How to play insane., I think I'm doing well. Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[Tiny Deev]

During a run, my characters girlfriend got involved. She got raped to death, and her body got abused post-mortum as well. It was the person who he loved most, the only one he loved, so it was quite a shock to say the least. Adding to this, he never got to see the body, or say goodbye. She was cremated and he couldn't attend. During the day of her cremation he had a bit of a mental breakdown, becoming catatonic and (because he is a shaman) kind of began warping the world around him into some twisted shit. Also, whenever a female character gets disguised by him he turns them into his girlfriend, but back whent hey were in high school.

So far, this is as far as I've gone with making him quite insane, because I don't want him to be a psycho. I want him to stay out of the "Lets kill everybody in the world"- mentality.

Now what I ask from you is, how should I continue? I want it to become apparent that he is infact quite ill in the head, but subtly. How should I go about doing this?

Should I make him see things that aren't there? Should he become very, very afraid of something, like for instance Cyberware? Should he be obsessed by finding the killers, and doing major harm to them (Even if this means he would go after the hacker we have now, as he was first involved with the team that took out his girlfriend) Any advice?

[Stahlseele]

Should he be obsessed by finding the killers, and doing major harm to them

This one. Revenge is one of the most easyly understood and acted out things for most people.
Also, make him not quite suicidal but simply not care if he lives or dies.
Make him one.track.minded in his quest for revenge.
Think Terminator 1 and 2 here, without the metal. Well, maybe with the metal.
Prime Candidate for getting combat cyber to accomplish his goals.
Way of the Burn-Out. Then Aleph-Society-Pact, then Burnout Cyber-Zombie, if he is still alive.
Maybe take a look at Talon from the Novels.
He basically conducted a bit of blood magic to summon a twisted great form fire elemental.
Only gave it one command after finding his targets. "Kill them all" while smiling and watching.
Calmly smiling and watching several people being slowly and painfully burned to death is scary.

[Traul]

Maybe it's time to pick up an addiction? When you're feeling low, there is always a friend to provide you with some chemical happiness.

You can also twist the revenge act to make it dirtier. The idea is that you don't want to make them suffer as much as she suffered, you want to make them suffer as much as you suffered. So go at their friends, family, loved ones. And make it dirty. Record the murder and e-mail it back. Make it last for a long, long time. Maim the body beyond recognition. You can think about Cape Fear for ideas.

[Karoline]

Maybe it's time to pick up an addiction? When you're feeling low, there is always a friend to provide you with some chemical happiness.

Chemicals are always good (Umm.. in an RP kind of way). Revenge is good.

As for crazy, you usually want to link it to what happened, so having him become afraid of cyberware seems like a real stretch.

First off, your spirits having some resemblance to your girlfriend would be good.

Every so often maybe you hear her calling out for your help, or see her running off out of the corner of your eye, and you feel compelled to go after her to help.

Perhaps you become convinced that she wasn't really killed, or perhaps not even harmed at all. Never saw the body, no proof, must have been someone else, a lookalike, or just some fancy disguise... or an illusion, no a hologram or a trideo trick.. but she's alive out there and I'll find her!

General franticness, perhaps combined with manicness and/or depression(Bipolar?)

Pretend she is still alive, receive comm calls and start talking to her when there is no one on the line. Send yourself e-mails that are from her.

So many fun things to do with crazy.

[Paul]

This, obviously, isn't the only solution but is one possibility:

In one of my SR1 games 3278, a poster here, played a character named Merge-who suffered from Dissociative Identity Disorder, or Multiple Personality Disorder as we commonly refer to it. Merge had 6 distinct personalities, and we use a six sided, and assigned each personality to a side. When he came under stress the player made a will power check and if he failed then he rolled a die to see what happened.

I work around mentally disordered prisoners, many of whom are violently antisocial. Often they seem almost normal, until until they start to slide off the edge. Then it can be as sudden as a thunder storm or as gradual as a glacier chasing you.

I'd suggest talking to the group Out of Character and let them know what you want to do, unless you're looking to keep it secret-then I'd at least suggest running it by the GM. Sounds like you have a fun story to tell here to me!

[Orcus Blackweath...]

I don't consider depression to be true insanity. If you are a normal human being, and it makes sense, it is not insane. That is fairly simplistic, but a good rule of thumb.

Insane people may not concern themselves with consequences. Insane people may not understand that consequences are possible. The classic definition used in court is, if you would commit a crime in front of an authority figure, you are insane.

Depression while having some similarity with psychosis and other clinical insanities is slightly different in that while you might recognize consequences, you generally do not care if they occur.

[Karoline]

I don't consider depression to be true insanity. If you are a normal human being, and it makes sense, it is not insane. That is fairly simplistic, but a good rule of thumb.

Insane people may not concern themselves with consequences. Insane people may not understand that consequences are possible. The classic definition used in court is, if you would commit a crime in front of an authority figure, you are insane.

Depression while having some similarity with psychosis and other clinical insanities is slightly different in that while you might recognize consequences, you generally do not care if they occur.

Depression in and of itself isn't insanity, but large mood swings can be a sign of such, and generally depression is one of the extremes of those swings.

Also, if you don't care about the consequences because you are depressed, and would thus commit a crime in front of an authority figure, by your own definition the person is insane.

Don't forget, we're all insane, the only question is, just how insane are you?

[Chrysalis]

I would point out that insanity is a legal term and not a psychiatric one.

Maybe he likes drowning kittens? Or drawing his team mates from the insides.

There is chemically induced madness, and madness from grief. Maybe he's a shaman whose little totem animal has been replaced by Damien?

There are a hundred and one ways to creep out players. Most of them don't even involve necrophelia.

[Heath Robinson]

I would suggest OCD. As the most common mental disorder, it's not too pretty princess but if given some depth, and perhaps a comorbid disorder, it can be quite interesting. I would love to give more description, but I'd basically be rehashing information in the article, and I wouldn't like to presume your capacity to apply such material on your own.

Orcus,
Depression is not "boohoo, I am sad" when it is a mental disorder. Depression as a mental disorder is fucking miserable (that expletive is not inappropriately used). It is being unable to get up because you feel like you have no energy. Day in, day out you oversleep, you undersleep, you feel tired no matter how much sleep you have. You don't eat because you can't feel like it matters whether you eat or not. Depression is learned helplessness turned up to 11. It is when you lose all enjoyment in activities that used to make you smile - permanently. It is when you see people feeling happy and are envious because they have something you can't have. It is when you think that you are incapable of doing, or being, anything good. You are incapable of feeling good - but you're still capable of feeling bad.

Look, it's difficult to describe until you experience it. That would be why I am trying and failing to do so. I haven't experienced that kind of existence. It is not a normal or rational thing (hence "disorder") because losing all your self-esteem and happiness is not a normal thing in any sense of that word. I hope that you are merely misunderstanding the difference between an episode of extreme sadness, and having Major Depressive Disorder. Clinical Depression causes enough suffering that people kill themselves to get away from it - and that is not overreaction, that's a rational enough choice when your existence is painted solely in negative emotion.

Ah, damn. Just thinking about people suffering like has me getting depressed.

[CanRay]

"His popularity ratings are the lowest for a serving president since President Rodham was found fisting kittens..." - Transmetropolitan.

Insanity shows in many forms and in many ways. OCD is a form of "Insanity", and it may be as simple as requiring that you HAVE to check that your door is locked a couple of times before you can comfortably leave your house.

Or, you can be totally batnuts insane where you're making furniture out of the Security Goons you kill.

Or, worse of all, you're the guy that buys that furniture.

And everything in between.

[Chrysalis]

Some thoughts:

He believes his girlfriend is still alive and keeps on talking with her voice mail as if she was actually there.

He dresses as his girlfriend and goes to bars in the hopes of killing "rapists". He's kinda aware of doing it, but has no control over it. He sexually gets off on both being picked up and the kill.

He keeps physical memorabilia of her next to him, a ring, a photo, he always has it in his hand. Maybe it's been turned into a foci.

He has his girlfriend's name cut in mirror image on his chest.

[explorator]

Some thoughts:

He believes his girlfriend is still alive and keeps on talking with her voice mail as if she was actually there.

He dresses as his girlfriend and goes to bars in the hopes of killing "rapists". He's kinda aware of doing it, but has no control over it. He sexually gets off on both being picked up and the kill.

Whoa, those are certainly overt sign that someone is nuts. What if he starts obsessing with the idea of getting plastic surgery/gender re-assignment in order to trap and kill predatory men? Or just stalks other women who resemble his ex, thinking maybe she is still alive?

Just remember, not all of a mentally ill person's behaviours are irrational. I think that is the key to playing a crazy character.

[Tiny Deev]

A lot of good suggestions, especially the "Pretend she is still alive" thing. Although, the big Troll Shaman that I played actually recieved her ashes and scattered them, I'm sure he could 'forget' that that ever happened. Just calling her voice-mail, leaving messages. Calling up 2 minutes later, breaking up with her. Calling her again to say he's sorry and didn't mean it. Call her to tell her to pick up or he's going to leave.
You know what, when you're acting like this you're just like your mother! And we came to Seattle to get away from our parents! Damn it Candy, pick up the phone or its through!

Also, the OCD is a very good idea which I can act out, and visible enough for anyone to pick up on.

The changing into his girlfriend thing, goes a bit far. Sure, I'm a Troll, I won't ever fit in her panties, but I can't get behind that providing him any closure. Maybe thats because of his character, who knows. The finding rapists and persueing and ultimatly killing them to get himself offthough, that one I can get behind.

[Karoline]

A lot of good suggestions, especially the "Pretend she is still alive" thing. Although, the big Troll Shaman that I played actually recieved her ashes and scattered them, I'm sure he could 'forget' that that ever happened.

You never really explained how he knew that any of these things happened to his girlfriend. You seemed to indicate he wasn't actually there at the time, so I don't think it would be too hard for him to convince himself it was all a ploy. The ashes could have been a burned package of soy for all he knows.

[Blade]

The grief-model. I don't know how accurate it is, but it's something I've found very useful when GMing and playing, to handle "realistically" the loss of someone.

If you want your character to be insane, you can have your character get stuck at one stage.
Denial would be like "No, she's still alive." Complete with an AR copy of her (or even a real girl modified to look like her (and even reprogrammed to behave like her))
Anger would probably lead to the "Kill them all" you want to avoid (though it can take another form)
Bargaining could lead to something like "I'm sure magic or tech can bring her back, or at least let me speak to her one more time."
As for Depression... don't, you're not playing Vampire (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
Even acceptance can be interesting: I've got a character who's life has been destroyed twice just because of some bad luck and even if he has accepted everything, he's now completely detached, not caring about what could happens to others (or at least trying not to care).

[Tiny Deev]

You never really explained how he knew that any of these things happened to his girlfriend. You seemed to indicate he wasn't actually there at the time, so I don't think it would be too hard for him to convince himself it was all a ploy. The ashes could have been a burned package of soy for all he knows.

True, I didn't. He wasn't there when the body was found, but his team-mates were. One of the teammates told him, and the groups fixer got him the ashes. He never saw the body, so he never really got any confirmation.

And, I'll take a look at the grief model. Thanks, its been a help.

[AndyZ]

I'd also like to note that there are very many levels of madness.

You can by all means have the guy be flipping out on the inside, changing people into copies of his girlfriend and all, but still have him mission-capable. I actually encourage this, because once you're not mission-capable, all the PCs suffer.

A great example is that Hannibal Lecter was clearly out of his flipping gourd but could still function, hold conversations, help figure out who the killer is and all such. People didn't even know he was crazy until they found out he was eating people.

You mentioned that he's a shaman. What does he believe has happened to her spirit? Is she resting in the next world with the ancestor spirits? Does she seek vengeance before she can move on? Does he even know?

If I were to describe insanity, I would describe it not as what you do that makes you crazy, but what you Need to do which keeps you as sane as you are. If he's changing people into his girlfriend, he obviously can't let go.

I would have him summon and bind a spirit of man, have him see it as his girlfriend and decide that she's now an ancestor spirit. Your mileage may vary on the idea. Either way, I hope all that helps.

[Ravor]

Also, kill the fragging Decker, but only after you kill everyone that he has ever known or loved...

[crash2029]

The loss of a loved one, especially in such a violent way, can cause anyone to go a little off the rails. However for someone who is either predisposed or already a sufferer of a mental illness, 'a little off the rails' can very easily turn into completley batshit. If you are planning to lean towards batshit I would recommed a psychotic break with a disassociative state. In other words the trigger caused him to leave reality and enter a personal hallucination. You should decide what the details of the hallucination are. The classic hallmarks of a disassociative state is reacting to stimuli that others don't percieve and reacting to percieved stimuli in radical ways. The classic "neighbor's dog told me to kill them" deal. As a player this will be very challenging because you must continually make note of not only the setting but also the details of the character's hallucination in order to roleplay insanity in a consistent, yet disturbing way.

[kanislatrans]

Also, kill the fragging Decker, but only after you kill everyone that he has ever known or loved...

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/ic.gif)


"I don't see this being an insane response. In fact I would think that this the only sane reaction to the trauma suffered. As the perpetrators had no respect for the life they abused and then snuffed out, none should be awarded them. "an eye for an eye" as the good book says. and since the angels of vengence are busy, it is up to me to pick up the sword of retribution and exact the wages of sin. I will show them the error of their ways and guide them to their just reward. I take strength in my righteous duty even if it costs my own life. her spirit may be at peace, but mine will remain restless until the time of blood and fire is done. Lest I fall into sin myself I will brand myself with each life that I take, a reminder that pride cometh before a fall. As the brand burns so shall the sinners, till hells gates recieve them all and I can rest with my love again I heaven..."

"Perhaps sometimes sane people must do insane things to protect the meek. Or maybe sanity is just an excuse for cowardice. I am no theologian. But I know that my heart is a little lighter with each killer I kill, and I know I am doing Gods work because my angel smiles at me in my dreams and I hear her laughter in the screams of the evildoers. ."

*-SAINT SOPHIA-*

[McAllister]

"I don't see this being an insane response. In fact I would think that this the only sane reaction to the trauma suffered. As the perpetrators had no respect for the life they abused and then snuffed out, none should be awarded them. "an eye for an eye" as the good book says. and since the angels of vengence are busy, it is up to me to pick up the sword of retribution and exact the wages of sin. I will show them the error of their ways and guide them to their just reward. I take strength in my righteous duty even if it costs my own life. her spirit may be at peace, but mine will remain restless until the time of blood and fire is done. Lest I fall into sin myself I will brand myself with each life that I take, a reminder that pride cometh before a fall. As the brand burns so shall the sinners, till hells gates recieve them all and I can rest with my love again I heaven..."

"Perhaps sometimes sane people must do insane things to protect the meek. Or maybe sanity is just an excuse for cowardice. I am no theologian. But I know that my heart is a little lighter with each killer I kill, and I know I am doing Gods work because my angel smiles at me in my dreams and I hear her laughter in the screams of the evildoers. ."

*-SAINT SOPHIA-*

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/love.gif) What the hell is this from?

[kanislatrans]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/love.gif) What the hell is this from?

Its from a character backstory I wrote for a character who hunts two legged predators in her free time. Like the OP's character she lost her love in a brutal way and built a "rational" explanaiton based on what religion she remembered from her child hood. Its a little fractured but then so is the characters...

she was inspired by a little bit "boondock saints" a little Cruxshadows, and little I.C.P. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

[Kyrel]

Portraying insanity realisticly is usually a challenge to any player, as it requires you, as a player, to be able to adopt a different way of perceiving the world around you, and then basing the actions of your character on that warped perspective. It's a challenge, and it can quickly become stupid, if it's not pulled off properly.

First off I'd suggest that you look for a list and description of a variety of real mental illnesses, find something suitable, and then research the chosen condition. A place you can start, is http://www.sanguinus.com/pl0022.shtml. It's admittingly a Vampire site, but the article is pretty good, and gives you a list and description of a good number of real mental disorders to look at.

Second off I'd suggest that you realise that a derangement impairs the character, and such negative effects should also be represented in game terms, i.e. reduction of your dice pools in social settings or increased threadsholds for Perception checks could be two possible effects of a derangement.

Finally I'll say that given your description of the character and the triggering event, I'd say that Acute Stress Disorder could be a logical result of witnessing the rape and death of his girlfriend, whilst being unable to do anything about it. Adjustment Disorder and Bereavement would be two other logical consequences for the character, as well as Brief Psychotic Disorder. One option could be to have him start off with a Brief Psychotic Disorder, possibly combined with Acute Stress Disorder. These could then give way to Bereavement and Adjustment Disorder.


Good luck and have "fun"...(IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[The Jake]

"I've demonstrated there's no difference between me and everyone else! All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day." - The Joker, Killing Joke

- J.