Google 207x, 6th world public search engines |
Google 207x, 6th world public search engines |
Nov 2 2009, 02:15 AM
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#1
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514 |
Given how readily data is supposed to be available in the sixth world, do your players, or groups make use of sixth world search engines? Do they Google names, addresses, or other points of interest? I see no way that even the best hacker/cracker in the world, even with a legion of corporate funding could keep track of every search engine, all of the time.
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Nov 2 2009, 02:57 AM
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#2
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 122 Joined: 28-October 09 From: West Point, New York Member No.: 17,805 |
I find one of the most satisfying things about Shadowrun is that we really have no idea what the corps are capable of. Maybe thy have found a way to monitor everything maybe not.
Sorry, i didn;t really answer your question. |
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Nov 2 2009, 03:26 AM
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#3
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Runner Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,946 Joined: 1-June 09 From: Omaha Member No.: 17,234 |
Errr your post confuses me, it's very easy to track search engines. It's already done conventionally in real time. For a corporation who both control their own search engines and can therefore see who is searching what and who can control the bandwidth to see what requests go where controlling search engines would be simplicity itself by RL means.
Now as to how search engines are represented I hadn't given it much luck. When my players want to use one I give it an AR bonus, but for the best security and results your better off with your own browse program which, I might add, are cheap as dirt comparatively. In other words I don't think the corps allowed search engines to come to fruition. |
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Nov 2 2009, 03:27 AM
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#4
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,190 Joined: 31-May 09 From: London, UK Member No.: 17,229 |
Do search engines still exist in the way we know them? A P2P approach would suit the wireless matrix architecture better: you ask your neighbours who ask their neighbours who ask their neighbours who...
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Nov 2 2009, 07:20 AM
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#5
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 |
I'm pretty sure this is covered by the data search skill. (Did I remember the name right? AFB atm)
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Nov 2 2009, 11:37 AM
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#6
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,009 Joined: 25-September 06 From: Paris, France Member No.: 9,466 |
It's covered by Data Search+Browse (or the Fetch agents described in Unwired).
But if you want to develop it further, I think that the search engines of 2070 aren't like Google, but closer to what you have on wap cellphones with closed carrier portals. Forget everything about net-neutrality and "free" internet: if you want something, you pay. There's no centralized search engines, and the search engines that are available are closer to "yellow pages" where people sometimes have to pay to be referenced (or te be the first on the list) and where each new Matrix site has to go through a validation process ("for the security of end users", of course). |
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Nov 2 2009, 01:32 PM
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#7
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514 |
Errr your post confuses me, it's very easy to track search engines. My apologies. I didn't know that. I do not work in the technology field, and have little interest in it-so I'm not surprised when I'm wrong here and there! Can someone in the know tell me just how much someone can learn from your Google usage? Anyone feel like predicting it's status in 207x? |
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Nov 2 2009, 01:47 PM
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#8
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
It's covered by Data Search+Browse (or the Fetch agents described in Unwired). But if you want to develop it further, I think that the search engines of 2070 aren't like Google, but closer to what you have on wap cellphones with closed carrier portals. Forget everything about net-neutrality and "free" internet: if you want something, you pay. There's no centralized search engines, and the search engines that are available are closer to "yellow pages" where people sometimes have to pay to be referenced (or te be the first on the list) and where each new Matrix site has to go through a validation process ("for the security of end users", of course). indeed, and thats what leads me to suspect that most wageslaves do not use high end comlinks for personal use. instead, they use cheapo response 1 devices that they basically use to log into a corp MSP node, that then act as a kind of all in one online computer, providing software, agents and other stuff running on some corp nexi (or cluster of nexi). when they then head to the office, unless they are some cubicle farm "paper" pusher that never handle "sensitive" data and can work in VR from the apartment easy chair, they hand in the private comlink, and access a on-site device after getting past the checkpoint and inside the signal dampening walls. basically, the easiest way to grasp the matrix of SR is to say that the internet and the web as we know it never happened. instead, the BBS of the 80's have gone VR. |
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Nov 2 2009, 02:42 PM
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#9
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,002 Joined: 22-April 06 From: Canada Member No.: 8,494 |
What is Google but a set of web spiders (ie very primitive Knowbots) that search the internet for information and then categorize that information. I would think that when you are doing a data search you have a custom tailored knowbots that you send out into the Matrix to find certain information for you. Your Data Search + Browse roll is a combination of the criteria you are giving the knowbots + your ability to decipher the information presented to you. I would think that a good search program would be a shadow created knowbots that know some low level security hacks so they can obtain some semiprotected information in their searches.
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Nov 2 2009, 02:55 PM
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#10
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514 |
So how serious is searching for information on your target in 207x? Say I get hired to do a smash and grab on a Saeder Krupp facility in Seattle, and I decide to just Google the target, and see what information is publicly available.
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Nov 2 2009, 03:09 PM
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#11
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,546 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
Yes, there's a good deal of data available publicly online, or through private networks and data havens. However, big boys have people whose only job it is is to control information leaks.
If you are hoping to find what Janitor's Bob's address is, it's probably not real hard. If you're hoping to find the secret recipe to Ares Cola, however, it won't exist for just data searches. |
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Nov 2 2009, 03:30 PM
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#12
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,190 Joined: 31-May 09 From: London, UK Member No.: 17,229 |
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Nov 2 2009, 04:23 PM
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#13
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
i hate it when my recently bought bottle goes shedim on me!
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Nov 3 2009, 01:30 AM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 346 Joined: 17-September 06 From: Utah USA Member No.: 9,402 |
Given how readily data is supposed to be available in the sixth world, do your players, or groups make use of sixth world search engines? Do they Google names, addresses, or other points of interest? I see no way that even the best hacker/cracker in the world, even with a legion of corporate funding could keep track of every search engine, all of the time. Hell yes they do!!! I mentioned it once and now they "Google" everything, especially since they don't have a PC hacker. I don't make them do a Data Search for common data either. Search engine technology should really rock by 2072. In fact, I have stated that they can basically run a search and then take all of the facts and wrap it up in a neat little package and send it to a pal. They've had a hacker NPC buddy that would send them output for simple queries in an interactive package, pretty much with wiki and html linking intact. It's the future baby, treat it as such! |
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Nov 3 2009, 01:57 AM
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#15
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,899 Joined: 29-October 09 From: Leiden, the Netherlands Member No.: 17,814 |
I'll certainly look up anything that comes up that seems relevant; but then I'm a curious, control-oriented person. I tend to play wizards, SR is the first game where hackers exist, so..
What I did earlier with a wizard in SR was to buy a few hundred rating 6 datafiles (fairly cheap) just to have a fair chance to have good info on anything that comes up. However, the BBS-like nature of the matrix wasn't very obvious to me until I started reading this forum a couple of days ago. It might change the way I use it (if data havens fulfill wikipedia-like roles of providing free data). I think there's a nice spot for Horizon in the consumer information market. Anyone else see paralells between Horizon and Google? Also, what does it take to have access to a data haven? Should you take it as a contact perhaps? |
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Nov 3 2009, 02:33 AM
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#16
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 346 Joined: 17-September 06 From: Utah USA Member No.: 9,402 |
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Nov 3 2009, 09:20 AM
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#17
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
I think there's a nice spot for Horizon in the consumer information market. Anyone else see paralells between Horizon and Google? now there's a thought. probably roll them with a bit of aol and facebook for good measure. hell, they have already shown themselves to be impressive opinion manipulators, just watch pulsar during emergence. it would not surprise me if the dawkings group pulls some meme seeding ever so often. Hmm, now that i think about it, and that i am reading the dune saga, meme seeding sounds a fair bit like the bene gesserit myth seeding. QUOTE Also, what does it take to have access to a data haven? Should you take it as a contact perhaps? i guess it would depend on the kind of data handled, and where the physical location is set up. If its running out of some free city or similar, one can probably just "walk in", but expect a lot of spam and misdirection seeding. Shadowland and now jackpoint are more invitation or "if you can crack your way in, welcome". |
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Nov 3 2009, 08:01 PM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 278 Joined: 26-June 09 Member No.: 17,321 |
I'm pretty sure (but my be mistaken) that in some fiction I was reading a while back (I think it was Born To Run) that they mention a public search engine called gaugle or some other play on words of google.
I'll check it later to be sure, as for montering it we can do that today, with the matrix at what it is in 2070 I'm guna say just about any of the Corps can find out what the hell your searching. Your fine as long as you use a homemade browse program but otherwise people are guna know what your up to. That said with all the flow data unless you happen to search a big bunch of codewords from a corp project or go around useing Horizon search to look for jackpoint or shadowland* you'll be fine. *Do the corps know about jackpoint? |
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Nov 3 2009, 08:32 PM
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#19
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Runner Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,946 Joined: 1-June 09 From: Omaha Member No.: 17,234 |
The corps most certainly do, they certainly knew about shadowland.
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Nov 3 2009, 09:21 PM
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#20
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,190 Joined: 31-May 09 From: London, UK Member No.: 17,229 |
I'm guna say just about any of the Corps can find out what the hell your searching. That is not such a big deal for runners: corps are not supposed to know who they are in the first place. It might be much more dangerous for public figures: did you know that Brackhaven has a fetish for mixed elf/orc porn? The risk for the runner would rather be that the corp tries to know who performed searches related to a run just done. Runners can deal with it by starting a buzz before the run to drown their datatrail in false positives. All the corp will get is that 4709 SINless in Seattle searched for the XCore project 48 hours before the prototype got stolen. As it is generally impossible to find the start of the buzz, it's the end of the trail. |
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Nov 3 2009, 09:46 PM
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#21
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 135 Joined: 3-November 09 Member No.: 17,838 |
I think any corps sponsored search engine, which would be the ones the majority of people use, the majority of the time, would be heavily edited for what the search can return. Anyone remember Google agreeing to censor the internet for China in order to gain them as a market? In the heavily corps favorable SR mythos, it seems highly likely that a search engine would return only what the corps it belonged to wanted you to find.
Search engines rely on having an extensive database available, whoever controls that database controls what the search engine can effectively do. |
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Nov 3 2009, 10:22 PM
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#22
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,537 Joined: 27-August 06 From: Albuquerque NM Member No.: 9,234 |
The issue is that the Ares sponsored search engine would have oodles of stuff that Aztechnology would rather you not know....
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Nov 3 2009, 11:53 PM
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#23
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 135 Joined: 3-November 09 Member No.: 17,838 |
Then the search engine itself would probably be Availibility 4F or so in areas they controlled. No big deal to shadowrunners, but the majority of the populace, the people Aztechnology would really worry about, would not have it.
Shadowrunners make light of illegality of items, but that tends to be a relatively decent deterrent when it comes to things people do not particularly care about acquiring, unlike drugs. Like many types of knowledge in many of the military regimes, distribution to more "elite" citizens was generally not punished, only distribution to the general populace would be treated severely. |
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Nov 4 2009, 02:09 PM
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#24
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,546 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
I don't think it would have limited availability. However, it's not like it's going to have Aztechnology secrets (or else they're not secrets any more). It likely does have propaganda, but if 70% of your search engine results were regularly propaganda, how much stock would you put in any of it?
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Nov 4 2009, 04:57 PM
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#25
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,537 Joined: 27-August 06 From: Albuquerque NM Member No.: 9,234 |
What it will have is things like the actual history of Aztechnology and Aztlan. Along with lots of documentation, videos, pictures, on the founders and their numerous victims.
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