 Learning magic, Ganger to Mage |
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  Feb 23 2004, 07:32 PM
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#1
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Chicago Survivor  Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033  |
I had a player once that wanted his cybered out troll street sam to learn the error of his ways and begin to learn magic, either through phys ad. or full mage, we never discussed which he would go to. And yes, I'm sure he was trying to powergame, which I generally frown upon as it tends to lose the gritty feel.
Any way, after reading, re-reading and in general wearing out my copy of Year of the Comet, I've come to a conclusion about how to solve the dilemma should it rise again (I don't play with the one player any more). His one chance would be to SURGE, and manifest either Astral perception od become dual natured (I believe at least one of those puts your magic attribute to 1) I would then have the player being initiating or buying power point depending on magic style, though I would rule that he would have to initiate as a phys ad if he wanted to go over 1 in a power that has a rating or level. This would place a significant karma cost on the person, but it is the only way I can think of for a mundane character to gain a magic attribute in game. Anyone else had to deal with this and if so, how? |
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Feb 23 2004, 07:53 PM
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#2
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Your option sounds good. Either that or kill the character and let the player make a new one, but that's one that should be reserved for repeat powergaming offenders (the ones you don't mind them possibly walking on the game).
~J |
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Feb 23 2004, 08:03 PM
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#3
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
Does he have any essence left, and is he worth the extra trouble?
If he does and is, I'd allow him to try it _if_ the occurance of surge wasn't a sure thing - he's gotta take his chances like anybody else. Then, I'd let him buy with karma the ability to do magic ( I'd look up the price in BECKS - around 60-80 karma if I remember correctly. What, did he expect to get it cheaper than a guy who got magic at chargen?) Then He'd by a heavily cybered troll mage - who has Surged and wasted much of his essence. If He's got essence <1, tell him no. |
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Feb 23 2004, 08:06 PM
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#4
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
I'm not a fan of the kill and make a new one. The character had a bit of history, we'd been playing ever few days for a few monthes. (while living with a lot of people sucks, it's great fun when you have your RP group as roommates for nightly gaming)
Though I did consider making him play his docwagon blank-clone, starting off knowing nothing, defaulting to natural attributes, etc. |
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Feb 23 2004, 08:10 PM
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#5
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Lantzer has a good alternative possibility, though the start-with-magic-1-and-initiate-on-up option has the advantage of not requiring a massive initial outlay of karma (a bloc of 60-80 karma at one time? That's a lot to save up) but potentially requiring more later. Not letting him join a magical group for some time would also help with that, as not many people would take a magical weakling like him.
~J |
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Feb 23 2004, 09:35 PM
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#6
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Traumatizing players since 1992 Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,282 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Las Vegas, NV Member No.: 220 |
You can do that, but you have to break canon to do it. The tissue clones are not viable, IE: Not libing organisms. They do not have functioning brains. In SR canon it is still impossible to clone a metahuman and have it function.
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Feb 23 2004, 10:05 PM
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#7
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
Truthfully, I'd say the character _can't_ learn magic.
Fully mundane people can study magical theory all they want -- but if they weren't born with the magical spark (i.e. spent points to be magically active), all they will ever know is the theory. If a good roleplayer wanted to develop a character who "Awoke" in mid-game, I'd still require him to spend points on buying Magic just like any other mage. I'd let the player "bank" the spell points until the character "Awakens" and has a chance to learn magic. After spending the banked spell points, the new mage would use standard karma rules to learn spells. Alternatively, I'd allow him a single point of Magic from a special circumstance and require him to buy more points with Karma which would curtail his spell casting ability, but it'd be realistic and cut down on the power munchkins quite a bit. That special circumstance would involve getting dumped in the metaplanes and going through some major grief and acquire some nasty drawbacks. -Siege |
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Feb 23 2004, 11:44 PM
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#8
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 156 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Santa Cruz Member No.: 5,500 |
out side of surge,some totems, just give out magic.Off the top of my head, dragon,even canoical.
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Feb 24 2004, 12:18 AM
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#9
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Ooh, let him join the Aleph Foundation.
~J |
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Feb 24 2004, 12:23 AM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 302 Joined: 20-October 03 Member No.: 5,740 |
(Showing n00bness again.) What's that? |
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Feb 24 2004, 12:35 AM
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#11
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
mmm...Threats 2...
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Feb 24 2004, 01:09 AM
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#12
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
[ Spoiler ] ~J |
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Feb 24 2004, 01:11 AM
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#13
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Focus your power into the black moon. Put everything into it and it will return power to you. Aleph Society can only grant magical powers to burnouts. So unless the character had the spark to begin with...
Insect Totem @,@ ! |
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Feb 24 2004, 02:26 AM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 400 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 825 |
Assuming he still has a full point of Essence left in him, you could just say that he's been capable all along, only didn't know it. That is, if you're if you're comfortable with just giving him 30 build points as a freebie.
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Feb 24 2004, 02:44 AM
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#15
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,012 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Are you sure it's only burnouts? I seem to remember mundanes being involved...
~J |
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Feb 24 2004, 02:56 AM
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#16
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Mundanes are involved. Something has to fuel the fire...
They don't get to use the magic, but they contribute to it (or rather: are tribute to it). |
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Feb 24 2004, 02:57 AM
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#17
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
Basically, they way the BBB describes magic, all metahumanity is born with the 'spark' for magic, only not all listen to that side of themselves. Hence why he would have to SURGE to awaken.
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Feb 24 2004, 05:27 AM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 216 Joined: 27-January 04 Member No.: 6,025 |
Where do you read this? page number? Because the way it seems to have been is that only a select few are born with the ability and it manifests itself around puberty. That's why you have to pay for the magic with build points instead of multiclassing into it whenever you feel like it. However, you are right that the SURGE changling rules can give you magic attribute at 1 but you must have the room for it around the cyber and bio already there. Then again these are only the cannon rules and if anything is subject to GM interpretation it's magic but I wouldn't be surprised if everybody suddenly
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Feb 24 2004, 08:37 AM
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#19
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Target Group: Members Posts: 9 Joined: 26-July 03 Member No.: 5,027 |
Simple house rules idea:
•Traditions: 10 Karma - Aspect Magician or Adept 20 Karma - Full Magician •Magic Rating: 20 Karma per point raised, maximum 6. Any essence loss still applies (eg a human with 5 essence needs to raise his magic 2 points before having a rating of 1). Adepts would get one power point per rating increase (same costs). Starting magicians (When effective magic=1) would get 5 force points towards spells. For each additional magic point gained, aspect magicians would get 6 force points, full-magicians 4. Assuming said street samurai has an essence of 2, should take about 110 karma to get him a single force point as an adept. |
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Feb 24 2004, 10:10 PM
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#20
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 302 Joined: 20-October 03 Member No.: 5,740 |
That seems like way too little to totally turn a character's life around, literally Awakening them mid-game. I don't know. Just seems too small. |
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Feb 24 2004, 10:18 PM
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#21
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
Amen. I'm not a fan of multi-classing without some plausible justification and an earlier poster's points are quite valid -- do you really want to hand out 30 BP for free? Isn't that gonna upset all the other legitimately magical characters? -Siege |
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Feb 24 2004, 10:53 PM
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#22
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
Notice that the math is:
20 to have the potential of full magic. +20 per point of magic attribute until the normal starting effect is purchased. this means 140 karma to become a full mage with normal starting magic potential. |
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Feb 24 2004, 11:09 PM
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#23
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
Conversely, for 30 karma points, I go "poof" and become a physical adept with a point of magic. -Siege |
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Feb 24 2004, 11:37 PM
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#24
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 476 Joined: 30-December 03 From: Fresno, CFS: taking out one durned furriner at a time. Member No.: 5,940 |
That's without any cyber or bioware at all. Most non-magically active PC's will have at least some. And personally, I wouldn't have much of a problem with a completely mundane, no cyber or bioware pc spending "only" 30 karma. Still going to require the roleplaying aspect, doesn't just happen out of nowhere. Becoming magically active is ripe ground for a good story and should be explored if this option to become magically active is allowed. |
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Feb 24 2004, 11:41 PM
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#25
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
It's your game.
I'm gonna stick with the "if you didn't buy it at character gen, it's not going to happen" approach. -Siege |
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