him that much, except maybe the cram) I could get the points from elsewhere and just make it flavor though if I had to.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

he has a r3 sustaining focus, so thats mental attributes at 6 w/no -2, physical attributes use phys ad powers, 6 easy, more with edge, so 10 dice, not great, not bad.


if I just had high logic and agility, I can't drive, or negotiate or climb. the point is to have a shot at EVERYTHING. which clearly is a bad idea to begin with, but I'm giving it a try.

as far as the drugs, that was more of a character idea, he's always looking for an edge, and turned to drugs for that at some point(they don't really help him that much, except maybe the cram) I could get the points from elsewhere and just make it flavor though if I had to.

With the character set up as he is, he is playable... not overy skilled in anything, but you do have room to improve across the board... you might not be as successful as a more specialized character, but with careful planning and some time, he could turn into a great character... But IT WILL take some time...

[Ryu]

One more voice for "bad", please. I assume that wild deviations from the original build are acceptable. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Concept:

• ex-company man
• big talker
• Jack of all Trades

Attributes (240BP)
The "directing" part won´t happen without charisma and Intuition (for Initiative and Perception).

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Bod 4(5)
Agi 3(6)
Rea 2(3)
Str 3(6)
Cha 5
Int 5
Log 3(5)
Wil 3
Edge 6

Qualities (0 BP)
Perceptive 2
Restricted gear(Suprathyroid Gland) -5
SINner +5
In Debt (Mafia) +10

Skills (110BP)
Given the plan stated after the opening post, it might be an idea to go technical/sensor ops/TacNet with this char.

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Active
Athletics 1
Close Combat 1
Electronics 1
Firearms 2
Influence 4
Stealth 1

Perception 2 (audio +2)

Knowledge
Ares Macrotech 4
Security Procedures 3 (Ares +2)
Californian Hots 2 (Dream Holidays +2)
Data Havens 4
Magic Background 3

English (Native)
Spanish 4
Japanese 2

Augmentation (Gear 19 BP)
Suprathyroid Gland 45k¥
Cerebral Booster 2 20k¥
Muscle Aug/Toner 2 30k¥
Bio 1.9, 95k¥

Contacts (20BP)
Ares Arms Sales Rep L3/C3
Ares Financal Services Senior Analyst L2/C4
Mafia Fixer L3/C5

Gear (30BP)
11 BP + In Debt money left after augmentation (you might want another IP)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

One more voice for "bad", please. I assume that wild deviations from the original build are acceptable. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

*snip*


Nothing like killing the concept of magician that the OP had... How about constructive consideration for the concept presented?

[Red-ROM]

so the bare bones idea is to be average (3's accross the board), then to boost the needed attribute, and use skillwires fore the needed skill, I guess another approach would be to have one skillpoint in all the skills you can't default on(40bp), then drop skillwires(2bp...hmm, not gonna work) any ideas? I mean , what is the minnimum usable dice pool? 12?

[The Jake]

he has a r3 sustaining focus, so thats mental attributes at 6 w/no -2, physical attributes use phys ad powers, 6 easy, more with edge, so 10 dice, not great, not bad.

Sorry, you did label that clearly - I was expecting to see it under gear for some reason.

if I just had high logic and agility, I can't drive, or negotiate or climb. the point is to have a shot at EVERYTHING. which clearly is a bad idea to begin with, but I'm giving it a try.

Actually you can.

Are you familiar with the rules? You can default on most skills. The only penalty is that you take a -1 penalty on the dice roll when defaulting. Which isn't huge when you're defaulting on a firearms roll with a 9 agility - which would still be higher than half the dice your character is throwing.

I just picked two attributes that would be highly desirable both in and out of combat off the top of my head where defaulting might be worth while.

as far as the drugs, that was more of a character idea, he's always looking for an edge, and turned to drugs for that at some point(they don't really help him that much, except maybe the cram) I could get the points from elsewhere and just make it flavor though if I had to.

You didn't respond to my earlier points - conceptually, what do you want to do? If you only want to be a face/skill monkey that's imminently doable. Are you seriously fixated on the idea of being a magician? Are you happy with being an adept? Or are you happy not being a magician at all as long as you can do all those things you wanted and more?

I am a big fan of magic but I don't see the build being enhanced much by being a magician. Being a an adept could help you with some niche abilities and give the build a bit more focus but realistically, I'd be focusing on your augmentations.

- J.

[Glyph]

Sorry, but the concept doesn't work mechanically. I see what you're trying to do, but a sustaining focus can only sustain one spell at a time, so you wouldn't have all of your mental Attributes at 6. And the Attribute boost power takes a simple action to activate, and has a duration of combat rounds. It works for a pistols adept who needs a quick boost to Agility, or a boxer who needs a quick boost to Strength, but having that many doesn't work - by the time you get around to activating your fourth boost, your first one will be about to run out.

[The Jake]

This is more for a non-combatant skill monkey.

The following augmentations (effectively) provide +5 Logic, +3 Charisma, +3 Intuition and a whopping +6 to Perception tests (ontop of that +3 Intuition). This costs approx 184k and a bit over 2 essence - easily doable. It also doesn't require the use of Restricted Gear to get a decent set of skillwires. Also enough essence left if you wanted to go an adept.

Cerebral Booster 2,
Tailored Pheremones 3
Reception Enhancers 3
Attention Co-Processor 3
Nanohive (2) with Limbic (3) and Neocortical (3).

By boosting these attributes here is the list of effective skills you are increasing:

Charisma
Con
Etiquette
Instruction
Intimidation
Leadership
Negotiation

Intuition
Artisan
Assensing
Disguise
Interests Knowledge
Language
Navigation
Perception
Shadowing
Street Knowledge
Tracking

Logic
Academic Knowledge
Aeronautics Mechanic
Armorer
Automotive Mechanic
Computer
Cybertechnology
Cybercombat
Data Search
Demolitions
Electronic Warfare
First Aid
Industrial Mechanic
Hacking
Hardware
Medicine
Nautical Mechanic
Professional Knowledge
Software

* Italics denotes skills you cannot default on (i.e. must have the skill to even attempt the roll).
Note that ALL KNOWLEDGE SKILLS are linked to Logic....

If you're willing to get the Restricted Gear positive quality and Born Rich, I'd choose Move-By-Wire(2) over Skillwires alone because the reaction boost, dodge bonus and skillwires are a great bargain. Couple that with Skillwires Expert system and you can use Edge dice to reroll failures. Just be sure to use the extra nuyen to buy cybereyes and ears too. Personally, I'm a fan of high Agility because every skill linked to that attribute can be defaulted if you really need to - but that's a personal preference.

At the end of the day, if your sole goal is to be able to do a bit of everything, then you need to accept that you will suck at just about everything. Sure you might be able to do anything you need to but if it comes down to a contested roll, you will lose. Period.

If however, you're willing to at the very least prioritise what skills/attributes/abilities you envision your character having you can cherry pick the attributes you want at ungodly levels and then use spare cash and BP to buy adept powers to fill in the gaps. As a human I'd also aim to get a high Edge. Edge was made for skill monkeys IMHO.

- J.

[Glyph]

Yeah, for Jack of all trades, mundane is the most effective way to go. Combine Attribute boosters, dice pool boosters, and skillwires, to get someone who has high dice pools for quite a few skills. A viable build even with the much higher costs for skillsofts. A mage becomes a Jack of all trades not through skills, but by having a good selection of spells, with spirits to supplement them - a mage with the right selections in those areas can excel in combat, stealth, and information gathering. Adepts work best as specialists, so trying to make a generalist adept is cramming a square peg into a round hole. But you can still combine 2 or 3 functions (such as a detective who is good at social abilities, perception, and pistols) for a well-rounded character.

[Octopiii]

With the nerf to skillwires, a super-generalist is a lot harder to build. You can do decent well in a lot of areas such as the matrix with a tricked out commlink and some agents, however.

This guy is a face, mage, and passable hacker. he's not a sneaky person; he talks or magics his way into places. With some karma, he will be a lot better. He can also boost up with drugs, thanks to his handy auto-injector.

Mr. Wolf

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Male Human
Attributes:

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B: 3
A: 2
R: 3
S: 2
C: 3 (5, non magic)
I: 2
L: 2
W: 5
E: 5
M: 5 (4)
Essence: 5.02
(230bp)
Initiative: 5
Initiative Passes: 1
Astral Initiative: 10
Astral IP: 3

Skills:

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Spellcasting: 6
Counterspelling: 4
Perception: 4
Summoning: 4
Influence Group: 4
Assensing: 4

(130bp)

Cyber:

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Tailored Pheremones: -.4, 30k
Platelet Factories: -.2, 20k
Attention Co-Processor 3(a): -.24, 18k
Tooth Storage Compartment: -0 essence, -200
Cyberhand(a): -.2 12k
Increased Capacity +2 3k
Radar Sensor 4: 2 capacity, 12k
Datalock: 1 capacity, 1k +encryption
Fingertip Compartment: 1 capcity, 750
Datajack: 1 capacity, 500
Biomonitor: 1 capacity, 1k
Auto-Injector, Reusable 0 capacity, 500k +contents, 6 extra doses: +600
Cyberseyes Rating 2(a): -.24, -1500
Thermographic Vision: 2 capacity, 1k
Low Light Vision: 2 capacity, 1k
Vision Enhancement 2:2 capacity 3k
Vision Magnification: 2 capacity, 1k
(96,250Y -.98 essence)

Qualities:

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Magician: -15
In Debt: +30
Allergy mild/rare: +5
(Total: +20bp)

Spells:

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Heal
Levitate
Stunball
Stunbolt
Mindprobe
Physical Mask
Influence
Increase Reflexes
Mana Bind
Control Thoughts
Mob Mind
Mana Net
(36bp)

Equipment:
Matrix Gear:

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Fairlight Caliban: 8k
+1 response = 4k
Optimized for Exploit: 500
Novatech Navi: 1.5k
+2/+2 = 6k
Sim Mod, Trodes, etc.
Agent r4: 10k

Analyze, Browse, Command, Edit, Encrypt, Reality Filter, Scan x4: 2.8k
Armor, Attack, Biofeedback, Command, Decrypt, Defuse, ECCM, Exploit, Medic, Sniffer, Spoof, Stealth, Track x4: 52k
Knowsofts x3 at rating 5: 15k
Linguasofts x5 at rating 5: 1250
101,050Y

Magic Gear:

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Manipulation Fetishes: Control Thoughts, Mob Mind, Mana Net (900)
Power Foci 2: 50k
-50,900, 2bp from binding

5 bp left over
He also still has ~30k (or convert to 6bp) to play around with. He needs some contacts to keep from feeling lonely!

Dicepools:

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Perception: 2+4+3, = 9, 11 if visual
Influencing People: 4+5 = 9
Spellcasting: 4+6+2 = 12
Summoning: 4+4+2 = 10
Drain: 3+5 = 8, 10 if using a fetish
Agent DP: either 8 or 9 depending on what node it's in.

The DP's don't sound like much, but he can get a lot done with spells, and with 5 edge he can make the critical rolls work. Also, he has a lot of non-dp advantages - he can see through walls with his radar sensors, take less damage with his platelet factories, and his Agent can do a lot of mid-level hacking.

[Octopiii]

Note that ALL KNOWLEDGE SKILLS are linked to Logic....

Not so. Street Knowledge skill are Intuition, as are Interest Skills. P. 127-128

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

so the bare bones idea is to be average (3's accross the board), then to boost the needed attribute, and use skillwires fore the needed skill, I guess another approach would be to have one skillpoint in all the skills you can't default on(40bp), then drop skillwires(2bp...hmm, not gonna work) any ideas? I mean , what is the minnimum usable dice pool? 12?

Depends upon what you define as useful I guess...
I have characters that have pools below 5 and I don't consider them useless...
To each his own of course...

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Note that ALL KNOWLEDGE SKILLS are linked to Logic....
- J.

Just a quick note, but that is not the case... some Knowledge skills use Intuition as their base stat...
Street Knowledges and Interest Knowledges use Intuition, as well as all Languages... as shown on the table pp129 BBB.