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 The Ancient Files: Filler, The Annotated Aztlan Annotations |
 Feb 2 2004, 09:31 PM
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#26
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 777 Joined: 18-February 03 Member No.: 4,110  |
I think it makes him more of a 'Hari Seldon' than anything evil... after all sacrifices must be made for the good of the many.
What about Hestaby?
@ Playing Games; you make my space bar sad :( |
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Feb 2 2004, 09:39 PM
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#27
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 114 Joined: 24-November 02 Member No.: 3,638 |
Sirrurg. |
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Feb 2 2004, 10:16 PM
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#28
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
Don't forget Aden. If there was ever a good dragon, it's him.
Note: lying. |
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Feb 2 2004, 11:41 PM
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#29
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,747 Joined: 11-December 02 From: France Member No.: 3,723 |
Never got the occasion to read Aztlan, so just thought, the irony here might be Lofwyr having nukes while Alamais/Winternight spares no effort to acquire some.
"The outcome was required..." And Dunkelzahn to agree. Woah... First interpretation, it's about the mana spike. At least, I don't think Harlequin understand this, or he would react in some way, considering what it forced him to do. As said above, Dunkelzahn might want to teach humanity a lesson through example, but even that is a bit harsh. It cause more trouble than it would solve. Crimsondude might love it as a part of his theory on Dunkelzahn behind Aztlan (and Ehran would know ? hmmm). But why Ehran would brig that ? Second interpretation, tearing the US apart. From Ehran point of view, the obvious interest was the creation of Tir Tairngire, giving control of of a nation's pattern including Crater Lake. Why does Dunkelzahn agree ? International affairs balance ? Destroy a nation's pattern that linked way too much mana singularities (Crater Lake, Texan Locus, Denver spirit, the Anasazi ruins...) ? Could be argued many European countries have their shitload of power sites as well, but afterall they're supposed to split in many nation-states as well. Big disgression to do here. Again, Crimsondude might appreciate how the various secession made Texas vulnerable to Aztlan aggression, putting the locus in their hand. |
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Feb 3 2004, 12:04 AM
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#30
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,047 Joined: 12-November 03 From: Perilously close to the Sioux Nation. Member No.: 5,818 |
Sirrug. /edit/ jerk :twirl: /edit/ Well, Masaru just seems to be interested in the Philipenes and helping the natives. Granted, he may be trying to take it over, but that will be more difficult with a democracy than a Ghostwalker-type dominion. And the stuff in DotSW makes me really wonder about Hestaby, even given the posters angle. |
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Feb 3 2004, 12:34 AM
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#31
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,898 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Artist's rendition of Hestaby, Spawn of Evil.
Reproduced here by permission of the Humanis Policlub Archives. ~J |
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Feb 3 2004, 12:56 AM
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#32
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,047 Joined: 12-November 03 From: Perilously close to the Sioux Nation. Member No.: 5,818 |
I didn't say I thought she was evil.
I am just more suspicious. Although I should have been, ever since she joined the Tir Princes... |
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Feb 3 2004, 01:38 AM
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#33
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Lars J. Matthews? ---- Crimsondude's theroy might explain why Jungle Cat doesn't recongnize the Aztec style of Blood Magic. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Feb 3 2004, 01:55 AM
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#34
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Guests |
I take that back. I just realized that he only meets one part of my two part test.
That's hilarious!
I had thought that this had been settled for some time now towards the second theory, but the first definitely looks more and more likely. The big question is, could there have been multiple purposes behind provoking the GGD? Geopolitically, it did help fracture the U.S. and make it easier for TT to form and Aztlan to take over southern Texas. The revelation to Coleman, however, also led to the release of the Native Americans who were interned and participated in the GGD. Perhaps Ehran sees it as leading to #2, but Dunk also intended it to instigate #1.
I could have sworn that it was, ostensibly, an offering. Why not take it at face value and then assume dragons think elf is the tastiest meat? |
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Feb 3 2004, 02:02 AM
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#35
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
What if Hecate is Alachria and Sheila Blatavaska, but not Sósan Naerain? What if both Sósan and Jenna are her daughters? That would explain the lack of knowing. What evidence do we have that it is Alachria that was coaching Lady Brane Deigh in Tir na nÓg and not another of her daughters?
Very telling, but not too much. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Feb 3 2004, 02:05 AM
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#36
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Guests |
IIRC, she was with Lady Brane Deigh when Aina and H visited her in Worlds Without End.
Aina kept finding that she was popping up in all manner of uncomfortable places. |
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Feb 3 2004, 02:40 AM
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#37
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 |
Right, appropriate first round of corrections and ammendments made. Please tell me if'n ye note anything else, anywhere.
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Feb 3 2004, 02:53 AM
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#38
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Guests |
Dunk's decker might also be Gracie Friel. Dunk's reference, "each of you is here because of who you are and in most cases who you represent, be it country or other interests" is curious insofar as determining that if Azania would merit a representative, Umsondo's allegiance might not be an issue.
What if he's just a pawn for Hualpa or another Great?
Well, this goes back to a long-running discussion (Which was probably a username or two ago. One which I'll admit in hindsight, I was arguing from in such a manner as to prolong a discussion in which we were closer than it seemed) about the politics, and specifically the racial politics of Mexico, and subsequently Aztlan. The conflict in the country was rekindled (assuming it ever went away, but was provoked by the Cold War) in native peoples and the castellanos who run the country diverging politically, economically, and eventually it led to the conflict in Chiapas (which is mentioned in the book). The thing is, many of the native peoples in the Yucatan and southern Mexico are descended from, amongst others, the Mayans, whereas the Aztecs had influence in central and northern Mexico. Northern and southern Mexico, and the Yucatan would more likely be with southern Mexico, are different. They're different like the North and south U.S. were before the Civil War. This conflict escalated significantly in Mexico during the 'oughts and teens which do reflect that there is a conflict between Spanish and pseudo-Aztec influences, and the Mayan peoples who still live in Mexico. But this is not the point. The point is that there was a great amount of suggestion that most, if not all, of the crises were manufactured. That's not surprising, especially given the innuendoes coming out of SR products a decade ago. The provocation of cultural differences and conflicts did help spark the Yucatan conflict; perhaps not outright, but they've been there. And there is an irony that the descendants of the peoples who created the calendar which we (and IC they) use to plot the worlds are, at its base, fighting a war of survival against this manufactured, not altogether ironic social creation which has been focused into the manipulation of circumstances to reflect the Mayan and Aztec beliefs, and corrupt the latter into something for their own purposes. It's an interesting footnote, and one of a couple of items (this and an actual breakdown of why I likened Dunk to Quetzalcoatl) I will try to address more thoroughly, but not now. |
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Feb 3 2004, 03:21 AM
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#39
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
In the last part, the otaku mentions /the/ dragon. Seems to indicate that only one dragon was present and that other was not a dragon. I guess either Brightlight or Denairastas |
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Feb 3 2004, 03:51 AM
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#40
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 |
It never gets done, y'know?
Speaking of which, any more Ancients work K-10? |
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Feb 3 2004, 04:00 AM
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#41
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Yeah, I know. That's half the fun! :grinbig:
:oops: Yes and no. Nothing worth posting so much. But I have come to realize that Lucifer is not an idiot, as much as I hate to admit it. He didn't take Jenna's deal without a back-up plan. |
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Feb 3 2004, 06:07 AM
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#42
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
What if, instead of creating Drakes, the Feathers Serpents made were-creatures? And then, by extension, what if Jungle Cat is a surviving were-jaguar from the previous age. He certainly sounds "worldly" as it were (PUN). |
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Feb 3 2004, 06:12 AM
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#43
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Why wouldn't Hecate, being either Alachia or Aina, ask this question? Both of them should already know the answer.
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Feb 3 2004, 08:47 AM
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#44
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 114 Joined: 24-November 02 Member No.: 3,638 |
I'm going to vote also that Jungle Cat is not a dragon. By the rules for draconic discourse we see in the dragons pdf and in Dragons of the Sixth World, the following line would not have been acceptable:
At least, so it seems to me. And this:
would lead me to suspect that he might be a free spirit after all, though there are other comments that make me less sure.
Also, the Blood Wood book says that it's rumored that Caimbuoul is sharing Alachia's bed, so either one could be an ex-lover. Not for as long, of course. As for the compact they refer to a few times... I've been operating on the assumption that it was the result of the conflict between IEs and Dragons at the end of the 4th world. But, there's no evidence for that. |
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Feb 3 2004, 11:13 AM
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#45
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Target Group: Members Posts: 75 Joined: 24-August 02 Member No.: 3,168 |
I've always thought the 'compact' was an agreement made between the various immortals sometime after the start of the 6th world... to prevent the IE's trying to take out the Dragons and to stop the Dragons trying to take revenge for the downcycle hunting. Seems to make sense... stops them all argueing whilst the Horrors show up and kill everyone!
Now, on the subject of Big D's decker chums setting up this meeting... I never bothered to point this out before, but surely the vast majority of participants in this meeting are running on 'trodes or tortoises - Harlequin doesn't have a datajack for a start, and any free-spirits/shapeshifters/dragons are unlikely to have one either! So at the start they aren't really at the Dragon's mercy as suggested... they could just pull the plug, still, I'm glad they hang around! |
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Feb 3 2004, 06:47 PM
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#46
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
I always read this as a simple "don't believe these locations!" from Jungle Cat. As in, the camps were named in such a way that locations could be easily guessed at, and then put somewhere else. Making a code that seems easy to crack is a great means of misdirection. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Feb 4 2004, 01:35 AM
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#47
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Guests |
Figures. But it would have been so much cooler had it not been so blatant. |
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Feb 4 2004, 01:37 AM
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#48
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
It can't have been too blatant if Hecate's identity has been up in the air this long. :D |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Feb 4 2004, 02:00 AM
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#49
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Guests |
Well, confirmation was lacking, but ... yeah.
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Feb 4 2004, 11:00 AM
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#50
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 345 Joined: 10-February 03 From: Leeds, UK Member No.: 4,046 |
You know - I dislike the whole ED/SR crossover stuff generally, but the more I read it all (especially AH's stuff) the more I get into it. It's actually all quite clever the way it's tied up with Dunk's will...
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