Traceless Walk and Liquids Options

[Kazuhiro]

If a character with Traceless Walk gecko-climbs over a surface that's covered with a liquid, what happens? Do they get the liquid on them? Do they slip on the liquid and fall?

[Banaticus]

Well, the gecko gloves specifically say that they cannot be used when wet. Presuming that he has the gecko hands bioware, then he can gecko climb over a surface covered with a liquid, by sticking to that surface while he moves.

Traceless walk does say that the adept cannot walk across liquid surfaces, but I think that's just meant to say that he cannot literally walk on water, not that water suddenly becomes a bar to his crossing.

So he gecko climbs over the surface in such a gracefully manner that he doesn't set off surface-based motion/pressure sensors.

[Kazuhiro]

All right, never mind crawling across a wall. Can you Traceless Walk across a substance spread on the ground without getting any of said substance on your feet?

[toturi]

All right, never mind crawling across a wall. Can you Traceless Walk across a substance spread on the ground without getting any of said substance on your feet?

Magic. Same way you walk on mud and not leave a trace. Hence Traceless Walk.

[Ol' Scratch]

There's also Gliding in Street Magic.

[Dumori]

Traceless walk, gliding, wall running and the cat-fall one make for a fun power combo. I runslilenlty up the wall across the trees and fall down with out getting hurt. Then use my monwire garot on the guard.

[Kazuhiro]

My combo is Traceless Walk, Improved Invisibility, and a ruthenium-coated jumpsuit complete with helmet. Olfactory cigarette optional (in my character's case said olfactory cigarettes are laced with THC and nicotine to feed her addiction to synthetic puff.) So the only things that can detect my character is sonar (until she starts using the Silence spell that is,) Assensing (until she gets the Astral Chameleon metamagic) and proximity wire.

Improved Invisiblity and a camo-suit might seem redundant, but those three things basically enable her to walk right past someone's face (or gecko-crawl past, as is more often the case) with relative confidence. In order to spot her, the shmuck first has to get 2 hits on a Willpower test (Willpower+Counterspelling if they've got it) and THEN they have to beat her Infiltration roll while taking a -4.

[Stahlseele]

And, for the first time in history, the Street-Sam can beat the Adept at this aside for the running over tree-branches by using hover-feet. And gecko hands/climbing claws.
And Ruthenium Polymere suit.

[Kazuhiro]

I don't understand at all how adepts are "better" than streetsams. The street sam can dish out a 9P punch, let loose a burst of 12 bullets and take no recoil from it, install facial recognition softs, improved hearing, and thermographic vision, and let loose a rocket from a hidden launcher in his ass.

The adept can do one, maybe two of these things, maybe marginally better than the streetsam can.

[Stahlseele]

Well, in athletics and sneaky stuffies the Adept had allways been superior, because he had magic that could fool sensors that a Street-Sam could not.
For example, pressure-plates. And with gliding, an adept can run over water, over branches, over frigging sheets of paper or dental floss. And with traceless step without even denting the material he is walking over too. No denting branches also means no rustling of leaves aside for those you hit with your body.
And the adept still had the ability to get some of the ware a samurai would get in addition to those feats too.
Now the adept can still run over water and branches without leaving traces, but the samurai can stand on the water for as long as he likes, even if he will disturb the water a bit.

[Ol' Scratch]

This is an age-old argument.

In a nutshell, it comes down to this: Adepts excel at specializing in one or two particular areas and are unmatched in unarmed combat if that happens to be one of their specialties. They also have unlimited potential, growing more and more powerful with every point of Karma they obtain. Cyberfreaks excel at being generalists; they can do a ton of things with good to excellent capabilities and excel in the use of firearms and heavy weapons. Their growth potential is strictly limited by their Essence score and it will reach a finite limit after earning a ton of nuyen for upgrades. Additionally, while adepts start off as a specialist, they make up for the lack of all the toys a cyberfreak has with access to wholly unique abilities like Traceless Walk, Elemental Strike, and Commanding Voice, none of which can be duplicated with implants. Adepts also have access to everything cyberfreaks do, but are much more limited in their selection.

In the end, neither is really better than the other, and neither really reach their breaking point until they earn ridiculous amounts of Karma and/or nuyen. Adepts have more growth capacity and start off far more limited, but cyberfreaks can start the game at nearly their full potential at the cost of having less growth potential.

[Kazuhiro]

So you're saying 4th ed brought up cyberware a few notches so that cyberware could match physads and their crazy kung-fu?

[Ol' Scratch]

It's always been this way. The difference is just a little less obvious at character creation now.

[CeeJay]

I don't understand at all how adepts are "better" than streetsams.

That's simple. Given enough time and karma and adept can do everything a cybered sam could, including getting cyberware. And then some.

But you are right, out of the box an adepts isn't 'better than a street sam.

-CJ

[Stahlseele]

NOTHING can match adept crazy kung fu.
But now, the Samurai gets to do the Jesus walk too ^^

[Dumori]

Elf and Dwarf awakened will slowly own the shadows what with he live for much longer that the other competing races. Well tbf any shadowrunner worth his salt could always save up for leanisation. Even then the long living have the advantage of needing it less.

[Stahlseele]

Wait . . are there actually runners that die because of age and not because of other natural causes like lead poisoning?

[Dumori]

A few. Some are very good at there job oddly enough for me these then to be the awakened. Manly cos my awakend are the steathly types or the face types and thus tend to be well versed in staying hidden and keep there real ID's hidden.

[Ol' Scratch]

You must be playing in some really long campaigns, or starting with people already on their death beds then!

[Stahlseele]

A few. Some are very good at there job oddly enough for me these then to be the awakened. Manly cos my awakend are the steathly types or the face types and thus tend to be well versed in staying hidden and keep there real ID's hidden.

Also, because those get stronger with age/karma.

[Dumori]

I've never said they got that far. Though my Ork did but then they live to 30odd. My elf's over all plan is to run the shadows for as long as he wants as he likes the freedom and thrill more than the money but hey its still good. He's a B&E mystic adept started off with crappy spell-casting built it all up now to be a well rounded sneaker. Hopefully he will retire/go to the background. Going to the background is what we uses for leaving a PC still an active runner but making a new PC.

[KarmaInferno]

I have a runner I've been playing since '94. He's currently in his 70s.

He spends an inordinate amount of time complaining about how things today suck.



-karma

[Kronk2]

There's also Gliding in Street Magic.

And Gliding DOES allow you to walk on water, for a little while anyway

[Banaticus]

Can you Traceless Walk across a substance spread on the ground without getting any of said substance on your feet?

If that substance is in any way solid, yes. If it's liquid, no. Snow (which has a crust), yes. Water (even though leaves and water strider float), no. If it's a gel, GM's call.

[merashin]

If that substance is in any way solid, yes. If it's liquid, no. Snow (which has a crust), yes. Water (even though leaves and water strider float), no. If it's a gel, GM's call.

i would have to disagree with your analysis of the power. The power gliding says "across a tangible surface unable to hold his weight," tangible is different than solid. Tangible just means that it has a physical form. It also gives examples of what you could run across, one of which is water.