[X] My Assistant

[Daylen]

on smaller corps that could be considered policlubs: ACORN is getting into the shell game of claiming to go out of business when all they are really doing is reorganizing so they don't have a name with a bad history.

[The_Vanguard]

Oh no! Not that evil Halliburton! Is it 2006 again?

Well, that's the point. I bet they have always tried to stay out of the news because they had anticipated the PR backlash that was likely to occur. It's a conscious decision not to shout it from the rooftops that you have an ex-president on your payroll. Take their Russian competitor Gazprom in contrast, who've got Germany's former head of state and parade him around like Ronald McDonald.

[AngelisStorm]

I still push for Disney as one of the closest companies (that we've heard of) to being a mega-corp.

It's in many countries, tt has diverse holdings, and it is a bunch of smaller corps, tied together by an umbrella corporation. (Each of the Disney parks, for example, are their own corporation. As is Disney media, who have the movies, for example.) Plus it has amazing PR. I believe Mickey is one of the ten most recognized symbols in the world (along with Coke, Santa, and the Red Cross).

There are sneaky companies out there that own a TON of stuff (or less things, but insane amounts of money). But since we're playing Shadowrun, we have to note that many companies, for example Aztec and Horizon, are built on their PR.

[kzt]

If a modern company doesn't have gross sales equal to the GDP of at least Brazil it isn't a megacorp. Since the number of companies with two trillion (1*10^12) dollars in sales is a grand total of zero I think it's reasonable to say that there are none.

Royal Dutch Shell had revenues equal to the GDP of South Africa, Wall-Mart equaled Columbia. But 400 some billion is a long way from the 7 trillion of the PRC.

[Megu]

Can't forget good old Saeder-Krupp, born out of BMW. Also, with Pepsi owning Taco Bell, Pizza Hut, and KFC, I could easily see Aztechnology, the NERPS king, as having bought Pepsico.

This is interesting, because I've actually been running it where it's Coca-Cola and related prospects that the Azzies own. I was inspired by all the stuff tying Coke to violence against union leaders in Colombia and things like that, and with the Azzies being big down there and a typical Bad Corp, it seemed natural. So the anti-Azzie Mayan shaman on our team actually likes to plan anti-Aztech hits from the safety of the local Taco Bell, since the people who own that place sure aren't going to intervene. I don't think I ever made it clear who owns Pepsi. I mean, they've proven themselves pretty media-savvy at several points in my memory, so Horizon crossed my mind, but that might be a bit odd, considering Horizon's focus and its newness.

[KnightIII]

While modern companies may not be independant Mega's, its more than realistic to belive they would have been absorbed and folded into a Mega and still operate their own brand. Most people wouldnt even notice the diference. The average person does not assiciate Blizzard Entertainment with Activision, much less Vivendi.

I think someone else mentioned General Electric ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Electric ). Theres a real world varied portfolio for you. If they were not A or AA class on their own, that would be stunning.

We know General Motors and NASA were taken into Ares.

p 221 (SR4) showing the image of what life looks like through AR strongly suggests Aztechnology took Wal Mart. Their corp description fits that too as the worlds leader in consumer products.

I usually just put any modern companies that would have survived in another mega corp. Mccy Ds? Aztech. Pepsico? Ares. General Mills? Aztech. etc.

[Method]

p 221 (SR4) showing the image of what life looks like through AR strongly suggests Aztechnology took Wal Mart. Their corp description fits that too as the worlds leader in consumer products.

And evil...

[Khyron]

Amusingly, Ares is a real world company and they do in fact make guns.

[MYST1C]

Amusingly, Ares is a real world company and they do in fact make guns.

~10 years ago my little brother had a Fujitsu-Siemens PC with an Aztech sound card...

[MYST1C]

Take their Russian competitor Gazprom in contrast, who've got Germany's former head of state and parade him around like Ronald McDonald.

Gazprom has the former head of government of Germany (Gerhard Schröder, German Chancellor 1998-2005). The German head of state is the President.

[The_Vanguard]

Sorry, my bad. Thanks for the correction.

[Daylen]

Disney is definitely a AA or AAA. they are outside local govt control and can exercise eminent domain.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

Disney is definitely a AA or AAA. they are outside local govt control and can exercise eminent domain.

Plus, they have Disney's head in a jar just waiting for a breakthrough in technology to go Phoenix Down on him. (Hey, this actually a VERY GOOD IDEA, an AA corp run by a cyberzombie (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif) )

[AngelisStorm]

And Disney has bomb squads and SWAT teams. The dudes you see in the park are the "corp sec" (rent-a-cop) security that runners buldoze over all the time. Those parks are guarded like state government buildings (and some federal).

However they are not outside the control of local government. France completely hosed Disney over when they were building Disneyland Paris (now EuroDisney, I believe). It's why you can find pierced cast members with pink hair at their park.

I'm actually suprised that in Florida, Disney World wasn't made it's own county. It owns 95% of one county (there are only something like 300 citizens living in that county officially), and a large portion of the one next door. (I'm suprised the state didn't say "screw it" and just let them run amock in their own county, to stop messing with the other ones.)

Anyway, there are no AAA level corps in the real world. However, isn't the point of this thread to discuss whether there are any in existance, and which AA level corps (like Disney, among others) could theoretically grow into a AAA, given the right circumstances?

P.S. And yes, there is the of course the resurrection of Uncle Walt to consider. Whether you go for the "head in a jar" theory, or the full body freeze (which I support).

[kzt]

No, Disney relies on the local PDs/sheriff for armed security. The Disney guys are unarmed. They could have formed their own PD, but they didn't. Not that the they don't have a lot of pull with the PDs...

[MYST1C]

France completely hosed Disney over when they were building Disneyland Paris (now EuroDisney, I believe).

You have it backwards: It was called "Euro Disney Resort" in the beginning (1992-1994), then changed name to "Disneyland Resort Paris".

[raben-aas]

I liked it when Mars renamed itself to MASTERFOOD. Had that diabolical ring to it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Walpurgisborn]

Anyway, there are no AAA level corps in the real world. However, isn't the point of this thread to discuss whether there are any in existance, and which AA level corps (like Disney, among others) could theoretically grow into a AAA, given the right circumstances?

Actually, there are tons of AAA corps in the real world. It's a credit rating, and part of the whole recent economic collapse was the number of companies with AAA ratings that were over-exposed.

Side note on Disney, they were given permission to build their own nuclear reactor in Epcott. They haven't taken advantage of it, but they still have, by act of Congress, the rights to do so.

[MissingLink]

http://www.pepsico.com/Company/Our-Brands.html

A list of brands owned by Pepsico. Quite a list of snacks and drinks.

Coca=cola is mentioned in the original Shadows of North America under the listing for Atlanta. Also there is Hisato-Turner Broadcasting as an obvious reference to Ted Turner's companies.

[Nath]

Anyway, there are no AAA level corps in the real world. However, isn't the point of this thread to discuss whether there are any in existance, and which AA level corps (like Disney, among others) could theoretically grow into a AAA, given the right circumstances?

In Shadowrun, a megacorporation may receive AAA rating if the existing AAA consider they weights so much in world economy and geopolitics that they must be involved in decision-taking regarding all megacorporate business. That's somehow a new occurrence of the "too big to fall" principle. Those corps must have a voice on the court and discount rate from Zurich-Orbital Gemeinshaft Bank because one of them ending on the wrong side of a court decision or getting short on cash would thrown a bunch of countries into severe economical crisis, millions of corporate citizens suddenly left stateless with equally worthless corp scrip, and a lot of military gear out of control.

AA status is granted following similar considerations, albeit on a smaller scale. Corporate extraterritoriality serves one purpose : preventing government from interfering with free trade. The CAS government could require Lone Star to share police files from UCAS and Québec ; The German gov could forbid Saeder-Krupp to operate oil rigs in Iran ; the French gov could block a legit takeover attempt against Esprit Industries, and so on.

In this regards, the corps should want all corporations, no matter how small, to be extraterritorial. However, as said above, when an extraterritorial corp goes out of business, a lot of problem arise. That's why the Corporate Court should only grant extraterritoriality to long-established corporations, well-diversified and able to survive minor to medium crisis.

My two Yokogawa scrip.

[Sponge]

This is interesting, because I've actually been running it where it's Coca-Cola and related prospects that the Azzies own. I was inspired by all the stuff tying Coke to violence against union leaders in Colombia and things like that, and with the Azzies being big down there and a typical Bad Corp, it seemed natural. So the anti-Azzie Mayan shaman on our team actually likes to plan anti-Aztech hits from the safety of the local Taco Bell, since the people who own that place sure aren't going to intervene. I don't think I ever made it clear who owns Pepsi. I mean, they've proven themselves pretty media-savvy at several points in my memory, so Horizon crossed my mind, but that might be a bit odd, considering Horizon's focus and its newness.

Now, why couldn't Aztechnology own both...? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif)

[Daylen]

Disney does run their own govt on a county level. The state did basically just say screw it and let them run their own municipality.

[kzt]

Technically the "Reedy Creek Improvement District" is the governing body for Disney World, though county sales taxes still apply. (Ok, it's technically the Walt Disney World Resort). Police are provided by Orange and Osecola County Sheriff's Deputies, Disney just has unarmed security. I believe that Disney could, in theory, create their own police department, but they prefer to have someone else do this.

Disneyland police are provided by Anaheim PD IIRC. Again, they could have created their own PD back in the day but preferred to have someone else do this.

[SecGuard]

So in ShadowRun terms Disney is seattle and the local PD's are Lone Star Security.

[kzt]

So in ShadowRun terms Disney is seattle and the local PD's are Lone Star Security.

No, it's better then that. Disney is part of the county and town. Disney doesn't pay them to enforce the law, that is just what LE does. It's like Seattle getting the Washington State Police to be the Seattle police. For free.

I understand that Disney does pay the Sheriff for deputies to work OT on Disney property, but the Sheriff has a basic duty to provide LE.