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> Tactical Computer Senses, The Sense Shuffle
Lilt
post Jan 24 2004, 11:13 AM
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Under the description of the Tactical Computer on P22 of M&M, it says that the 5 basic senses of normal sight, hearing, taste, touch, and smell are automatically hooked-up to the Tac Comp. The problem with this statement is that we actually have more than 5 senses, we have at-least 10 if you include Balance, Pain, Thirst, Hunger, and Proprioception.

The last in that list, Proprioception, is one few people have heard of. Proprioception is the ability to sense muscle condition and where your limbs are.

My question is essentially: would you allow Balance and Proprioception to be used as sensory inputs to the Tac Comp? They could be highly relevant when applying the Combat Pool bonus.
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Zazen
post Jan 24 2004, 07:50 PM
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I wrap vestibular and kinesthetic senses in with touch.

I don't think hunger, thirst, pain etc. are bonafide senses any more than being tired or knowing that you have blue-balls is a seperate sense.
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RedmondLarry
post Jan 24 2004, 08:41 PM
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Sense of belonging. Sense of fulfillment. Sense of abandonment. Sense of well-being. Sense of direction.
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Moonstone Spider
post Jan 24 2004, 11:57 PM
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Boy: "I see dead people."
Marine: "Cool, another sense to plug into the tac-comp!"
Housekeeper: "I'm sorry, I'll ask that nice Shaman to quit summoning so many ancestor spirits."
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Phaeton
post Jan 25 2004, 12:00 AM
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:rotfl:
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Luke Hardison
post Jan 25 2004, 12:01 AM
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I wouldn't allow those systems naturally, but I would allow for example a balance augmenter to be tied in with them, or a spatial recognizer.
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Phaeton
post Jan 25 2004, 12:02 AM
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QUOTE (Lilt)
Under the description of the Tactical Computer on P22 of M&M, it says that the 5 basic senses of normal sight, hearing, taste, touch, and smell are automatically hooked-up to the Tac Comp. The problem with this statement is that we actually have more than 5 senses, we have at-least 10 if you include Balance, Pain, Thirst, Hunger, and Proprioception.

The last in that list, Proprioception, is one few people have heard of. Proprioception is the ability to sense muscle condition and where your limbs are.

My question is essentially: would you allow Balance and Proprioception to be used as sensory inputs to the Tac Comp? They could be highly relevant when applying the Combat Pool bonus.

Proprioception? :? Forgive my ignorance of the term's meaning...
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Luke Hardison
post Jan 25 2004, 12:04 AM
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QUOTE (Phaeton)
QUOTE (Lilt @ Jan 24 2004, 06:13 AM)
Under the description of the Tactical Computer on P22 of M&M, it says that the 5 basic senses of normal sight, hearing, taste, touch, and smell are automatically hooked-up to the Tac Comp. The problem with this statement is that we actually have more than 5 senses, we have at-least 10 if you include Balance, Pain, Thirst, Hunger, and Proprioception.

The last in that list, Proprioception, is one few people have heard of. Proprioception is the ability to sense muscle condition and where your limbs are.

My question is essentially: would you allow Balance and Proprioception to be used as sensory inputs to the Tac Comp? They could be highly relevant when applying the Combat Pool bonus.

Proprioception? :? Forgive my ignorance of the term's meaning...

Highlighted the part of your post that answered your question.
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Diesel
post Jan 25 2004, 12:05 AM
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"Proprioception is the ability to sense muscle condition and where your limbs are."
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RedmondLarry
post Jan 25 2004, 12:39 AM
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Here's the Merriam-Webster definition. (It is more fun if you misread the word "organism", like I did.)
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Phaeton
post Jan 25 2004, 12:43 AM
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Aaaah, thanks, guys!

:rotfl: @ OurTeam
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Lilt
post Jan 25 2004, 12:40 PM
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QUOTE (Luke Hardison)
I wouldn't allow those systems naturally, but I would allow for example a balance augmenter to be tied in with them, or a spatial recognizer.
The thing is that you can tie-in touch and taste without any specific cyber for it apart from a port on the taccomp, so you can theoretically plug senses in without needing cyber.
QUOTE (Zazen)
I wrap vestibular and kinesthetic senses in with touch.
Possible, that was something I was considering, it's either that or wrapping all of the body's internal senses into a single sense.
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Prototype
post Feb 1 2004, 12:40 AM
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All nonsense...

Balance isn't a sense, in that it doesn't allow you to detect external stimuli, it's more like a regulatory mechanism.

Pain, Thirst, Hunger, and Proprioception are all simply sensations that your body makes you feel in response to its condition. They are in no way senses. You cannot tell anything about the outside world through these feelings.

Pain is the only grey area there, but once again, any information pain gives you about your surroundings is actually coming from the sense of touch in most cases.

As for the 5 basic senses... there is little point in linking taste to the tactical computer as it will almost never count in a combat situation (which the sense has to do in order to count towards combat pool) but as it's free, what the hell. I have my doubts about how often smell and touch come into things as well.

The other senses that can be hooked up are many and varied, but generally limited in usefullness. Not that many will count at once. The main ones which usually apply are the visual and auditory ones... hearing amplification, select sound filter, thermographic vision and ultrasound are almost always handy unless neutralised by appropriate technology.

Low light vision is something which only really allows you to apply sight in darkness, I wouldn't count it as a totally separate sense.

Well, that's my 2 :nuyen:


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Zazen
post Feb 1 2004, 02:03 AM
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QUOTE (Prototype)
All nonsense...

Balance isn't a sense, in that it doesn't allow you to detect external stimuli, it's more like a regulatory mechanism.

Gravity is certainly an external stimulus. That's what you detect.
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zephir
post Feb 1 2004, 07:36 AM
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As a physics student, I must *absolutely* tell you that gravity doesn't exist, what you detect is the earth accelerating you up, away from free fall. ;)
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The White Dwarf
post Feb 1 2004, 08:14 AM
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As I went over in another thread, theres no need to seach for crazy senses, its quite easy to max it out normally. Of the 5 starter senses, sight, touch, and sound are the only ones useful pretty much all the time. You can add thermographic and ultrasound for sight; and low and high frequency for sound. Lowlight and hearing amplification wouldnt count because they are *not* new senses, they just keep the basic ones from being taken off the list of usuable ones due to darkness or whatever. An orientation system adds another 2. That brings the total sense count up to 9, while 8 is all thats needed to gain the full tactical computer bonus.

So no, I wouldnt let something crazy count when theres easily more than enough to apply via the normal routes. Especially not anything so nebulous like "I can feel my arm gee its not blown off"....
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Shanshu Freeman
post Feb 1 2004, 10:50 AM
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QUOTE (Prototype)
As for the 5 basic senses... there is little point in linking taste to the tactical computer as it will almost never count in a combat situation (which the sense has to do in order to count towards combat pool) but as it's free, what the hell. I have my doubts about how often smell and touch come into things as well.

scent and taste are very related. If you smell gun powder, sweat, etc, etc, that might factor in a combat situation.
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Austere Emancipa...
post Feb 1 2004, 11:29 AM
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QUOTE (Shanshu Freeman)
If you smell gun powder, sweat, etc, etc, that might factor in a combat situation.

Possible, yes, but extremely rare. With the Olfactory Booster or similar effects (physad Sense, are there others?) this might be more common, sinse your sense of smell will be quick enough to give you information faster than your sight or hearing would in some situations and accurate enough for that information to be of some use. Without such effects it's very, very rare for smell to be actually useful -- surely we could all make a few scenarios up where it might be, but making up scenarios where it isn't is a whole lot easier...

Taste is one sense that I just can't see helping, however.
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BlackSmith
post Feb 1 2004, 04:25 PM
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steet sam: "the air seems to taste ..dry"
Veteran: "Gas alert! Gas Alert! put those masks back on!"

something you CAN taste that has no scent.
you should know it, you have been in SA-Int. (kai?)
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Austere Emancipa...
post Feb 1 2004, 05:52 PM
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That doesn't help in analyzing the tactical situation, though. That's just a perception test to spot a gas attack.

And yeah, I did my time, but they never mentioned anything about that. I wonder, though, if that's really about your sense of taste.
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BlackSmith
post Feb 1 2004, 10:39 PM
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well ..yes it does not help to analyze the tactical situation, BUT it does share the taste thus someone else could identify it.

well they should have.
some gases are taistless but have odor, while some gases are scentlles but have taste.
and some gases are odorless and taistless, but dont worry about them. after you know that there is such gas in the air, it is too late.
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Zazen
post Feb 1 2004, 10:53 PM
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QUOTE (zephir)
As a physics student, I must *absolutely* tell you that gravity doesn't exist, what you detect is the earth accelerating you up, away from free fall. ;)

Accelerating me up? Do you mean the earth pulling me down, or my chair holding me up?
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Lilt
post Feb 1 2004, 11:11 PM
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QUOTE (Zazen)
QUOTE (zephir @ Feb 1 2004, 02:36 AM)
As a physics student, I must *absolutely* tell you that gravity doesn't exist, what you detect is the earth accelerating you up, away from free fall. ;)

Accelerating me up? Do you mean the earth pulling me down, or my chair holding me up?

In the context (Balance) what you are actually detecting is the position of fluid in your ear. The fluid is in said position due to the fact that it falls to the lowest position it can before your body stops it by accelerating it upwards. Ypur body is, in-turn, accelerated by whatever is holding you up (chair, bed of nails, ground, space-hopper, whatever).
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Zazen
post Feb 1 2004, 11:39 PM
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If I'm just sitting here stationary then nothing is being accelerated in any direction, but I think I can still tell which way is down.
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BlackSmith
post Feb 2 2004, 12:26 AM
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man, you will be amazed when you study enough...
excample you will learn that even now, when your siting before your computer, your traveling for thousands of kilometers per hour.
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