I can't find it!, Help to find which book something is in. Options

[Crossbow]

Okay, I have been doing this for a minute and I know it is in the books somewhere, but I couldn't find it on game night.

Where is the piece on how you learn or improve a skill, the part that involves making the extended test, I know where the karma costs are.

Also, anyone know of any rules that give a guideline for paying a professional (mechanic, teacher, plumber) for services rendered?

Thanks in advance

Crossbow

[Dashifen]

In SR4A, it's on page 269. Not sure about earlier printings. Also, the rules regarding the extended tests to learn or improve things were added in errata (IIRC) so they may not be in the earliest printings.

[imperialus]

SR 4A p. 270

To learn or improve a skill or skill group, the character must succeed in an Extended Intuition + skill Test, with a threshold equal to the new skill rating x 2 and an interval of 1 week (1 month for skill groups). A teacher can add bonus dice to this test (see Using Instruction, p. 134).

the original printing had it a bit different
BBB p. 263

Learning Time: It is recommended that a character only be allowed to learn one new skill (or specialization, spell, or complex form) between adventures; the character cannot simultaneous improve any existing skills, attributes, etc. during this time. A character can be allowed to improve as many skills, attributes, etc. between adventures as she has Karma, assuming the gamemaster feels the improvement is warranted but each can only be improved once. If the time frame between adventures is longer than one month, gamemasters may increase these allowances as appropriate.

As for part 2 of the question I'd say make it an extended test BR "plumbing" or whatever interval of 1 hour and charge an hourly rate based on that. 150 nuyen/hour for a skilled tradesman would probably be about right.

[Aaron]

I also recommend, for finding stuff in general, p. 352, SR4A.

[Dashifen]

I also recommend, for finding stuff in general, p. 352, SR4A.

Cute.

[Jackstand]

As for part 2 of the question I'd say make it an extended test BR "plumbing" or whatever interval of 1 hour and charge an hourly rate based on that. 150 nuyen/hour for a skilled tradesman would probably be about right.

The real downside to this, though, is that you make less money if you're a better plumber.

[siel]

Hmm? isn't that why you charge for gas and other miscellaneous service fee aside from the hourly? then move onto the next customer and do the same.

Or you could just drag the repair time for as long as possible. Slack off on the job while getting paid. Hurray for cybereye with image link. They will never know that you are watching videoes that are NWS while you are repairing the pipes... 

[Crossbow]

I am an idjit. I must have read that page about thirty times, but I always skipped over that bit at the beginning of the section. Thanks all.

The advice was also dead on, would you GMs out there think it was appropriate to charge 150 per plus a one time "keep your mouth shut" charge of say 500? Like in the case of getting an armorer to help mount a white knight on a drone. Also, would you give a discount on the hourly if the serviceperson were just assisting a PC?

Thanks

[Summerstorm]

Depends on the dude. Many would take the money and still call the cops, when they are done. Some will help you for normal price because it is awesome. Some will do it for just a lot of money, since they are "shadow-plumbers" (holy crap i just remembered "Brazil").

Also 150 per hour he better be the messiah himself building your nightstand. Let's see a normal trained guy may earn a bit over 2000 (low lifestyle) Say taxes, supplies and expense double it = 4000 he has to get in through bills. 160 hours a month he works hard= 25 per hour. That is of course for a standard service, like fixing your bike or such. I can see it getting to 80 or so for complex tasks. (And yes than somewhere a lawyer, psychiatrist or "sexual adviser" takes 500 an hour).

Ok, but you don't want him to talk? Pay him good... Just a big wad of cash, no hourly rates.

[imperialus]

Depends on the dude. Many would take the money and still call the cops, when they are done. Some will help you for normal price because it is awesome. Some will do it for just a lot of money, since they are "shadow-plumbers" (holy crap i just remembered "Brazil").

Also 150 per hour he better be the messiah himself building your nightstand. Let's see a normal trained guy may earn a bit over 2000 (low lifestyle) Say taxes, supplies and expense double it = 4000 he has to get in through bills. 160 hours a month he works hard= 25 per hour. That is of course for a standard service, like fixing your bike or such. I can see it getting to 80 or so for complex tasks. (And yes than somewhere a lawyer, psychiatrist or "sexual adviser" takes 500 an hour).

Ok, but you don't want him to talk? Pay him good... Just a big wad of cash, no hourly rates.

Ever called a plumber before? Hourly rates for tradesmen are insane. They may only take home 20 or 30 dollars an hour but the company still charges a mint.

If you're hiring someone specifically for an illigal task like the armourer you mentioned then yeah, I'd say 150/hour would probably be good. You probably wouldn't need to give him a 'keep your mouth shut' fee since if you're hiring him to put a machine gun on a drone he probably does this illegally for a whole lot of other people too and just factors it into what he charges. After all, if he wants to keep his rep as a reliable shadow mechanic then he'll want to be known for keeping his mouth shut.

[CodeBreaker]

Ever called a plumber before? Hourly rates for tradesmen are insane. They may only take home 20 or 30 dollars an hour but the company still charges a mint.

If you're hiring someone specifically for an illigal task like the armourer you mentioned then yeah, I'd say 150/hour would probably be good. You probably wouldn't need to give him a 'keep your mouth shut' fee since if you're hiring him to put a machine gun on a drone he probably does this illegally for a whole lot of other people too and just factors it into what he charges. After all, if he wants to keep his rep as a reliable shadow mechanic then he'll want to be known for keeping his mouth shut.

Plus, who the hell pisses off a well armed Shadowrunner? You just got him to fit a large machine gun onto a large automated drone. Am I the only one who would consider this as stupid as pissing off a well trained sniper?

And even if the Star do get to you before you get your revenge now he has to deal with the rest of the team, who are not happy that they have to spring their pet rigger out of the joint.