Seeking Seattle runners…, Recruitment thread for a PbP game in Seattle, 2072 Options

[Trench]

Ok I want to get things rolling so instead of making a dwarf named Violent Kid, Im going to convert my elf to the karma build. Ill have numbers soon but heres the basic concept.

Shadow is a mystic adept. His mentor Spirit is Chameleon. He likes p.257.

Adept powers: traceless walk, combat sense, improved blades, improved infiltration

Spells: Physical Camouflage, Shadow, Increase Reflexes, Gecko Crawl, Magic fingers, Elemental Aura(smoke), Deflection

I know he is similar to an existing character, however stealth is one area where teamwork is only possible if multiple characters can do it. Ill probably throw in a gun for good measure.

Keren, instead of changing the base weapon damage, i suggest you offer special ammunition. Does it have the same stats as an existing ammunition?

[Kerenshara]

Keren, instead of changing the base weapon damage, i suggest you offer special ammunition. Does it have the same stats as an existing ammunition?

Special ammo is not what I had in mind.

The weapons in the book are Gener-o-Bland^TM in the extreme. The FN HAR has NOTHING to recommend it over anything, even the lowly AK; The built-in Gas-Vent is a joke. Sure, it's not an accessory, but it still takes the barrel slot for all intents and purposes. But put in the heavier round it SHOULD have?

Oh, duh! The G12A3z is also the same stats. In older ed's of the game, those guns actually had higher base damage IIRC.

The other guns, you're trading damage for penetration on the P93, arguably a LOSS in terms of net damage, unless the difference is P or S based on getting through armor in the first place. The FN 5-7C is inferior to the other weapons mainly due to ammunition capacity. This gives it a LITTLE something. And the Security 600, that magazine capacity SCREAMS "Medium Pistol", so I figured, why not? Besides, it means the guards have a slightly better chance against you 'runner types. And there are plenty of reasons to choose other weapons in the class.

Small side note here, if you select a Medium Pistol weapon: if you choose subsonic ammo, you lose the "improvement" to penetration before you apply the "subsonic" template. It's effective because it's so fast; It has to drop even further than most rounds to go subsonic.

Oh! I forgot to tell you this (and it's in your favor, big time!)

Unless it's a "Medium Pistol Ammo" weapon:

Light Pistols, Machine Pistols and SMGs all fire "Light Pistol Ammo".

Assault Rifles (except the HAR and the G12) and LMGs fire "Light Rifle Ammo", as do any 6P damage Sporting Rifles.

MMGs, HMGs and 7P Sporting Rifles (and the HAR and G12) fire "Medium Rifle Ammo"

8P rifles fire "Heavy Rifle Ammo"

Sniper Rifles need special ammo - sorry. And it has to be apropriate to the damage code.

The Ruger Warhawk fires "X-Pistol Ammo" while that PJSS Elephant gun fires "X-Rifle Ammo"

In summary, there are two classes of ammo: Rifle (long casing) and Pistol (short casing)
Then each class comes in Light, Medium, Heavy and "X"

That means you can swap bullets between compatible platforms... like your Light Pistol and SMG. I DID mention there were reasons to carry a Light Pistol, right?

There are actually detailed rules behind the changes and they're very internally consistent.

[Kerenshara]

Ok I want to get things rolling so instead of making a dwarf named Violent Kid, Im going to convert my elf to the karma build. Ill have numbers soon but heres the basic concept.

Shadow is a mystic adept. His mentor Spirit is Chameleon. He likes p.257.

Adept powers: traceless walk, combat sense, improved blades, improved infiltration

Spells: Physical Camouflage, Shadow, Increase Reflexes, Gecko Crawl, Magic fingers, Elemental Aura(smoke), Deflection

I know he is similar to an existing character, however stealth is one area where teamwork is only possible if multiple characters can do it. Ill probably throw in a gun for good measure.

OK, so you're stealthy, but what do you DO once you've snuck in? Just fight? Or Breaking & Entering? Demolitions? *wink*

[Trench]

Ive got about 100 karma to spend on whatever the party needs. Killing is his business So B&E makes sense, but whether thats major or minor will depend on what the party needs. Am I to understand that I get <.5 essence loss without magic loss? And that I can initiate twice?

also how do you interpret the following passage:

Roxanne is a mystic adept with a Magic attribute of 4. She spends 1 point of Magic for
1 Power Point, which she uses to purchase four levels of Rapid Healing. Her other 3
points of Magic are dedicated to Magic skills. When using her Magic-linked dice pools,
such as Spellcasting or Summoning, she will be able to allocate 3 dice for Magic (since
the other is tied up in her adept powers). For all other uses, her Magic attribute
counts at its full value of 4.

[Karoline]

I don't think you get any essence loss at all without losing a point of magic. What lead you to believe any different? I think B&E would be good as well. My character is stealth, but lacks the B&E parts.

As for the passage... odd, sounds like you get your full magic value as far as adept abilities are concerned, but I know from experience Keren will treat adept magic and mage magic as separate things (Fairly certain on this).

[Ol' Scratch]

Yeah, any amount of Essence loss equates to Magic loss. I'm not aware of any house rule to the contrary.

And the passage you quoted works exactly like it says. For purposes of determining how many dice you throw down when casting a spell, Roxanne would use Magic 3. For purposes of determining how many Power Points she has, she uses a Magic of 1. For purposes of determining, say, her maximum Magic rating, the number of foci she can bind, or anything else that relies solely on Magic but is independent of spellcasting/adept powers, she has a Magic of 4.

[Generic_PC]

IF you plan to play an Awakened / Virtuakinetic character with cyber-, bio- or geneware, please talk to me. The exact cost of the "lost" magic point will depend on your history and my evaluation of your character sheet, but it will probably be less than the full nominal cost for the last point.

Just thought I'd make that more clear. He's probably struck a deal...

I can't decide if I like SR3, where you had a magic of 6 that went down as your essence did, or SR4, where you can buy your magic to a 9...

[Karoline]

My guess is that Trench is interested in the fact that the example shows the character getting 4 levels of an adept power despite only having one point of magic devoted to it (Because I think that maximum levels of adept power is equal to magic usually).

But yeah, what exactly you have a question about would help alot, because 'interpret this' often leads to books being written.

[Ol' Scratch]

I can't decide if I like SR3, where you had a magic of 6 that went down as your essence did, or SR4, where you can buy your magic to a 9...

Wait, SR4 lets you exceed your Essence+Grade for Magic? Can you quote me a page for this? That'll drastically change a character of mine.

[Trench]

To me, that passage implies that for some purposes, a mystic adepts magic is not divided. Keep in mind this is the example from the section that defines the adept. It says you split your pool between adept powers and spellcasting dice. For All other purposes, use your full magic. That would mean for adept powers like attribute boost where you roll magic. That would mean that for the purpose of max force a mystic adept uses full magic as well.

I thought I read one of the characters saying something about that. I havent struck a deal yet.

[Karoline]

Wait, SR4 lets you exceed your Essence+Grade for Magic? Can you quote me a page for this? That'll drastically change a character of mine.

He didn't say that. I think he is forgetting (or I'm remembering wrong) that initiation existed in SR3 as well, and that it also raised your magic. So basically magic used to only come in full power form, where as now you can have someone who hasn't reached their full potential yet.

[Ol' Scratch]

To me, that passage implies that for some purposes, a mystic adepts magic is not divided. Keep in mind this is the example from the section that defines the adept. It says you split your pool between adept powers and spellcasting dice. For All other purposes, use your full magic. That would mean for adept powers like attribute boost where you roll magic. That would mean that for the purpose of max force a mystic adept uses full magic as well.

The only time it's not divided is when you're dealing with things that affect your overall magic capability. Again, like determining how many foci you can have or resisting the drain of a metaplanar quest.

And thanks for the clarification, Karoline. That would have been a pretty big deal if true. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Generic_PC]

He didn't say that. I think he is forgetting (or I'm remembering wrong) that initiation existed in SR3 as well, and that it also raised your magic. So basically magic used to only come in full power form, where as now you can have someone who hasn't reached their full potential yet.

This. In SR3, magic was really high until it was lowered. Now, it can go both ways.

[Kerenshara]

The only time it's not divided is when you're dealing with things that affect your overall magic capability. Again, like determining how many foci you can have or resisting the drain of a metaplanar quest.

And thanks for the clarification, Karoline. That would have been a pretty big deal if true. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Well, the way it came out (with some DEV input) in another thread is that if it involves DICE, it's split. So things that provide a boost equal to your MAGic would count the split (Boost Attribute). Things that have a RTG use the RTG, which itself is capped to the "split" rating. The last category falls under Dr. F's definition; An example is "the adept can maintain this power for up to MAGic hours" uses the full MAGic rating.

And as I just touched on, if you only have 1 actual MAGic point in "Adept Powers", you can't have more than 1 rank in any RTG power. Even if you purchase extra "Power Points" as an optional Metamagic Power, it's not raising that split, so you're broadening your knowledge, NOT deepening it.

That make sense?

Incidentally, Trench, FYI, I'm going over the character sheets that have been submitted in detail, and we're shockingly well covered in close combat power. It's almost like you people are paranoid about me disarming you of your guns or something. We have a couple of people who are decent in stealth, but we are in need of more Breaking & Entering (Lockpicking, Hardware) and vehicle skills. Heavy weapons are covered, and ranged combat is about moderately covered. More to the point, with what you've provided so far, Johnson wouldn't be coming to you at this point... maybe later, but certainly not for the first 'run. If all Johnson wanted was a "hit", there are ... statted NPCs that are very well suited to the task. If you're genuinely interested in helping the group as a whole, support skills are much more in demand. Haven't seen a dedicated Medic yet, still kind of soft on "face" skills, more vehicle skills would be prime, things like that.

Oh, and to everybody: I know not all the gear listings are complete, but are your DocWagon^TM contracts paid up?

[Ol' Scratch]

Oh, and to everybody: I know not all the gear listings are complete, but are your DocWagonTM contracts paid up?

Normally I avoid them like the plague on a runner (seriously, what professional criminal is going to run around with a tracking single on his wrist and hire a company to basically come arrest him whenever he gets hurt?), but my character for this game does indeed have a basic contract.

[Karoline]

Normally I avoid them like the plague on a runner (seriously, what professional criminal is going to run around with a tracking single on his wrist and hire a company to basically come arrest him whenever he gets hurt?), but my character for this game does indeed have a basic contract.

Well, technically, DocWagon is its own extraterritorial entity, including any ambulance they pick you up in. This means among other things that the corp you offended would have to go through extradition procedures with DocWagon to get at you from the moment you get chucked into the ambulance. This power also allows them to enter other corp's territory to come pick you up (Though they may not risk it depending on contract and corp in question). It also means that the other corp won't shoot at the ambulance, even when they are crashing onto their property and picking up their enemies.

So yeah, they're actually the exact opposite of being arrested really, so long as you can get out of there before the procedures are done (Which can take a heck of a long time, DocWagon doesn't really want to give up a paying customer)

The real problem with DocWagon contracts is that even their fastest response time is several times longer than it takes someone to bleed out based on current rules, so they may just end up picking up your corpse. Still, if you manage to stabilize they could be a life saver for a job gone way south.

Tempest has her own reasons for not having a contract with them though (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Kerenshara]

Actually, extraterioritality means the CAN'T come on the compound, but they can (and will) fight to pull your hoops out of the fire once you hit the street. There's even a short story in one of the books about that very fact...

[BlueMax]

Actually, extraterioritality means the CAN'T come on the compound, but they can (and will) fight to pull your hoops out of the fire once you hit the street. There's even a short story in one of the books about that very fact...

It may be more than one. Doc Wagon will be a good idea in this campaign with its house ruled healing.


IM from Orb

"Chummers, your missing a hell of a match. The Sabres have two kids who remind me of Punch and Judy. This is going to be an awesome season."

[Karoline]

Actually, extraterioritality means the CAN'T come on the compound, but they can (and will) fight to pull your hoops out of the fire once you hit the street. There's even a short story in one of the books about that very fact...

Oh? I seem to remember reading a story talking about how they literally crashed through another companies gates/fence to get to their contract's location and pull him out from enemy fire. Even seem to recall some of his buddies wanting to hitch a ride but the medics telling them to take a hike.

[JoelHalpern]

No, Mach does not have a DocWagon contract.
This is driven by several sets of perception:
1) Many times, as Shdowarunners, we are going to be in places that DocWagon just won't go. While I don't know what we are going to be doing, an awful lot of situations are either corporate or to hot for DocWagon Basic. (And the higher grades are just too expensive to prepay on a yearly basis.)
2) Wandering around trying to hide with a device which, if things go partially wrong, will start broadcast a load radio signal seems like a risky choice. Yes, one can argue that if it starts broadcasting, then you probably have sufficiently alerted the enemy for it not to matter. But I think many cases are just not that clear cut

As a bodyguard, if things are going wrong, the image of rescue arriving for me before my client is just wrong.
Admittedly, my clients probably have DocWagon super-platinum. But I don't get to ask that question.

Also, as someone pointed out, the time from when you get injured enough to call them till you are dead is much shorter than any meaningful response time. The only advantage I can see is that they have enough muscle to move my body if I am alive but unconscious. Typically, moving the down friends out is my job.

One of the odd things is that where everything else that has continuing costs is in months, Docwagon is in Years. A year is, as far as I can tell, half of forever in this sort of game.

Yours,
Joel / Mach

[Karoline]

A year is, as far as I can tell, half of forever in this sort of game.

Yours,
Joel / Mach

Much closer to twice of forever actually (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Your second point largely depends on how you have it set to go off, and remember that even if it goes off, it is still only broadcasting its existence to DocWagon. It could be operating in hidden mode if you wanted, and would overall not be any easier to track down than any wireless communication the team might be doing.

[BlueMax]

Orb will want Doc Wagon Gold for the discounts on medium to long term Medical care.
The rescue aspect is SR1-SR2, and a hair of SR3. SR4's quest for realism and accuracy is that kid pooping in the pool 6 AM on the 4th of July.


BlueMax

[Generic_PC]

Question: Does my Ogre stomach count for the hospitalized lifestyle? (It's a flat 20% reduction off all lifestyles, so I'd say so...)

If so, does this stack with the DocWagon contract? (So, would I pay 350:nuyen: for basic care or 700:nuyen: for instensive care?)

It probably won't matter. I'll have either a basic or a gold DocWagon Contract, depending on money left over.

[BlueMax]

Question: Does my Ogre stomach count for the hospitalized lifestyle? (It's a flat 20% reduction off all lifestyles, so I'd say so...)

If so, does this stack with the DocWagon contract? (So, would I pay 350:nuyen: for basic care or 700:nuyen: for instensive care?)

It probably won't matter. I'll have either a basic or a gold DocWagon Contract, depending on money left over.

At least he can stomach hospital food.

As a note, being Virtuakinetically gifted fits well into a Hospitalized Lifestyle and food on the drip.

BlueMax

[Generic_PC]

He'd probably prefer grass and bark. It tastes better. Keeping it down isn't the problem.

As an aside, currently for my gun closet, I'm looking at a P93, which takes Light Pistol Ammo, a FN HAR, A Remington 750 and an Ultimax MMG, all three of which use medium rifle ammo.

Should I be looking at another gun? What would you guys recommend? Looking it over, I'm lacking an easily concealable gun, but thats about it. Maybe a shotgun, if I really need it. (Oh! These are eating up about 3k each. The MMG, when I finish with it, WILL be even more. Probably closer to 12k or 15k. Woo.)

@Kerenshara: Does the internal smartlink take up slots, or no? Does the description in arsenal override the one in the core book?