Commlink modes Options

[Chutzpah]

About that skinlink scheme: i believe a single hit in a Matrix Perception Test could trace that link beetween the decoy and the hidden commlink (something an experienced hacker would definitely try).

Slaving is a good way to avoid peripherals to leave unwanted datatrail, but have in mind that most of the gear have very low signal rating (or can be custumized this way), which can prevent direct hacking attempts.

>The best way to avoid Hacking, and the average Joe knows it, is simply turning the damn 'link OFF when you get suspicious!

[Chutzpah]

Thanks, Dire Radiant. That was a great answer.

But i have other questions: doesn't an active node allow public subscriptions (not user subs.)? I've understood that it permits other devices to send messages or start a conversation, spams to pop up, etc. (i thought it looked like some sort of subscription...).

If it's not only your 'link but actually our PAN that stays in active mode (as stated in SR4 core) why would a hidden device, subscribed to the 'link, not be shown? I thoght a hidden peripheral just doesn't allow other nodes apart from the ones in its subscription list to have access. That seems to be different of not showing up in the PAN's subscription list...

You could also simply keep cycling through a set of spoofed accessIDs on a single commlink.

I thought spoofing an ID to your commlink is an action that takes a few minutes (you need to associate it with your commcode, SIN, peripherals etc). So i don't understand how a set of spoofed IDs could help at all, if creating an ID alone is not the part that takes most of the time in spoofing. Anyway, maybe an Agent could do the cycling job. Am I wrong?

[DireRadiant]

But i have other questions: doesn't an active node allow public subscriptions (not user subs.)? I've understood that it permits other devices to send messages or start a conversation, spams to pop up, etc. (i thought it looked like some sort of subscription...).

Just think of all that pass through traffic as running through a different part of your commlink dedicated to that purpose, where it cannot do anything other then pass through.

If it's not only your 'link but actually our PAN that stays in active mode (as stated in SR4 core) why would a hidden device, subscribed to the 'link, not be shown? I thoght a hidden peripheral just doesn't allow other nodes apart from the ones in its subscription list to have access. That seems to be different of not showing up in the PAN's subscription list...

Hidden Mode, the Device will not reply unless it gets the communication requests from the subscribed device. So your short range Hidden Device will only reply to communication requests from your Commlink because it is the subscribed device. It will not answer any other requests. If the signal range is short, or a skin link, nothing else will pick up the signal. Since it doesn't announce itself, other systems don't display it.

I thought spoofing an ID to your commlink is an action that takes a few minutes (you need to associate it with your commcode, SIN, peripherals etc). So i don't understand how a set of spoofed IDs could help at all, if creating an ID alone is not the part that takes most of the time in spoofing. Anyway, maybe an Agent could do the cycling job. Am I wrong?

Agents are awesome for tasks like this.

[CanadianWolverin...]

Er, seems I was misunderstood. So I will try to clarify why I think I need my 3 commlink setup on a character to be effectively in the shadows.

1st Cheap Commlink = Joe Public Fake SiN is who I want society to think I am ... if the identity goes sour, I toss it ... if I have more than one identity, I have more than one commlink, additional identities and commlinks stashed away for if needed to run when a identity is blown.

2nd Cheap Commlink = Team Communication aka I don't trust my team's hacker or pretty much anyone with info that can get my character back in the "justice" system. This is the phone #, email, chatroom, etc that I let other runners have ... again, I think it went sour, I toss it and replace it cheap.

3rd Decked To The Nines Commlink Skinlinked and Progs = its tucked into my underwear or the bottom of a shoe or whatever is still considered ideally hidden and skin linked (not in head necissarily, I like no essence loss for my adept), there is really no reason it should be talking to anyone at all but my own personal gear because I thought a commlink talks with my gear. I want to be sure as possible that what my guncam is telling me is the god's honest truth or that my mapsoft isn't giving me bad directions and so on. Its like my personal ledger of dirty tech tricks on my person.

Note: None of these commlinks talk to each other. But can commlinks share accessories like image linked glasses and AR gloves?

Right now, all I have on the character is one barely decked out commlink, totally hackable if touched, I think it has my fake SiN on it (not sure where the identity the character was born with that is a criminal SiN is stored). So, my fellow team mates know the fake SiN and my runner nickname. From reading threads like this here, I realized that when I chat with team mates, I can't be dialed down signal at strength 0 aka skinlink, but I picked up that micro-transceiver 6 so do my communications even pass through the commlink and it can stay dialed down? Regardless, I possibly steal, kill, and all other sorts of mayhem with these other characters, what reason do I have to trust them? So now they can blow my fake SiN if they have the desire? Totally getting the sense "team" should be something that can be disposed of if necessary, so 3 commlinks.

[kjones]

Er, seems I was misunderstood. So I will try to clarify why I think I need my 3 commlink setup on a character to be effectively in the shadows.

1st Cheap Commlink = Joe Public Fake SiN is who I want society to think I am ... if the identity goes sour, I toss it ... if I have more than one identity, I have more than one commlink, additional identities and commlinks stashed away for if needed to run when a identity is blown.

2nd Cheap Commlink = Team Communication aka I don't trust my team's hacker or pretty much anyone with info that can get my character back in the "justice" system. This is the phone #, email, chatroom, etc that I let other runners have ... again, I think it went sour, I toss it and replace it cheap.

3rd Decked To The Nines Commlink Skinlinked and Progs = its tucked into my underwear or the bottom of a shoe or whatever is still considered ideally hidden and skin linked (not in head necissarily, I like no essence loss for my adept), there is really no reason it should be talking to anyone at all but my own personal gear because I thought a commlink talks with my gear. I want to be sure as possible that what my guncam is telling me is the god's honest truth or that my mapsoft isn't giving me bad directions and so on. Its like my personal ledger of dirty tech tricks on my person.

Note: None of these commlinks talk to each other. But can commlinks share accessories like image linked glasses and AR gloves?

Right now, all I have on the character is one barely decked out commlink, totally hackable if touched, I think it has my fake SiN on it (not sure where the identity the character was born with that is a criminal SiN is stored). So, my fellow team mates know the fake SiN and my runner nickname. From reading threads like this here, I realized that when I chat with team mates, I can't be dialed down signal at strength 0 aka skinlink, but I picked up that micro-transceiver 6 so do my communications even pass through the commlink and it can stay dialed down? Regardless, I possibly steal, kill, and all other sorts of mayhem with these other characters, what reason do I have to trust them? So now they can blow my fake SiN if they have the desire? Totally getting the sense "team" should be something that can be disposed of if necessary, so 3 commlinks.

If you don't trust your team's hacker, there are worse things he can do to you than hack your commlink. A little healthy paranoia is a good thing, but any team will be regularly put into situations in which they can fuck each other over, and any team that takes advantage of that with any frequency won't last.

[CanadianWolverin...]

If you don't trust your team's hacker, there are worse things he can do to you than hack your commlink. A little healthy paranoia is a good thing, but any team will be regularly put into situations in which they can fuck each other over, and any team that takes advantage of that with any frequency won't last.

Would it help any if I said that my only experience with dealing with a player with a hacker included him blatantly lying that he was in fact a sniper when I was asking what roles were filled in the party so I could get some idea on what we were capable of accomplishing. Sure didn't help much when asked to provide sniper cover (instead of sharing info learned about the job), the character refused and then proceeded to try to hide the fact he was the only one who could work the hardware to breakin to a building and then later blowing our stealth by hacking a stereo to start playing classical music at full blast... Needless to say, I was thinking with that level of trust in a team mate, my character would be thinking of finding a new team to be their gunslinger with someone he could trust a little more not to watch him bleed out and loot his corpse. So, don't mind me if I take the being paranoid of fellow runners things a bit too far.

[Chutzpah]

1st Cheap Commlink = Joe Public Fake SiN is who I want society to think I am ... if the identity goes sour, I toss it ... if I have more than one identity, I have more than one commlink, additional identities and commlinks stashed away for if needed to run when a identity is blown.

Why tossing it when you can just turn it off and get its ID spoofed latter. Then you you associate the new ID with other fake SIN, licenses etc.
Understand that ID is not inherent to a SIN. An ID only identifies a device in the matrix, which is different from a SIN, a number (or code) that identifies you as citizen in a region.
Every time you buy a new Commlink (or other device) it comes with a unique ID. So you must inform the nodes you usually accessed (non-public accounts) with the former ID that you are now using a new one, so they can edit their subscription list.
IDs are not phone numbers. The thing that function as phone# (and e-mail adress, among other things) is the Commcode, that must be associated with new IDs (a part of the spoofing ID action): although searching for an ID can get you to the node who has it (but simply try searching the Trix for that old 'runner pal of yours with only the ID you got 1 month ago, without his Commcode...).

I will repeat once more (my opinion, ok): having 3 Commlinks is a simple way to complicate your life. It's like having 3 CPUs, but only one keyboard (ex. AR Gloves) and one monitor (AR glasses). You cannot display images at or give commands to the three at a time otherwise they would overload the interface devices creating a complete chaos. This is particularly dangerous when you use a DNI (i can't even imagine how bad it is!)

In my opinion, using 2 'links is only an advantage for a hacker so he can better conceal his illegal programs and activities. In a security area of a town he uses his decoy 'link to interact with regular nodes passing without attracting atention, only changing to the main 'link when a hacking action is needed...

[Chutzpah]

If you don't trust your team's hacker, there are worse things he can do to you than hack your commlink. A little healthy paranoia is a good thing, but any team will be regularly put into situations in which they can fuck each other over, and any team that takes advantage of that with any frequency won't last.

Absolutely!

I think his friends wanna play something with a better taste of paranoia...

[CanadianWolverin...]

Er, friends is too strong a word, lets say acquaintances would be a better fit except for one who introduced me to the group originally for that other game that apparently gives cancer. I no longer play with them, the vibe was all wrong for me since I was looking for more than just being an acquaintance and with my taste of SR, despite it ending up the way it did with that particular group, I just don't even ponder characters or settings for the other game anymore. What can I say, I just know which novels I enjoy reading more.

Anyways, you talk about spoofing and the like instead of tossing it but who does the spoofing? If it isn't your character, then do you really trust it? Easier to spend the nuyen on a new cheap (cheap or expensive if that fits with the fake persona of course) commlink for that new fake SiN / licenses, IMHO.

Spoofing I assume means that we are talking about changing the commlink's ID on the hardware side for permanent effect, otherwise might it seem a little odd for someone looking for Mr. Blown noticing a commlink he used to use now being used by Mr. Notblown and at least want to ask them where they got the commlink from since it connects the two. Heh, now I am picturing some street person using a commlink they found in the trash and some sort of MiB shows up to question them on where they got it from, hmm, tossing should include destroying it somehow...

Oh well, don't mind me though, I just watched Burn Notice recently, I got the idea for just tossing a suspect commlink aka "cell" from that combined with what I had been reading about SR4A communications in these forums.

Though, I don't really get the that the keyboard (gloves) and screen (glasses) would get confused if shared, since my idea of AR allows for different stuff to be placed in different transparent windows/objects (and windows/objects within) in those, which I would presume would be labeled with which commlink the call is coming from.

[Chutzpah]

1) Just think of all that pass through traffic as running through a different part of your commlink dedicated to that purpose, where it cannot do anything other then pass through.

2) Hidden Mode, the Device will not reply unless it gets the communication requests from the subscribed device. So your short range Hidden Device will only reply to communication requests from your Commlink because it is the subscribed device. It will not answer any other requests. If the signal range is short, or a skin link, nothing else will pick up the signal. Since it doesn't announce itself, other systems don't display it.

1) I don't think it's like that. You seem to be talking about the anonymity related to the "mesh network" part of the Trix: commlinks can't analyse (know in details) the radio traffic that passes through them. You have a second part of the 'Link (like a router) dedicated only to this job (that's why the radio traffic still pass through hidden nodes).

I think an active PAN is there for anyone who wants to see, but a connection (very restricted) with it don't require authorization. cf. SR4 20th (p.223): "In Active mode, you can both access and be accessed by other PANs, devices, and networks. You give permission for anyone to connect to your commlink and see what is on it." and: "Many people openly broadcast certain portions of their personal data via their PAN for others to access. This is known as a public profile, represented by an expandable AR tab or an info window that opens when you select their icon in AR." (idem, p.219). When you "select the icon" your 'Link asks the other node for a profile, which answers sending the data displayed in an ARO. This doesn't mean that one icon is logging on the other, though i think this is a possibility ("to see what is on it").


2) Your answer made me think about other things. Are we actually subscribed (logged on) to every device in our PAN (thus counting against the subscription limit)? I think the Commlink just orders the image link: "diplay that video call", and the im.link replies "Yes sir, here it is!" (not having to log on).
As I was saying, the node accessing the active 'link don't really see the hiden devices in the PAN, but can actually see what devices are interacting with the 'Link forming a PAN (as Commlinks are the main hub of the PAN...)

This is an exemple of what i think that happens to an Active: if a Knight Errant drone check your 'Link it will see your public profile (with SIN, Licenses) AND your PAN. If you're carrying an Ares Predator IV w\ Smartgun subscribed to your 'Link, the Drone will see it. You will probably have a (fake) license for the gun, so the drone will analise it to be assured it is a real one. If everything is fine he flies away to check another person's 'Link.

Thank you for the answers. (and pardon me if I ask too much!)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

1) I don't think it's like that. You seem to be talking about the anonymity related to the "mesh network" part of the Trix: commlinks can't analyse (know in details) the radio traffic that passes through them. You have a second part of the 'Link (like a router) dedicated only to this job (that's why the radio traffic still pass through hidden nodes).

I think an active PAN is there for anyone who wants to see, but a connection (very restricted) with it don't require authorization. cf. SR4 20th (p.223): "In Active mode, you can both access and be accessed by other PANs, devices, and networks. You give permission for anyone to connect to your commlink and see what is on it." and: "Many people openly broadcast certain portions of their personal data via their PAN for others to access. This is known as a public profile, represented by an expandable AR tab or an info window that opens when you select their icon in AR." (idem, p.219). When you "select the icon" your 'Link asks the other node for a profile, which answers sending the data displayed in an ARO. This doesn't mean that one icon is logging on the other, though i think this is a possibility ("to see what is on it").


2) Your answer made me think about other things. Are we actually subscribed (logged on) to every device in our PAN (thus counting against the subscription limit)? I think the Commlink just orders the image link: "diplay that video call", and the im.link replies "Yes sir, here it is!" (not having to log on).
As I was saying, the node accessing the active 'link don't really see the hiden devices in the PAN, but can actually see what devices are interacting with the 'Link forming a PAN (as Commlinks are the main hub of the PAN...)

This is an exemple of what i think that happens to an Active: if a Knight Errant drone check your 'Link it will see your public profile (with SIN, Licenses) AND your PAN. If you're carrying an Ares Predator IV w\ Smartgun subscribed to your 'Link, the Drone will see it. You will probably have a (fake) license for the gun, so the drone will analise it to be assured it is a real one. If everything is fine he flies away to check another person's 'Link.

Thank you for the answers. (and pardon me if I ask too much!)

There is a table in Unwired (Pages 54-55) describing the things that can be handled with Data Requests vs. those that actually require a subscription... and the differences between the two.

Keep the Faith

[DireRadiant]

Thank you for the answers. (and pardon me if I ask too much!)

See Tymeaus reference. But common data requests don't require subscriptions, and as long as you don't put your subscription list out in that part of your commlink, how will someone know what you are allowing to connect?

[Chutzpah]

1) Anyways, you talk about spoofing and the like instead of tossing it but who does the spoofing? If it isn't your character, then do you really trust it? Easier to spend the nuyen on a new cheap (cheap or expensive if that fits with the fake persona of course) commlink for that new fake SiN / licenses, IMHO.

Spoofing I assume means that we are talking about changing the commlink's ID on the hardware side for permanent effect, otherwise might it seem a little odd for someone looking for Mr. Blown noticing a commlink he used to use now being used by Mr. Notblown and at least want to ask them where they got the commlink from since it connects the two. Heh, now I am picturing some street person using a commlink they found in the trash and some sort of MiB shows up to question them on where they got it from, hmm, tossing should include destroying it somehow...

2) Though, I don't really get the that the keyboard (gloves) and screen (glasses) would get confused if shared, since my idea of AR allows for different stuff to be placed in different transparent windows/objects (and windows/objects within) in those, which I would presume would be labeled with which commlink the call is coming from.

1) You definitely suffer from Paranoia. I recommend you searching for a Stret Doc or a BTL dealer asap. (But i'm convinced that tossing away a tainted Commlink is actually a good (and cheap) idea! Especially if you can't trust anyone, not even your dog Dogmeat)
I have to say that you won't go far doing all by your self in shadowrun. Some day you will have to trust a hacker. Moreover an untrustful character will end up with a bad rep (and the worst jobs).
You are right about spoofing. (and i was wrong when i said before that an Agent can spoof access IDs - they don't have Software or Hardware skills!)

2) Maybe I'm wrong...

[Chutzpah]

Thank you Tymeaus and Dire Radiant.
Most of my doubts are gone.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Thank you Tymeaus and Dire Radiant.
Most of my doubts are gone.

Null Perspiration Chummer...

Keep the Faith

[CanadianWolverin...]

1) You definitely suffer from Paranoia. I recommend you searching for a Stret Doc or a BTL dealer asap. (But i'm convinced that tossing away a tainted Commlink is actually a good (and cheap) idea! Especially if you can't trust anyone, not even your dog Dogmeat)
I have to say that you won't go far doing all by your self in shadowrun. Some day you will have to trust a hacker. Moreover an untrustful character will end up with a bad rep (and the worst jobs).

Hehe, Paranoia indeed. I blame the Scorched and Sensitive Neural Structure in the character's past ... heh, I wonder if a character with Gremlins would feel the same way too. Definitely needs a Doc (and the karma) indeed. And wouldn't you know it, a few mild addictions to stuff that makes the character feel like they have more willpower to boot. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

But too true, gotta trust sometime, without it I don't think a Runner team could actually exist. Yeah, that definitely would not help with better paying / tougher jobs for sure, teams must be harder to come by than individuals in the shadows. Also teams heavy in certain specializations and lacking others must be a pain in the ass as well, I bet that is why gangs only make it so far in the shadows, a shortage of certain skills (and tools) in their team. A hacker one can trust with their life must be worth their weight in [insert highly valued SR resource here].

[Chutzpah]

As far as I understood:

Accessing a node: it's an interaction between 2 nodes that happens in two ways: data request or subscription. As an interaction, there is no single way communication i.e. a node only receives data if the other accepts it or only sends data if the other authorizes it.
Account: it's the representation of the extention of one node's access rights towards another. A public account gives the most limited access rights, but it usually require only the access ID. An account is needed not only in subscriptions, but as well in data requests.

ACTIVE MODE: the node's icon is seen by nearby nodes and can be found in the Trix by who ever knows it's ID (as PASSIVE MODE). It also allows any node to see the owner's public profile or to see (only) what's inside the node.

If i'm right this line of thought can't be correct:

(..) The commlink in Active mode is sitting there screaming "Here I am, I'm here, my name is 78906&*Z%78957895675!" to everyone. Scanning devices do not need to connect or subscribe or go look to see that. Since the scanning device does not subscribe or connect to your Active Mode commlink, it will not see the Hidden Mode devices in your PAN.

What actually happens (as I conceive) is that an Active Node accepts data requests concerning its public profile. When you select an Active Node from your 'Link you actually require data from it (your 'link says to the other: "hi, i'm commlink ID98146392081, send me your public profile). When you see the ARO with the public profile, it means the Active Node sent it to you, as you required. In order to request data, your 'Link access the Active Node, which requires a Public Account (thus your ID must be sent, leaving data trail).

>> So does it mean that a hidden node is "discovered" if i it sends a data request? Absolutely. If the other node tries to send a data request to you, it simply won't find the node (which is hidden). And if your node is in Passive, the data request would require your authorization.

Is something wrong with that?

[Chutzpah]

As an interaction, there is no single way communication i.e. (1)a node only receives data if the other accepts it or (2) only sends data if the other authorizes it.

I got a little confused there. Allow me to explain:

(1) NODE A >>>send request to download data>>> NODE B >>>authorizes and send data>>> NODE A

(2) NODE A >>>send request to upload data>>> NODE B >>>authorizes node A to send data>>> NODE A >>>send data>>> NODE B

(something like this...)

[Lantzer]

Well net-cat's now pregnant and there's been hints that Slamm-O is responsible so it either went smashingly well or at least well enough that further engagements followed up.

And _that_, my freinds, is why you keep your firewall up to date.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

And _that_, my freinds, is why you keep your firewall up to date.

Classic...

Keep the Faith