AI Body, For an AI e-ghost PC Options

[The Jake]

Hi all

One of my players is playing an AI e-ghost and he's at the point where he really would like a body to go on a run. At present he is using a heavily modified Renraku Manservant (heavily armored, riggered for water operations, modular legs to use skimmer discs and a chameleon coating). Its actually served him quite well.

However as an e-ghost, he cannot "jack into" the body - thats reserved for AIs with the Piloting origin. As he is an e-ghost, his original body is on life support (the PCs think keeping it alive or in coma has some sort of bearance on him in reality).

We're at a stage in the campaign where the player would like a more permanent housing for his body that enables him to get around with the PCs a little more readily. Some might argue that is the price of that character option, but given where tech is advancing ingame, I don't think it has to be. Also there's been something of an issue with this player slowly losing interest and I suspect that this might be to do with a lack of interest in his character (this is a perceived issue I think). So I think creating some sort of personal quest for a body, providing some roleplaying for exploring what actually constitutes a soul along the way, might provide a bit of a refresh for the player.

Ideally, I'd like something that would at least enable him to pass for a human. I have a few ideas but wanted to bounce them off the forums for some feedback on viability by RAW, weighing in against RAI.

Some ideas I'm floating:
A customised Otomo unit, coated with human skin, kept "alive" by nanotechnology. (Think T-800).
Pros: Will pass visual inspection and touch test.
Cons: No Aura. Costly. Prototype territory. Blatant copy/paste of prior IP (Terminators). Will get hosed by airport security.

His original body, with a customised stirrup interface
Pros: Much more plausible by RAW. Doesn't give him a god-body.
Cons: Stirrup interface in humans don't exist (yet). Prototype territory again. Costly (although not as costly as the first). Having to deal with the pesky problem of a body currently kept alive by a life support system. Not sure how to deal with the whole Aura issue at all (i.e. does he have one?).

Any body, with a customised stirrup interface
Pros: Much more plausible by RAW. Doesn't give him a god-body. None of the pesky aura or lifesupport issues. Best idea so far...
Cons: Stirrup interface in humans don't exist (yet). Prototype territory again. Costly (although not as costly as the first).

Other ideas I'm still floating around (and these defy RAW somewhat but fit the flavor/team composition of my PCs very well) is potentially allowing AIs to consume other AIs (not entirely unlike Deus-Megaera or the MCP of Tron) which may allow the PC to acquire the Pilot Origins ability. This would work swimmingly with the stirrup interface.

[ Spoiler ]

As my campaign started pre Crash 2.0, I had this idea I was floating around:
One of my PCs had mysterious cyberware which was effectively something that could be described as a human stirrup interface (it wasn't intended as that but functionally offered the same effect) but it was used by Deus' Network. I'm toying with the idea of Deus existing, albeit as a weakened AI and he is now, running around gobbling up other AIs in an attempt to regrow back into his former larger self. The PC had the cyberware removed but he also had the Amnesia flaw that he never bought off. I'm wondering what if he was a clone and Deus made one or more of them with the intention of using them as hosts for his Network. Alternatively what if the body of another simialr clone with the same 'ware was captured by one of the megas and they, realising how bleeding-edge the tech is, used it to spur on stirrup technology?

My players are currently in Hong Kong, running through the adventures of Ghost Cartels FWIW so they won't get a lot of time off as it were for side ventures. So anything I introduce will have to be in drips and drabs anyway (that I want them to earn this thing). Anyway this thread is very much a brain dump but I hope to use my fellow DSers as a sounding board.

Any offers/advice/random musings people have been thinking of along this vein would be great.

- J.

[redwulf25_ci]

Hi all

One of my players is playing an AI e-ghost and he's at the point where he really would like a body to go on a run. At present he is using a heavily modified Renraku Manservant (heavily armored, riggered for water operations, modular legs to use skimmer discs and a chameleon coating). Its actually served him quite well.

However as an e-ghost, he cannot "jack into" the body - thats reserved for AIs with the Piloting origin. As he is an e-ghost, his original body is on life support (the PCs think keeping it alive or in coma has some sort of bearance on him in reality).

We're at a stage in the campaign where the player would like a more permanent housing for his body that enables him to get around with the PCs a little more readily. Some might argue that is the price of that character option, but given where tech is advancing ingame, I don't think it has to be. Also there's been something of an issue with this player slowly losing interest and I suspect that this might be to do with a lack of interest in his character (this is a perceived issue I think). So I think creating some sort of personal quest for a body, providing some roleplaying for exploring what actually constitutes a soul along the way, might provide a bit of a refresh for the player.

Ideally, I'd like something that would at least enable him to pass for a human. I have a few ideas but wanted to bounce them off the forums for some feedback on viability by RAW, weighing in against RAI.

Some ideas I'm floating:
A customised Otomo unit, coated with human skin, kept "alive" by nanotechnology. (Think T-800).
Pros: Will pass visual inspection and touch test.
Cons: No Aura. Costly. Prototype territory. Blatant copy/paste of prior IP (Terminators). Will get hosed by airport security.

His original body, with a customised stirrup interface
Pros: Much more plausible by RAW. Doesn't give him a god-body.
Cons: Stirrup interface in humans don't exist (yet). Prototype territory again. Costly (although not as costly as the first). Having to deal with the pesky problem of a body currently kept alive by a life support system. Not sure how to deal with the whole Aura issue at all (i.e. does he have one?).

Any body, with a customised stirrup interface
Pros: Much more plausible by RAW. Doesn't give him a god-body. None of the pesky aura or lifesupport issues. Best idea so far...
Cons: Stirrup interface in humans don't exist (yet). Prototype territory again. Costly (although not as costly as the first).

That's not a con. That's next weeks run.

"Hey, lets steal this new tech and sell it to the highest bidder. To prove it works we'll put our buddy back in his body!"

[Mordinvan]

Some ideas I'm floating:
A customised Otomo unit, coated with human skin, kept "alive" by nanotechnology. (Think T-800).
Pros: Will pass visual inspection and touch test.
Cons: No Aura. Costly. Prototype territory. Blatant copy/paste of prior IP (Terminators). Will get hosed by airport security.

The Otomo is already coated in living flesh if I remember correctly, so the only thing would be deciding what you want it to look like.

[The Jake]

The Otomo is already coated in living flesh if I remember correctly, so the only thing would be deciding what you want it to look like.

I had to double check what Mimic meant to confirm that and you're spot on.

Amazing an Otomo can have real skin but we're still stuck with synthetic cyberarms. That makes no-sense to me.

- J.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

That makes no-sense to me.

You mean like having three different rules for gecko tape? Or three for dart guns?

[Professor Evil O...]

Another thing to keep in mind. How powerful you make the AI's "body" should be dependent on how unique you want the stirrup tech to be in the first place. If this is the only body the AI is going to be able to use, feel free to make it a good one. It's hard enough not being able to improve it with karma, which is enough of a drawback to make this sort of build reasonable. Especially if the PCs have to steal the body in the first place. Think of the fun you can have making the PCs steal parts for the body over the course of several runs (or negotiate for the parts instead of their normal payment).

If the AI will be able to "switch" to a better body later on, his/her/its first body doesn't have to be SOTA, it just needs to work. It can even be fun to give the poor eghost an unpleasant first body to deal with and get used too - child, wrong meta type, infirm, etc.

If the PCs go the theft route for their tech (and why would they want to pay for something they can steal) their of loads of options for drawbacks. GPS trackers and corp remote overrides come to mind. Just the fact that <fill in name of corp> wants their body back can be fun.

Oh, and don't forget that other AIs may also be interested in that specially prepared body. Especially the one that spent so much time and money to get it ready for them...

[Udoshi]

If the player rigs a drone so much, let him pick up Piloting Origin with karma. That what the 'acquire a quality rules in play' are -for-, damn it. Most gm's just toss that option right out the window, because going over the 35bp limit from character generation somehow magically makes things broken, even when they fit.


As for a body? Let him steal a vat-grown assassin wimp with Move-By-Wire. Say its close enough to the drone control system its based off of, that he can treat it like a drone. You've got a body with an aura, a mind in it thats too dumb to give a shit, and a motive to find a good doctor to improve it. Sold.

[Neraph]

I don't think he should get a body. He certainly should have a home node, and it certainly can be a node housed inside a mobile structure, and it can certainly be humanoid/a meta with Stirrup/whatever, but as he can't jump into the drone, the body isn't really his (kinda). It seems like a round-a-bout way to play a Pilot-Origins AI, and he's trying to get both benefits at the same time.

Personally, I'd be happy home node'd somewhere safe and connected through a member's PAN (or, more preferrably, the team's PAN web). And actually, I am happy with a Pilot-Origins AI character I played.

Basically what I'm trying to say (I'm kinda tired and mentally drained today) is that he doesn't get to fully control a body because he can't jump into the body. He can be in the node and order the drone to do things, but that is vastly different from actually being the body.

[The Jake]

Hi all

Thanks for the feedback so far.

Yes I had considered allowing the player to acquire 'Piloting Origin' positive quality with karma. The in game explanation I was toying with was allowing him to gain the quality by consuming the code of another AI with this quality already.

Udoshi -
Option #3 was the closest I was thinking to using a wimp + MBW/Stirrup interface. This is tempting. I am leaning towards this the more I think about it.

Professor Evil Overlord -
That's the way we've been playing it. He started off with a Manservant and has made a lot of modifications over time. It has hit its upgrade capacity and now he is looking for alternatives. Overall, the Manservant has been pretty damn good I have to say (I'd be happy using one as a player). The problem is for those situations where he needs to pass for a human (or needs to run!). The Otomo or a wimp would work to that end however.

Neraph -
I understand your point and that is the way we are playing it currently. At present the AI has jumped into a purpose built commlink that has been modded up the yin-yang as his home node (previously he had a nexus but it wasn't as portable as a commlink unfortunately and after the events in the first chapter of Ghost Cartels, he needed something more portable post haste). So the Manservant was taken with the PCs but unfortunately had to leave the Nexus behind.

However, I'm not interested in reasons why this should continue to be. I've already explained the reasons why I am looking at this - there are multiple reasons. Both ingame and out of game. I'm looking for ways that I can do this while still remaining as close to RAW as possible. Allowing the player to acquire the Piloting Origin positive quality is the quickest and easiest but I'm also looking at options for a dedicated body.

- J.

[Udoshi]

The in game explanation I was toying with was allowing him to gain the quality by consuming the code of another AI with this quality already.

Well. He's an e-ghost, right? Was metahuman at one point? Slipping back into a body should be easy, even second nature - if he can remember how. What more excuse do you need?

[Neraph]

I've actually been toying with the idea of having an AI character with Piloting Origins home node'd in a medical facility using clones of a guy (with high body and strength) that have Stirrup Interface I installed to interact with the world at large. This would especially be useful as a Prime Runner that gums up the works of the PCs, as they wouldn't figure out what he really was until later.

Imagine shooting a guy (and being pretty sure you finished him) and having the guy come right back a few days later. So this time you kill him and dismember him. He comes back. So you kill him, then blow up his body. He comes back. About this time the players will start looking to magic for the reason this guy keeps coming back.

As a perk, have the guy keep dialoguing the same way, and have him geared the exact same each time. And each time he comes back, have him say some remark like "After much though I do prefer the assault rifle to the pistols. At least the pain ends quicker that way."

EDIT:

More on topic though: An otomo can and will work, but if you take a Manservant and slap on a few mods and some Mimic, it does the same for muuuuuuch less.

[Udoshi]

More on topic though: An otomo can and will work, but if you take a Manservant and slap on a few mods and some Mimic, it does the same for muuuuuuch less.

I was looking at making possible starting-character cyborgs a while ago. While you can't get a custom vehicle in 4th, or an otomo at start, you -can- take an existing vehicle about the right body and butcher a ton of mods into it to get walker mode, a pair of arms, legs, etc.

If you start with a motorcycle, you have about the right body/speed. A thundercloud contrail is good. Overmod Walker mode into it(suggested downsides: can't turn it off, or metahuman walking speeds.) and maybe an overmodded Pimped Ride(looks like a metahuman) to reflect that its no longer a motorcycle. Depending on how much overmodification you can get away with for a package deal, you'll need between 5 and 9 slots.

All the cyborgs pretty much have: Walker mode(2). Two full mechanical limbs(2each). Cyborg adaptation(1), and Touch sensors(1). The akiyama is body 4, the otomo body 6, and the tomino body 10. An entertainment systems Cyclops + a sidecar also puts you into right about the Otomo range, which has a Mimic System(2) as well. Of that, its possible to overmodify Walker Mode, Cyborg Adaptation, and Touch sensors, depending on how much your GM is willing to work with you to scratch-convert a cyborg model.

Hope that helps.

[Neraph]

I've always liked using either the Dodge Guardian or Harley Davidson Scorpion. Incidentally, the weight of a motorcycle is roughly equivalent to a troll. That's something to keep in mind if you retrofit a motorcycle to look like a human ("Hey, why does that human have the same weight as a troll?"). Also, I figure you can take Mimic instead of Pimped in order to get a meta-looking drone.

One of my players was a Pilot AI in a Manservant body, and had the body Mimic'd to look like an old Japanese man (bent forward slightly, walks slowly, can't punch... sound familiar?).

[The Jake]

Now we're talking Transformers and less Ghost In The Shell.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

- J.

[Neraph]

Now we're talking Transformers and less Ghost In The Shell.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

- J.

Except Walker Mode replaces the normal form of movement. No more wheels, just legs, and you can't switch modes freely. My friend who GMs also (we don't play in each other's games because there are many, many points he and I don't see eye-to-eye with; IE: "It's easy to start with 25 dice to shoot a gun and 150 armor, as well as at least 21 dice for defaulting on all social skills" is his view, mine is less min-maxed and requisit of cyber-bio-magic all the time) doesn't seem to understand this.