Who owns Shadowrun?, WizKids has been bought by NECA Options

[Larsine]

WizKids has bee sold to NECA (National Entertainment Collectibles Association, Inc.), as can be seen here: http://www.wizkidsgames.com/ and http://www.necaonline.com/article/detail/278.

But they only write about the clix-games and the pocket card games. No mention of Shadowrun or Battletech. So that makes you wonder, who owns Shadowrun and Battletech?

Is it still in the hands of Topps, Wizkids or could we be so lucky that Catalyst has actually acquired the licenses?

Lars

[Bull]

Topps retained Ownership. I asked Adam about this the day the sale was officially announced.

From what I understand, NECA bought the Wizkids name, the "Clix" brand, and either the Marvel (and I'd guess DC) licenss for Heroclix was transferred over, or NECA negotiated a new contract. I have no clue about where the other licensed Clix brands stand, other than that I think CGL holds all the Battetech and Mechwarrior rights (Other than Video game/computer), so NECA can't do a new Mechwarrior Clix game.

Bull

[hobgoblin]

i am getting a headache trying to visualize this...

yay for modern IP agreements...

[TBRMInsanity]

i am getting a headache trying to visualize this...

yay for modern IP agreements...

Its a world where only lawyers benefit. Too bad there wasn't a way for the originator of an IP to still gain credit, but anyone capable of doing further development could do so. Royalties kinda do it (they protect the originator but stifle development), and IP aggrements kinda do it (the originator loses some rights so that others can further development, but this can lead to a legal SNAFU).

[hobgoblin]

creative commons?

anyways, all this makes me think that in SR the *AA's have won, and that the DRM, while breakable, is the least of your worries. That is, if you try to do anything on any node with a DRM broken program, your access id gets flagged, the holder of copyright gets a notice, and you get a nasty letter from a lawyer, or a visit from some runners out to collect, depending on your living conditions.

that is unless you routinely spoof access id, only access nodes in the virtual equivalent of a Z-zone, and basically do not exist in the eyes of the powers that be...

also, GNU and GPL never happened in SR, so the open source mentioned in unwired is at best BSD licensed. So for all one knows, every project that picks up some level of usability gets siphoned of to some corp R&D for polishing and packaging.

in all instances, the corps win in the long run...

[LurkerOutThere]

Allow me to be the lone voice in the wilderness, or perhaps the ivory tower as the case may be.

I find Intellectual Property law to be a good thing as it keeps creators having as little or as much control as they choose while also protecting those who might wish to purchase and use those rights.

Furthermore lets not confuse DRM and piracy with IP law it's like saying the way we handle maritime law to the rules governing flag football.

[hobgoblin]

I find Intellectual Property law to be a good thing as it keeps creators having as little or as much control as they choose while also protecting those who might wish to purchase and use those rights.

while i suspect we should probably move this of the forum, as it will rapidly have zero to do with SR, how do IP laws protect the customer exactly?

[Lok1 :)]

Don't worry, all the ownership will be scrambled by the first crash anyways. Of course by then we'll be to busy dieing with VITAs, awakening and goblinizing to find time to play games.

[hobgoblin]

meh, ill be parked in some out of the way place, making sure my data is virus-free, and reading up on simsense and asist...

[LurkerOutThere]

Are we speaking about customers as the end product consumers? It doesn't but then again it's not designed to. Intellectual Property law, as say it's in regards to shadowrun for example isn't a customer affecting issue.

[hobgoblin]

ah, i read it wrong, your talking about protecting trades in rights, not between creator and your basic joe on the street...

i guess our basic problem is that IP laws came to be when the equipment needed for mass copying where expensive and time consuming to set up and operate.

these days however every person have potentially access to a device that would make gutenberg scream witchcraft...

[Joe Chummer]

Topps retained Ownership. I asked Adam about this the day the sale was officially announced.

From what I understand, NECA bought the Wizkids name, the "Clix" brand, and either the Marvel (and I'd guess DC) licenss for Heroclix was transferred over, or NECA negotiated a new contract. I have no clue about where the other licensed Clix brands stand, other than that I think CGL holds all the Battetech and Mechwarrior rights (Other than Video game/computer), so NECA can't do a new Mechwarrior Clix game.

Bull

From what I understand, Topps still owns the IP rights for both Shadowrun AND BattleTech. CGL licensed the rights to Battletech from Topps, just like they licensed the rights for Shadowrun. Microsoft's erstwhile video-game rights to these two IPs was licensed a few years back to Smith & Tinker (Jordan Weisman's VG startup).

I would think that, if Wizkids 2.0 wanted to continue/relaunch MechWarrior as a Clix game, they'd have to license the rights from Topps. But then again, I could be wrong, because I don't know the nature of the agreement with CGL. Me, I see Battletech (the board game) and MechWarrior (in the Clix incarnation) to be two completely different games; however, the license agreement with CGL might cover the gamut of "all tabletop games using Battletech/MechWarrior branding."

Although marginally off-topic: What's funny to me is that FASA (as an IP-holding company only) still owns the rights to Earthdawn (the "history of Shadowrun," some of my friends have called it). I wonder why FASA didn't sell this IP to Wizkids/Topps when it sold SR and BT and thus also license it to CGL? As much as I love all three of these games, it would've been nice to see them all fall under the same banner, especially seeing how much love CGL has given SR and BT thus far...

[LurkerOutThere]

As someone who hates earthdawn and hates it's continued influence on shadowrun I for one am glad that did not happen. I have also heard a unsubstatiated rumor that CGL passed on Earthdawn.

[Joe Chummer]

As someone who hates earthdawn and hates it's continued influence on shadowrun I for one am glad that did not happen. I have also heard a unsubstatiated rumor that CGL passed on Earthdawn.

Color me curious: Why do you hate Earthdawn so much? Don't get me wrong: I prefer SR over ED, but I really appreciate the chord ED struck. For one, it's a breath of fresh air compared to the same-old-same-old feel of traditional D&D.

Also, for the record, ED doesn't directly influence SR anymore, apart from their shared past (in the 4th World vs. 6th World sense). CGL has mentioned in the past that Red Brick and CGL have agreed to not step on each other's respective game worlds, such that Red Brick's ED developments won't cause any far-reaching continuity issues with SR and CGL would do the same with SR in relation to ED's continuity, and the two games don't ever reference each other anymore. In other words, don't expect to see any more ED-era immortal elves or dragons popping up in SR.

[hobgoblin]

iirc, earthdawn was already licensed out to a third party when fasa "tanked" and passed battletech and shadowrun on to wizkid (who licensed it on to fanpro, who had done the german version on license from fasa earlier).

btw, earthdawn is currently licensed to red brick limited...

[Blade]

Intellectual Property is theft! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Thanee]

traditional D&D

I'm really not sure, whether the new edition of D&D can be called 'traditional' in any sense of the word. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

Ok, you still kill monsters and take their stuff...

Bye
Thanee

[Cardul]

I'm really not sure, whether the new edition of D&D can be called 'traditional' in any sense of the word. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

Ok, you still kill monsters and take their stuff...

Bye
Thanee

And find enchanted longswords in the bellies of lions..yet, now, you need no longer go looking
for bat guano and sulfur to hurl fireballs (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[Thanee]

Heh. That's still better than suits of full plate armor dropping from dead insect swarms (Diablo 2). (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Bye
Thanee

[Blade]

"You're a squirrel who somehow has money, and sometimes swords and shields."

[TBRMInsanity]

I think CGL did a good job with their Eclipse Phase license personally. It basically means that if the fans of Eclipse Phase want it to live, then the IP won't ever get into the hands of the lawyers which could spell death to the RPG.

[Joe Chummer]

I think CGL did a good job with their Eclipse Phase license personally. It basically means that if the fans of Eclipse Phase want it to live, then the IP won't ever get into the hands of the lawyers which could spell death to the RPG.

I agree that it's a good idea to make sure an IP doesn't descend into legal hell, but I have to wonder about the long-term profitability of a Creative Commons license if you let people copy and redistribute it for personal use (so long as you credit the original source). Maybe I don't fully understand the CC license paradigm, but if someone wants to explain how it works in a profitable business model, I'm all ears.

On a side note, if anyone has the Eclipse Phase book, send me a PM and tell me what you think of it. The premise sounds interesting, but I've never been a huge fan of "percentile dice" RPG systems.

[Joe Chummer]

iirc, earthdawn was already licensed out to a third party when fasa "tanked" and passed battletech and shadowrun on to wizkid (who licensed it on to fanpro, who had done the german version on license from fasa earlier).

btw, earthdawn is currently licensed to red brick limited...

It looks like you are correct about the 3rd party license (Living Room Games, in 1999). Although I have to wonder why FASA licensed out a viable game to a third party rather than having their own talented pool of creators work on it...? They didn't pull out of the industry until a whole 2 years later.

[Bull]

Earthdawn has gotten "Cancelled" prior to FASA closing down. It wasn't selling, and a last ditch effort to rally some interest and/or support in the form of a Rules CD-Rom that was packed in with a couple magazines (InQuest, Shadis, and maybe a couple others) failed.

[Joe Chummer]

Earthdawn has gotten "Cancelled" prior to FASA closing down. It wasn't selling, and a last ditch effort to rally some interest and/or support in the form of a Rules CD-Rom that was packed in with a couple magazines (InQuest, Shadis, and maybe a couple others) failed.

Was it not selling presumably because diehard D&Ders flipped ED the bird? Sadly, Most D&D fans I've known have a predisposition against ED for no valid reason, probably for the same reasons some people who've never played or know anything about SR hate the game because they "don't want any namby-pamby elves in their cyberpunk, thank you."

Nowadays, a PDF of an RPG book isn't too out of the question (although most people I know who have a PDF prefer to also to have a copy to read "in the meat" since they can't always be sitting in front of their computer/laptop). But back then? E-format books weren't really all that feasible. What probably would have served them better would have been if they had put together a digest-size "first Earthdawn adventure" rules packet to whet the appetite, much like how SR did with "Food Fight." InQuest used to pack in quickstart rule things like that all the time.