Armor stacking 4e?, this can't be right can it? Options

[iategod]

I would look into cyberlimbs but I have to keep gear etc at a rarity of 12 or lower. All the good stuff is up there

[Yerameyahu]

Honestly, you shouldn't look into it at all. No one wants to play in a game with some goofy charop monster. Shadowrun's about the cool things you do in a cool story. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Mäx]

Second: Orthoskin and Bone density: Do no work on/in cyberlimbs. (It is stated that nothing with essence costs can be used with cyberlimbs. That is what the cyberarmor is for.) Of course one could allow fraction of it to work in the torso/skull.

There's nothing in the rules that says you get less bonuses from those and similar mods when you have cyberlimbs.

Cyberlimbs replace attributes. You wouldn't use your natural body at all - you'd end up with 15, not 17.

Yes you do, he still has a natural head.
His mistake was dividing with 5 instead of 6, so he only has 14 Body.

[iategod]

Honestly, you shouldn't look into it at all. No one wants to play in a game with some goofy charop monster. Shadowrun's about the cool things you do in a cool story. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I hear ya there, the character I'm makigng if for a Doc wagon crew. I'm the distraction for em. His name is Meat, an ex-urban brawl character who was forced into retirement. Truth be told he was caught placing bets and throwing games (dark secret) so he left the limelight. He's not the best with money either thus working with the doc wagon.

[Yerameyahu]

Things like bone lacing used to not work in replacements in SR3, and it's a good rule for fairness, and a bad rule for simplicity. They took it out in SR4 AFAIK. *shrug*

[Medicineman]

Things like bone lacing used to not work in replacements in SR3, and it's a good rule for fairness, and a bad rule for simplicity. They took it out in SR4 AFAIK. *shrug*

No,Its still in 4A
no Bones or Skin in or on Cyberarms,-Legs,-Torso,- or Skull

Hough !
Medicineman

[KarmaInferno]

<peers at cybermonstrosity>

<hits it with multiple high-force Manabolts>





-karma

[Neraph]

Ragewind has figured out how to get 120+/120+ armor with a standard 400 BP character. It's not that hard if you're really working at it. My mages don't walk around without 10/9 armor at least.

[Medicineman]

Ragewind has figured out how to get 120+/120+ armor with a standard 400 BP character. It's not that hard if you're really working at it. My mages don't walk around without 10/9 armor at least.

Oh ,You mean a Surged Nartaki with 4 Pair of Arms carrying 8 Riot Shields,2 Cyberlegs & Torso&Skull full of Cyberarmor & PSP Pimped Armorjacked and FFFB Combo ? ?
Njah to that

Hough !
Medicineman

[Saint Sithney]

Where are the Gelpacks?
Stuff an extra +1/+1 into each and every piece of armor, including the helmet and the PPP pieces!

[Neraph]

Oh ,You mean a Surged Nartaki with 4 Pair of Arms carrying 8 Riot Shields,2 Cyberlegs & Torso&Skull full of Cyberarmor & PSP Pimped Armorjacked and FFFB Combo ? ?
Njah to that

Hough !
Medicineman

Kind of. It also involved being in a rigger coccoon inside a vehicle. That's like 60-70 armor there.

[Dumori]

Ah the I cant move and a poke will knock me down but I'm strapped in char. A partfrombeing unable to to jack and your transport bening to be scraped in a next to no time leaving uo in a riggers caccon with so much armor that movement is hindered is just funny. Oh your bullet proof are you HE nade or two followed by incendiary. Burn that troll.

[Mäx]

No,Its still in 4A
no Bones or Skin in or on Cyberarms,-Legs,-Torso,- or Skull

Hough !
Medicineman

Could you please quote an actual rule that says that the bonus you get from otho skin and the like becomes lower when you get a cyber-arm.

Ragewind has figured out how to get 120+/120+ armor with a standard 400 BP character. It's not that hard if you're really working at it. My mages don't walk around without 10/9 armor at least.

And that character was totall bullshit and funnily still dies to combat mage casting couple of relativly high force soundwaves

[Traul]

however, unless he has enviro sealing, I would just use Neurostun gas, and if he does have
enviro sealing, that is what the HTRT's Mage with Stun bolt is for (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Is Neurostun an Inhalation vector toxin? If so, no need to get Enviroseal, a simple internal air tank in one of the limbs will do.

[Summerstorm]

Could you please quote an actual rule that says that the bonus you get from otho skin and the like becomes lower when you get a cyber-arm.

Hm. Maybe there are some more passages, but i would like to quote this one:

(Page 343, Cyberlimbs)
[... Cyberlimbs cannot hold any bioware, nor any cyber-implant that take up Essence rather than capacity.]

And since armor values are cumulative added, and you can't have enough to fill out the systems need you can't get the bonus. But like i said, maybe the GM will give you part of the system for adding it into the torso and skull (For the bones), since they are shells. Also of course for people who only have one/two cyberlimbs. But technicallyyou cannot have the whole system active.

[Mäx]

Hm. Maybe there are some more passages, but i would like to quote this one:

(Page 343, Cyberlimbs)
[... Cyberlimbs cannot hold any bioware, nor any cyber-implant that take up Essence rather than capacity.]

So as i assumed thre's nothink, i thought maybe i just missed somethink.
By Raw you always get full benefit from orthoskin and its like ware.

[Summerstorm]

So as i assumed thre's nothink, i thought maybe i just missed somethink.
By Raw you always get full benefit from orthoskin and its like ware.

Ah sure, you know what: Have a character with four cyberlimbs and cybertorso take Muscle Replacement too. You know as long as you pay the essence you always get the benefit. The rules don't say you can't install it, even if you have no natural muscles left.

See the point?

(page 341, Bodyware)
"Bodyware that does not have a capacity rating must be installed directly into the user's body; it cannot be installed into cyberlimbs."

Since you cannot install the full amount of dermal plating/Orthoskin/Muscle replacement etc. you cannot get the full advantage. (And do not pay the full essence costs) But that is for the GM to decide if he will allow it. Per RAW even a artificial hand blocks out orthoskin, because you cannot install it FULLY). Of course every GM will than decide that you get all advantages. But at a significant amount of cyberlimbs screw up those systems very much. (And yes it may be complicated, but tough luck)

[Mäx]

Per RAW even a artificial hand blocks out orthoskin, because you cannot install it FULLY).

No where in the booksa does it say that, so by RAW you can install full orthoskin even if you have multiple cyberlimbs.

[Stahlseele]

As per RAW, all Bone and Skin-Work are completely compatible with all kinds of Cyberlimbs.
As long as you go with cyber-replacement, and not with the Cybork Drone Body Version . . .
Also, there's still the ultimate Monstrosity i lovingly call Binky ^^
Surged Centaur. Nartaki Arms. 6 Arms. 4 Legs. Torso and Head. Cyberzombie due to complete Body Replacement.
Bulk-Modification. Maximum Armor. Left over Capacity used for other nifty stuff. I don't think it gets any worse.
Because this would put him, at Standard Grade Ware, into -8 Essence or Something. So the Attributes go higher.
Wait, i forgot, Centaurs and the such can only take delta grade ware.
Also, Cyber-Zombie Resistance. Well, maybe you could make it worse if someone else tried to and managed to
get a high force spirit to go in there and possess him . . or if someone managed to put a high force armor spell on
that monstrosity . . and then you can STILL deck him out with worn armor too . .
I have never really done the math, but i guess this one can get up to about 100 dice for Damage Resistance.
Someone with a better knowledge of the rules could try and stat it out.

Of course, this Achievement is by no means a legit Starting Character. Or legit Character at any kind of time.

[iategod]

Right, well, i was trying to stick to a 400bp character limited by 12 availability items, with no encumbrance. Most of that other stuff will blow the top of my head off if even tried to make it.

[Nal0n]

Camouflage Suit - 8/6 - Av. 4
+ Gel Packs - +1/+1 - Av. 8
FFBA, Full Body Suit - 6/2 - Av. 8
PPP Forearm Guards - +0/+1 - Av. 6
PPP Leg and Arm Casings - +1/+1 - Av. 6
PPP Shin Guards - +0/+1 - Av. 5
PPP Vitals Protector - +1/+1 - Av. 4
Helmet - +1/+2 - Av. 2
Riot Shield - +2/+6 - Av. 6

Thats 20/21 (18/15 w/o the shield) with just normal, low availability armor.
With a Ballistic Shield, which has Av. 12 it'd be 24/19 if ballistic protection is more to your liking.
And if my calculations are not too far off a char with Body 6 can wear it w/o penalties (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

As far as money is concerned: All the Armor stuff is 5,300 NuYen. The shields are 200 for the Riot and 1,500 for the ballistic one.
Not even 2 BP (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Traul]

Surged Centaur. Nartaki Arms. 6 Arms. 4 Legs.

Bulk-Modification.

and then you can STILL deck him out with worn armor too . .

Getting a suitable armor for him is a campaign on its own (IMG:style_emoticons/default/spin.gif)

[Stahlseele]

*nods*
probably.
but still:
6x PPP Forearm Guards - +0/+6 - Av. 6
10x PPP Leg and Arm Casings - +10/+10 - Av. 6
4x PPP Shin Guards - +0/+4 - Av. 5
1x PPP Vitals Protector - +1/+1 - Av. 4
1x Helmet - +1/+2 - Av. 2
4x Riot Shield - +8/+12 - Av. 6
That's 20/35 right there ^^

[Yerameyahu]

Are the arm/leg/shin things individual or by the pair? Also, *groan*. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[iategod]

Camouflage Suit - 8/6 - Av. 4
+ Gel Packs - +1/+1 - Av. 8
FFBA, Full Body Suit - 6/2 - Av. 8
PPP Forearm Guards - +0/+1 - Av. 6
PPP Leg and Arm Casings - +1/+1 - Av. 6
PPP Shin Guards - +0/+1 - Av. 5
PPP Vitals Protector - +1/+1 - Av. 4
Helmet - +1/+2 - Av. 2
Riot Shield - +2/+6 - Av. 6

Thats 20/21 (18/15 w/o the shield) with just normal, low availability armor.
With a Ballistic Shield, which has Av. 12 it'd be 24/19 if ballistic protection is more to your liking.
And if my calculations are not too far off a char with Body 6 can wear it w/o penalties (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

As far as money is concerned: All the Armor stuff is 5,300 NuYen. The shields are 200 for the Riot and 1,500 for the ballistic one.
Not even 2 BP (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

I don't understand how a body of 6 character can sport all that without being encumbered. So a body of 6 would be able to carry 12armor before becoming encumbered. Since helmets, shields, ppp stuff, and gel packs aren't considered seperate armor they just add to the highest rank of armor being worn. The form fitting armor is halved for encumbrance values (3/1). With a camo suit of 8/6 you'd run into the limit when it adds 4/6. Right? So the full form fitting body armor (at 3/1) plus riot shield (2/6) would put you over the top. Am i wrong?