Funny idea or just ridiculously stupid? Options

[Tymire]

Thought about this a week or 2 ago and curious what others reactions would be.

Was thinking what would happen if let a pilot/agent program have access to your biomoniter, eyes, and move-by-wire system. You could have it set where if you are knocked unconscious or at a certain pain threshold the agent would take over and try to make an escape or do any number of things.

It sees a mage casting, mage stunballs you, you pilot decides to put a few holes in the mage.... Don't want to pay attention to driving to work, and want to read the paper? Sure just have it take over....

Possiblities and problems that could arise are endless. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

[Nightfalke]

Even better thought:

What if you didn't know that agent was there?

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif)

[Mongoose]

Move by wire plus cybereyes != stirup interface. Think of the stirup interface as MBW plus a nice applications (hardware) interface package. Without the API, you've just got a big mess of raw data and no control interface.
If you did go for the stirup implant, then maybe it would work, as you'd have all the interfaces needed to be run like a drone. Assuming an agent can control a drone, that is.
Then again, is the agent gonna do any better with a body that has taken lots of stun / physical damage than the person whose body it is? Its not like a stirup interface lets an animal keep going once unconscious just because a rigger has jumped in. A better use for this might be controlling your own body as a drone, while also controlling other drones, so you can be jumped into some other drone while issuing orders to your body to keep moving or some such.

[Karoline]

I would think the operation of a full human body would be too complex a task for even a rating 6 pilot/agent. Now an AI or cyborg could likely manage it, but anything less sophisticated would have trouble.

There are ways you could do some of those things though. A pilot program for a car is ubiquitous, so that isn't a problem. You could get a drone with a chair and some arms to move you into the chair to take you away if you ever go down, and you could get a smartgun platform for geeking the mage.

Edit: Also, would you really want a program to completely run your body? I think there would be major issues with something like that.

[Nightfalke]

I would think the operation of a full human body would be too complex a task for even a rating 6 pilot/agent.

They have humanoid drones. How would a move-by-wired human be that much different? You aren't asking the pilot to control any biological functions at all, just a set of motors (muscles) with set inputs for locomotion (the wired nerves). He's not going to be doing any gymnastics, but it could probably aim and shoot a gun.

[Karoline]

Well, I guess if you had a move-by-wire person it might be possible if you got the right pilot, but I'd imagine that the right type of pilot doesn't currently exist, largely because of public fear, so it'd have to be a custom programed thing, which would take months or years to obtain.

[Mongoose]

It's different because there is a piece of cyberware specifically designed to turn a biological body into a drone, and that is NOT Move By Wire; its the Stirup interface. The right type of pilot almost certainly DOES exist (or could easily be programmed) for a metahuman body implanted with a stirup interface.

If you did install that, I can see a fair number of advantages of running your own body as a drone, although there would be the disadvantage of taking both normal damage and simsense feedback damage.

[Nightfalke]

I completely agree that this should not be easy nor common, but just imagining it as a possibility as a GM makes me just giggle uncontrollably.

[MikeKozar]

...letting the agent walk around might be too complex, but maybe he could have access to your cyberarm and smartlink. Again, potentially scary, but you wouldn't necessarily need any additional cyberware to do it.

[McCummhail]

As a stirrup interface is "based on an advanced
move-by-wire system (p. 40) and provides all of the same bonuses
and benefits, including the embedded skillwire system.
Additionally, it adds a remote control rig adaptation that
allows a rigger to both monitor the exact movements of the
animal as well as to “jump in” and control it directly through
full-immersion VR." (p.153, Augmentation)

The difference between this and what you are suggesting
is the lack of an intergrated control rig adaptation.

Also worth noting that "Pilot programs are designed to encompass
the range of motionsand actions a particular vehicle is capable of,
as well as any sensor operations and situations that vehicle is likely
to encounter. This means, however, that a particular Pilot program
only functions for a particular type of vehicle." (p.103, Arsenal)

I think a pilot program designed for an Otomo would have a hard time
translating its operations to flesh.

However, with a stirrup installed and a custom "skinjob" pilot you would be go!

[Tymire]

Not too sure why a human would be that much harder to control for a pilot than say a steel lynx or doverman or any of the walker type drones. Ofcourse this could ONLY work with move-by-wire and not wired reflexes or skillwires.

Now I'm not saying this is a good idea, considering I fall in the giggling fits any time I think about it.

From what you guys have said adding on a stirrup could work, though it has extra functions that you seriously would not want. The chances of being hacked I think would go up dramaticly once you add in a remote controll rig. However, in the right circulstances this may not be a bad thing either. Also thinking this would be a freaking awsome thing that all BBEGs would love to do to thier mooks.

[Karoline]

Not too sure why a human would be that much harder to control for a pilot than say a steel lynx or doverman or any of the walker type drones. Ofcourse this could ONLY work with move-by-wire and not wired reflexes or skillwires.

Now I'm not saying this is a good idea, considering I fall in the giggling fits any time I think about it.

From what you guys have said adding on a stirrup could work, though it has extra functions that you seriously would not want. The chances of being hacked I think would go up dramaticly once you add in a remote controll rig. However, in the right circulstances this may not be a bad thing either. Also thinking this would be a freaking awsome thing that all BBEGs would love to do to thier mooks.

Just turn off the wireless and your fine.

[Sixgun_Sage]

Just turn off the wireless and your fine.

Have cyberdoc remove the wireless, a cyberdoc you can trust, you mean.

[AllTheNothing]

As a stirrup interface is "based on an advanced
move-by-wire system (p. 40) and provides all of the same bonuses
and benefits, including the embedded skillwire system.
Additionally, it adds a remote control rig adaptation that
allows a rigger to both monitor the exact movements of the
animal as well as to "jump in" and control it directly through
full-immersion VR." (p.153, Augmentation)

The difference between this and what you are suggesting
is the lack of an intergrated control rig adaptation.

Also worth noting that "Pilot programs are designed to encompass
the range of motionsand actions a particular vehicle is capable of,
as well as any sensor operations and situations that vehicle is likely
to encounter. This means, however, that a particular Pilot program
only functions for a particular type of vehicle." (p.103, Arsenal)

I think a pilot program designed for an Otomo would have a hard time
translating its operations to flesh.

However, with a stirrup installed and a custom "skinjob" pilot you would be go!

Now I have a scary thought, cloned bodies with a stirrup interface jumped in by who knows who, one moment could be a Mr. Johnson, a moment later the control is given to a combat veteran (talking about failed negotiations); or the Aztechnology enforcing mandatory implantation of the thing in certain facilities, anyone could be taken over anytime, what better way of reminding to the employs that the Corp owns them and is watching them? Or some rich bastard having a "wardrobe" of bodies to wear. Or .......
Yes the potential for disturbing applications and post-human excesses is indeed high.

[AllTheNothing]

Not too sure why a human would be that much harder to control for a pilot than say a steel lynx or doverman or any of the walker type drones. Ofcourse this could ONLY work with move-by-wire and not wired reflexes or skillwires.

Now I'm not saying this is a good idea, considering I fall in the giggling fits any time I think about it.

From what you guys have said adding on a stirrup could work, though it has extra functions that you seriously would not want. The chances of being hacked I think would go up dramaticly once you add in a remote controll rig. However, in the right circulstances this may not be a bad thing either. Also thinking this would be a freaking awsome thing that all BBEGs would love to do to thier mooks.

Tymire you scare me!!

[Mongoose]

Yes the potential for disturbing applications and post-human excesses is indeed high.

The potential for beneficial applications with consenting / non-sentient (clonal) "hosts" is also high. Why bother messing up the environment with jet fumes when you can just jack into a body halfway around the globe? (Granted, matrix meetings solve a lot of the same issues, but sometimes you need an expert physically on the spot). Why do all kinds of risky surgery on somebody who is physically disabled when they can jack into a whole suite of "rent a bodies"? I bet those folks who are soaking in gene threrapy tanks for a few months could use a rental body. Sure, a drone gets you out in the world and simsense gives you "bodily pleasures", but again- say your loved ones miss you?
And who's to say having somebody jack into your body is unpleasent? If you remain conscious, it could be a great way to gain new expereriences; hiring somebody who has skills you lack jump in and do a job you can't do may be cheaper than buying a skill soft and could let you actually learn something.

Post human != evil. Its all about what you do with it.

[Neraph]

An Agent could not do it. It would have to be a Pilot program. I have thought of this, especially in the context of playing an AI that bought a cloned <metatype> with a Stirrup Interface.

[Method]

This all assumes that the body is still fully functional after taking high levels of stun damage. As far as I recall the rules for biodrones do not make them immune to stun damage.

[MikeKozar]

This all assumes that the body is still fully functional after taking high levels of stun damage. As far as I recall the rules for biodrones do not make them immune to stun damage.

Pain Editor would seem to be a good investment if you intended to get that shot up. That does make you immune to stun damage (from a certain perspective, YMMV, ask your sketchy street surgeon if Pain Editor is right for you.)

[Neraph]

No, because of the last sentence of the Stirrup Interface:

The recipient can be controlled by a specialized Pilot program, but then functions exactly like a regular drone.

Hence, a biological organism being controlled through a Stirrup Interface by a Pilot program is immune to Stun damage, as "regular drones" are immune to stun.

[Method]

Hmmm. Sounds like a soft call to me.

[AllTheNothing]

Post human != evil. Its all about what you do with it.

I didn't say that posthumanitism is evil or that there can't be plausible applications, just that there is a serious potential for realy disturbing applications and for an high dehumanizating factor.

[McCummhail]

Post human and dehumanization do run along similar tracks.
I do believe there was a recent movie that looked at this very topic...

[Ascalaphus]

What about running your own body as a drone? Granted, it's not totally useful, but it has interesting theoretical applications for somewhat geeky transhumanist riggers.

By the by, this solves the problem of VR while on a motorcycle; you just let an Agent protect your meatbody and drive around.

[LurkerOutThere]

Oh god not the motorcycle topic.

For me at least I keep a decent pilot program and clearsite on one of my comlinks wired into my cybersenses (eyes, ears, and radar). I use it to have a seperate entity looking at scanner data to pick up suprise and social issues and feed them back to me through AR to make sure I don't miss anything. Not quite the same thing but a useful and rules legal (or at least logically sound) use of tech although not quite the same the OP was looking at.