Things that no longer exist in 2070, What would you NOT find in the standard home? Options

[BRodda]

Working on the SPUs and a few other things has me realizing that there are things that are just GONE from the house holds of 2070. Wondering if people can help me thing of others.

1)Full size fridge: No need for one with the SPU. People don't buy enough fresh foods at any given time to need a full size fridge or freezer. Maybe a micro-fridge like in a dorm, but that's it. Enough fresh food that you need to store it to make sure it keeps is the mark of the rich.

2)Ovens. Again the SPU has killed the standard stovetop and oven. Rich people might have one and the poor might use one because they have too, but the middle class? I can see more hot plates in that case anyway.

3) Desks. I can't really see a need for a desk other than to keep your soycaf on and maybe some pictures of the kids/pets. Almost everything would be done in AR.

4) Videogame systems: The standard comlink must have killed all the video game systems. Those that aren't on comlinks are probably just downloaded to your Trid.

5) Kitchens in general: Think about it. SPU is the only cooking instrument. Very little need for storeage space because there are no pots and pans. No place really needed to store other foods because the SPU makes it all. I'm guessing that almost everyone uses disposable (but recyclable or biodegradable) dishes and silverware. The space that was the kitchen is now used for something else. Maybe dropped all together to save space.

6)Pens and pencils: With the "go paperless" trends and AR and SINs I can't think of a reason people would use them for non-artistic reasons.

7)Paper: Again see the going paperless. No mail, no magazines or newspapers. All the forms are electronic. They already say that books are considered archaic collector items in the fluff.

8 ) Supermarkets: If I can fit all the goods people want in 4 aisles with a little variety of fresh produce/sandwiches/Meals ready to eat why waste all the space? I can see distribution centers that rush goods to the store so there are no backrooms and while there is probably a good variety, everything is compact.

9) Checkouts: No need for a checkout line. Shopping consists of putting stuff into your bags and walking out with all the RFID tags counting your purchases and sending the receipt to your comlink. Maybe a slight holding area to make sure you can pay for everything, but no registers with belts and scanners.

Again I'm left with this barren, almost claustrophobic and clean image in my head of the middle class in SR. I think I'll keep it because it fits well with the alienation of modernized society I like to have in my games.

[BookWyrm]

Well, the way you describe things is that, although they are exceedingly rare, they are not necessarilly gone/obsolete.

While such 'luxury' items such as large refridgerators and baking ovens would be rare, they are not necessarilly gone. A 'half-fridge' or smaller would keep the perishabvle essentials from spoiling, as you said, larger "top-bottom' or 'side-by-side' models would become more of a big-ticket item for those who can afford them (upper-middle class & above). The same with ovens.

Countertop stoves would still be in some use, but not as prevailent. With portable hot-plates and heaters (like we have today) it's a matter of available space in most apartments and squats that limit the need for stoves. I would imagine that most apartments& dwellings in 2070, of middle & lower-middle class, would adopt the Japanese concept of maximizing as much space as possible out of a living area. A large living-room area like we have today would become a common-use room, where bedroom, living room, dining/kitichen areas become a matter of shifting a few pieces of furniture. Of course, a lavatory/bathroom would still be it's own separate room (unless the character lives out of a capsule hotel-style apartment).
Solid-form desks, like those in an office, would become impractical, and with AR & VR, a simple lap-tray would function more like a comfort-item, giving the person a hands-on 'feel' of a solid desk beneath their hands.

Pens and pencils would still be in use. Likewise paper, although most would be made from recycled or synthetic wood pulp. Real-wood items become rare but not prohibitively expensive.
Synth-paper flyers, posters/adverts, even club-passes would still be around. The world of 2070 hasn't gone completely AR yet.

Supermarkets would still be un use. Supermarkets are still one of the best ways for a food-distrubution company to get it's products to the 'average consumer', and therefor be still in use, if uncommonly so. Most markets of fresh produce would most likely be like open-air markets or faires, sometimes using a partially-standing but gutten buliding for shelter from inclement weather.
Stuffer-Shack doesn't rule the planet.....yet.

Checkouts would be faster, not eliminated. Compare the time it takes one person with a debit card vs. cash vs. a 'scan and dash' system. While each has it's advantages, most neighborhoods will still deal in hard currency, even if the majority of the people in the area use at-home-shopping systems.

Remember, as technology improves most systems, the previous system finds it's way down to the next level and so on.
EX: In my area, most MTA buses were converted to the refillable metro-pass card system, but I can still access several smaller buses that still take hard currency. While the metro-card system has it's advantages, the hard-currency-takers are slightly more ecconomical and get me to the same destination.

The niches of such items simply moves either up to a more luxury item-cost or moves down to access a larger demographic.

[BRodda]

Well, the way you describe things is that, although they are exceedingly rare, they are not necessarilly gone/obsolete.

I was refering to the middle class (lifestyle). I'm sure there are still fountain pens and refrigerators, but they are mroe status symbols now.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Synth-paper flyers, posters/adverts, even club-passes would still be around. The world of 2070 hasn't gone completely AR yet.

Actually, for those who didn't, there's ePaper.

With any package of paper you buy, there comes a free disposable printer. It's really rare.

[Wesley Street]

I doubt kitchens would go by the wayside in a middle-class home... if there's even such a thing in 2070+. Kitchens have been the center of home life for thousands of years. There's no reason they would disappear, even if they aren't commonly used as intended.

People will always want to shop, even with easy home delivery. It's a human societal thing. Supermarkets may disappear but they could easily revert back into specialty food stores like bakeries, butchers, cheese shops, etc.

[BRodda]

I doubt kitchens would go by the wayside in a middle-class home... if there's even such a thing in 2070+. Kitchens have been the center of home life for thousands of years. There's no reason they would disappear, even if they aren't commonly used as intended.

People will always want to shop, even with easy home delivery. It's a human societal thing. Supermarkets may disappear but they could easily revert back into specialty food stores like bakeries, butchers, cheese shops, etc.

I can see the fragmenting of the supermarket. Not saying that markets would not exist, but the giant buildings with 5K+ items would disappear.

As for the kitchen, I'm not sold on that for SR. The family unit doesn't appear to be too intact from the fluff. (In our 2070 they will probably exist). In SR I can see the family room or dinning room taking over the role of the kitchen.

[Khyron]

Things missing from the modern 2070's home.

Privacy. Stupid spyfuture.

Also there's an in-joke that current cheap materials no longer exist and everything is made of soy. Soy-cotton shirts, Soy-TP, Soy-sporks, ect. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[hobgoblin]

i suspect that fridge will be a small combo unit, with most of the space dedicated to freezer rather then above zero refrigeration.

most likely, the hot plate will not so much be hot as it being a induction place, one that can both be used to cook, or to charge devices. Heck, it may even interact comfortably with a water cooker (for all those packs of instant noodles) in such a way that when the water is hot, it will cut the power to the induction coil.

basically, the food supplies will be more tv dinner style, just micro or add hot water.

oh, and also:
http://vimeo.com/8569187

[lonewolf23k]

I honestly don't see home cooking disappearing anytime soon. People forsaw the end of home cooking way back with the invention of the TV dinner and the rise of Fast Food franchises, but here we are today, and people are still cooking home-made meals, and some rare folks even make their meals from scratch. So I'm not worried on that front.

[BRodda]

I honestly don't see home cooking disappearing anytime soon. People forsaw the end of home cooking way back with the invention of the TV dinner and the rise of Fast Food franchises, but here we are today, and people are still cooking home-made meals, and some rare folks even make their meals from scratch. So I'm not worried on that front.

Again I am not talking about our future,but in the SR timeline/fluff. Its a very specific set of social, economic and technological guidelines.

[Whipstitch]

I also think it's deceptively easy to understate the seismic shift that's happened in food preparation. Do people still cook? Sure. But we've entered a world in which upper middle class people who cook two or three times a week can call themselves "foodies" and can rightfully lay claim that they have more culinary knowledge than many of their peers. Historically speaking, the fact that cooking has gone from a daily chore to a friggin' hobby for many ordinary people is outright amazing, since eating isn't exactly optional. Perhaps people were exaggerating when they predicted the outright death of the kitchen, but it's not really far fetched at all to say that home cooking is merely a favored novelty for many, many people in the Western world. Plus, one of the reason cooking still persists is that many home prepared staples still are cheaper and healthier than prepared alternatives. In the 2070s, that's apparently no longer always the case.

[Rystefn]

Remember, it's a dystopian future. The things that we predict will still be around for social reasons will fall by the wayside for those exact reasons. You aren't supposed to have friends. The Corp will provide you with all your social needs.

[Karoline]

I honestly don't see home cooking disappearing anytime soon. People forsaw the end of home cooking way back with the invention of the TV dinner and the rise of Fast Food franchises, but here we are today, and people are still cooking home-made meals, and some rare folks even make their meals from scratch. So I'm not worried on that front.

Well, maybe you don't know, but home cooking has in fact declined amazingly. Back in the 50s and 60s or so, you expected every single meal to be home cooked from scratch (or virtually so) with every meal being a sit down affair for the entire family. TV dinners did a decent job of shifting some families into the living room to eat in front of the TV, or create the occasional "Oh, I just don't want to cook, lets heat up the delicious dinner mega pack." Around those times eating out was along the lines of a once or twice monthly affair as a special treat, though generally to a nice place, not fast food.

In modern culture however, most people only cook a few times a week, with most of their food being on the go fast food, restaurants, or something similar. Fewer and fewer meals are 'whole family sit down meals'. I really don't find it hard to believe that if fresh food is expensive, that 100% of the meals will be taken care of either by the SPU or eating out or 'quick heat' meals. And since the average middle class person isn't going to be cooking anything, I don't see why they wouldn't want to get an extra 200+ square feet of living room or private space or bedroom space or just a chunk off their rent by ditching the kitchen.

Now, admittedly there are likely to still be plenty of houses/apartments that were built before the SPU became so huge would still have kitchens, likely even with full stoves, but I'd guess that any apartments/houses that have been built in the last 20 years or so would have cut them out unless they were intended for upper class people who could afford real food.

[Backgammon]

You would not find affection and tolerance between spouses.

You probably wouldn't find any kids either, because they already said "fuck you, mom" and went to hang out in the streets, mall or cyber café.

[Daylen]

clothes? with the new virtual stuff who needs real clothes?

[Karoline]

clothes? with the new virtual stuff who needs real clothes?

I'd think everyone that wants to go outside. You could do AR clothing, but all someone has to do to get a peek at you is set your Arrows to not show up or take off their glasses.

[Rystefn]

Also, there's the whole cold and rain and pollution, and being splashed with mud by passing traffic and other cleanliness issues.

[BRodda]

Also, there's the whole cold and rain and pollution, and being splashed with mud by passing traffic and other cleanliness issues.

<iPhone Voice>

"There's a filter for that"

</iPhone Voice>

[ravensoracle]

What about the guy that walks around with his AR being fed by a Comm that has it's signal turned off and is only using a disposable comm to broadcast his Fake Sin. No AR Spam for him. I actually run like this with one paranoid guy.

[Daylen]

thats how I'd think everyone would go around...

[Warlordtheft]

Rotary phones. There are also no phones, cell phones, or alarm clocks.

BTW-When I was a teenager (late 80's), some kid 5 or 6 came in to use our phone. He was lost or something. He looked at the rotary phone we had in the kitchen and said---what is that?

Also missing is the TV/VCR or DVD, you've got a trid.

Sadly, no Atari.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[Orcus Blackweath...]

Television - Replaced by Tri-D and AR
Playground - Only the wealthy can afford to "waste" space for children to play, and the wealthy do not want their children exposed to toxic rain and UV radiation.
Radio - Almost dead in our time, by 2070 radio will be fed directly to each user Ala Pandora, and it will come through the comm link like all the other entertainment.
Free Public Education - All education will be corporate sponsored, and the poor and underprivileged will at best be fed corporate pap for just a brief time, at worst the street is the education.
Literacy - Replaced almost universally by Icons and symbology. If the masses are uneducated they do not pose a creditable threat to the corporate masters.
Freedom - Fear for our children will see them implanted with tracking devices at birth. Our every move will be monitored by government, corporations, and anyone else with the technology and know how.

[Karoline]

Freedom - Fear for our children will see them implanted with tracking devices at birth. Our every move will be monitored by government, corporations, and anyone else with the technology and know how.

Being a runner would be really hard if you had a tracking devise planted in you.

[hahnsoo]

Supermarkets won't die. They will thrive, but they will be different. They are the new battlefields of the 21st century, especially in the Awakened world. Corporations will use supermarkets as a staging ground to out-compete and out-brand their fellow corps. It is yet another "channel" by which corporations can insinuate themselves into your lives. It is their lifeline to the poor and downtrodden, a social layer that allows the privileged to separate themselves from the proletariat masses. The average middle or upper class citizen doesn't need to go to a Walmart, but you can be damn sure that consumer goods are primarily pumped through superstores within walking distance of urban blight. Indeed, I can't really see an urban sprawl without such superstores.

Everything about RFID tags in SR4 fiction points to the checkout NOT disappearing, but instead becoming much more automated than before because of ubiquitous tagging.

Video game consoles will be "obsolete", I guess, but the entertainment enthusiast will have a new form of media to roll around in, and that's a Simdeck. While the average shadowrunner won't even bother to sample the simsense on his/her commlink or home trid, the Simdeck is the consumer electronics equivalent of a home theater and video game console all rolled into one, and the quality will matter to the average tech geek and gamer. Just like you could watch your favorite sports team play on your cellphone, but why would you want to when you have a bigscreen TV at home. Also, I could imagine that there are gaming-specific simdecks/sim modules out there. Or commlinks, for that matter.

Don't discount the value of actual tactile feedback. I'd imagine that desks would still exist, but as a location where you could put a few mementos and have a nice flat surface to work on while using both virtual/AR tools and real world ones. For example, maybe you want to work on your latest sim module to unlock some features. You just put it on your AR-enhanced table, put on your image linked glasses, then watch as virtual tutorials and pointers appear around the object, highlighting the good stuff.

[LivingOxymoron]

I honestly don't see home cooking disappearing anytime soon. People forsaw the end of home cooking way back with the invention of the TV dinner and the rise of Fast Food franchises, but here we are today, and people are still cooking home-made meals, and some rare folks even make their meals from scratch. So I'm not worried on that front.

Here's the thing, though. If you look at high population density, urbanized societies you find 2 things: 1st, no one cooks at home because a kitchen is a colossal waste of space from a relative standpoint, and 2nd, "fast food" is both the norm and of a much higher quality than what westerners are accustomed to. If you look at modern sprawls of today with a reasonable standard of living like Hong Kong, Tokyo, Singapore or Kolkotta, the middle class and working poor mostly eat out. The typical eatery is also very small and specialized; usually a lunch counter or a few tables serving a handful of dishes prepared from the same basic ingredients. When I lived in Japan, there were little allyway shops that ONLY served skewers (like yakitori), or ramen, or okonomiaki, etc. The other version were street carts, again serving a single type of food (and overseas, this was usually where all the best food was to be had anyway.

Now, it seems like the world of SR is gradually coming back to real food, at least in certain areas. Seattle has Snohomish, and the SSC right over the border; the CalFree Central Valley is still used to grow real food as well (with Horizon making a big push into that market already dominated by Aztechnology). More than likely, people who live in the rural areas mostly survive on real food, at least of the local variety... even a low class person probably gets to eat real beef every week or two in certain parts of Texas, for example.

My guess, though, is that a since real kitchen in a Low, or even Middle class home has fallen by the wayside and cooking is no longer a casual hobby skill among the masses, there are probably restaurants that specialize in simple, (relatively) inexpensive real food dishes. Figure it can be a monthly treat for Low lifestyle and a once weekly occurrence for Middle.