Removing cranial bombs Options

[regen]

Hey all,

In my current sr campaign the bad guys implanted a carnial bomb into a character's head. They are trying to put some pressure on him, after he did some not-so-clever things. He obviously want this thing to be removed. A good black clinic connection and plenty of money on the character's account is on the pro-side. However a carnial bomb is serious stuff and I'm not quite sure how to handle the situation.

On the one hand it is a good black clinic and who else can handle a carnial bomb, on the other hand it's a freaking carnial bomb...

[Pepsi Jedi]

Well, it'll come out for sure, ___ONCE___! Probably not the way you would like though...

[toturi]

Well, it'll come out for sure, ___ONCE___! Probably not the way you would like though...

I'm sure it will come out just fine. After all, if someone wants to implant you with a carnial bomb, you might ass well enjoy it.

[Angelone]

If it's a good clinic then there shouldn't be much to worry about. Unless he was indiscrete in his search and the baddies found out what he's trying to do.

[MikeKozar]

How hard it is to remove is largely dependant on the vindictiveness/thoroughness of the corp that implanted it (and by extension, the GM). Figure a cranial bomb is intended to give the implantee only two choices - compliance or death. Easy removal is not going to be a selling point. A budget version might simply be a remote-detonated charge implanted subdermally, but the corp can make it harder to remove (and thus, more effective) by spending extra money on the implantation process or the device. For instance, imagine if the charge was clamped to the outside of the skull...versus the inside of the skull. Maybe it is buried in the brain, and a sloppy removal will cause irreparable damage. It could also be boobytrapped - nanotech fibers could have wormed their way into the brain, and will detonate the charge if broken or cut. Maybe the device is sensitive to normal light, and if the surgeons aren't working under a green filter when they open the implantee up, the device goes off. Maybe it is chemically triggered, and the second it is removed from the cranial fluid it blows the surgeon's hand off.

The cranial bomb is supposed to be the ultimate form of leverage. Getting one implanted is a major plot point, and getting it removed should be equally significant. As a GM, I would borrow from Neuromancer here - the implantee could spend all the money he has on consultations and scans, but the best clinics just shake their heads and refuse to try. The implantee can either go along with the people that have the detonator and hope they let him off the hook someday, or find some other group that can remove it for him for a price - and let's be honest, they have just as much leverage and just as little ethical obligation as the previous group.

[LurkerOutThere]

Take this all as purely GM to GM suggestions and may in fact deviate heavily from rules or from your taste.

I would presume if your going to put a cranial bomb in someones skull for purposes of control your going to take some level of anti tampering countermeasures. It could be that your runner's black clinic runs the character under some scans and gives them a percentile chance of success. If the bomb is a kink bomb, that is a bomb packing enough force to do damage to it's surroundings and not just kill the character then it is quite possible that the characters black clinic contact may refuse to work on them for their safety and that of their staff. Otherwise the black clinic might suggest the runner run down a specialist (someone with experience in surgery, cybertech, AND Demolitions). If the surgeon is willing to do the surgery I'd have the surgeon make his cybertech + logic roll, glitches and ciritcal glitches mean the bomb goes off and the player dies, on the other side of the coin as long as the bomb isn't tied into anything else all it should take is a couple hits. HOWEVER going back to that percentage mentioned above I'd get out a big percentiale die if you have one and roll it in front of them. If the percent isn't beaten the bomb goes off and the character dies. If the character wants better odds of success they might be referred to have locate the specialist as above.

Now for my purposes a specialist who is going to be able to disarm cranial bombs reliably is going to have pools (that is trait plus skill) sufficient to buy two hits at both cybertech and demolition tests so a pool of around 8 dice. This points to someone who is skilled and specialized and likely puts in or takes out cranial bombs as a large part of their business now or in the past. Seeking that person out might become a fun adventure of itself.

Now other fun things, does the character have other cyberware such as ears or other sensory equipment? If a corganization wanted to ensure their bomb stayed in place they might have loaded an agent in monitoring the characters senses, if they go anywhere near a cyberclinic (or does anything else the organization considers "unfaithfull" the agent pops up a count down until the bomb goes off or the character ceases such actions, whichever come first. Getting rid of this agent or getting it to start to empathasize with he character could lead to some neat RP challenges.

[Red-ROM]

I would definatly look at the demolitions chapter in arsenal at all the anti-tamper stuff. Was this bomb attached to a negative quality like mysterious cyberware? because that puppy wouldn't come out without some karma being spent.

edit: also, where does one plant a Carnial bomb? is this a new type of chastity belt?

[Ascalaphus]

"Carnal" just refers to meat as opposed to spirit. So most cranial bombs are carnal. But it makes me wonder - could there be such a thing as a spiritual equivalent of the cranial bomb? Something that nukes your Essence, perhaps?
I recall the Triads using something like that.

[Demonseed Elite]

The Triads use blood oaths, which are a bit different because they rely on the individual taking the oath. So the individual is accepting the risk and knows about it, unlike your typical cranial bomb victim.

[LurkerOutThere]

I just speak typo-ese so i got it as cranial.

[Ascalaphus]

The Triads use blood oaths, which are a bit different because they rely on the individual taking the oath. So the individual is accepting the risk and knows about it, unlike your typical cranial bomb victim.

How do those Blood Oaths work anyway? Is it a kind of metamagic?

[Demonseed Elite]

How do those Blood Oaths work anyway? Is it a kind of metamagic?

They've never been explained in rules, but they are likely a form of sacrifice metamagic.

[kjones]

If the bomb is a kink bomb, that is a bomb packing enough force to do damage to it's surroundings and not just kill the character then it is quite possible that the characters black clinic contact may refuse to work on them for their safety and that of their staff.

I'm with you for the most part, but any clinic worth its salt will have access to an autodoc (and will just charge you a repair fee on top of everything else).

[Manunancy]

"Carnal" just refers to meat as opposed to spirit. So most cranial bombs are carnal. But it makes me wonder - could there be such a thing as a spiritual equivalent of the cranial bomb? Something that nukes your Essence, perhaps?
I recall the Triads using something like that.

The most common magic equivalent is oteh organisation to get ritual samples of the chatacter (thins like blood, hairs and the like), which let them use ritual magic to send all sort of nasty mojo no matter where the chatacter is.

[Sixgun_Sage]

I'm certain it has been stated before but when you factor in the sheer number of anti-tampering measures a corp can easilly fit into a cranial bomb (a photoreceptive patch for example that goes boom the moment light hits it) make removing a cranial bomb damn risky through conventional methods, the only method I can think of to safely disarm it is nanotech programed to find and then disarm it first and nanotech is not available at even most of the better black clinics. The ones that have it are likely corp (or atleast yakuza) owned.

[LurkerOutThere]

I'm with you for the most part, but any clinic worth its salt will have access to an autodoc (and will just charge you a repair fee on top of everything else).

I can see it going either way really, a black clinic might be willing to set up an autodoc and do things that way, or they might not be willing to put up with the hassle/risk.

[Mongoose]

I suspect that cranial bomb removal in a high level clinic wouldn't be done surgically; it would be done with nanites that can directly "eat" away the explosive without triggering any of the bombs defenses. Of course, a really good bomb would have a casing with its own sensors, so getting the nantites in through that may be tough. But when you get to that point, it essentially becomes a contest of software.

[Stahlseele]

Carnal Bombs should be removed by Marital Arts.

[KarmaInferno]

Instead of asking how it can be removed, ask yourself this:

What is it there for?

A cranial bomb is really nothing more than a plot hook. Something to motivate the characters.

If it's important to the plot, it's kinda counterproductive for the runners get it out themselves. There should be some way of having the bomb removed if they follow the plot, and the characters should be made to clearly understand this. Once the plot is followed the actual bomb removal later can just be handwaved away. It just happens.




-np

[kzt]

Of course, it's cheaper and easier for the guy placing it if there really isn't a bomb at all....

[Ascalaphus]

A cranial bomb is really nothing more than a plot hook. Something to motivate the characters.

If it's important to the plot, it's kinda counterproductive for the runners get it out themselves. There should be some way of having the bomb removed if they follow the plot, and the characters should be made to clearly understand this. Once the plot is followed the actual bomb removal later can just be handwaved away. It just happens.

Well.. motivation, sure. Forcing the characters to do as they're told.. well, whoever put the bomb there wants them to believe there's no other way. There shouldn't be an easy other way.

But great stories are possible about getting rid of a bomb in a different way; perhaps by finding a rival with sufficient delta-tech to do it. ("Ares gave me this damn thing, but the nice nice people at Aztechnology are willing to help me out.. for a small favor..")

Using a cranial bomb to hogtie a player to a plot is weak.

[KarmaInferno]

Well.. motivation, sure. Forcing the characters to do as they're told.. well, whoever put the bomb there wants them to believe there's no other way. There shouldn't be an easy other way.

But great stories are possible about getting rid of a bomb in a different way; perhaps by finding a rival with sufficient delta-tech to do it. ("Ares gave me this damn thing, but the nice nice people at Aztechnology are willing to help me out.. for a small favor..")

Using a cranial bomb to hogtie a player to a plot is weak.

"The plot" is a flexible thing. Or it should be, at any rate. If the players want to go to the Azzies instead, well, sure, run with it. It might take your game in a whole different direction. But it's still advancing plot.

I guess what I was TRYING to say is, a cranial bomb should never, ever, be something players can just go to a street doc and pay some money to have it extracted. However the story ends up, it's a plot driver and should never be simple to get rid of.

As such, the actual mechanical method of how it gets removed it irrelevant. It's there to push the story along.



-np

[Method]

Of course, it's cheaper and easier for the guy placing it if there really isn't a bomb at all....

Now that is evil... I like it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif)

[Aerospider]

Using a cranial bomb to hogtie a player to a plot is weak.

Unless, as in my game, you have a player whose first two choices at chargen are:
"Result! Shadowrun has the amnesia quality!"
and
"Ooh, cranial bomb!"

That guy's built his own world-of-hurt ...

[Walpurgisborn]

If it's important to the plot, it's kinda counterproductive for the runners get it out themselves. There should be some way of having the bomb removed if they follow the plot, and the characters should be made to clearly understand this. Once the plot is followed the actual bomb removal later can just be handwaved away. It just happens.

Why?

Assuming I'm an evil cranial bombing kinda guy, why bother removing it when the person is finished with the job. Say they do what I tell them to do, fine and dandy, why not tell them they have to do something else.
Corp really has no incentive to remove the cranial bomb. So why would they?