shape change, can it be used for disguise? Options

[Lansdren]

ok now something in the FAQ got me thinking about a application for the shapechange spell

Can you take Human Form as a version of the (Critter) Form spell? What about Troll Form?

Yes, since humans are, strictly speaking, non-paranormal animals. Metahumans and metavariants are paranormal, so Troll Form, Nartaki Form, etc. are not viable versions of the (Critter) Form spell

Now this to me implys you should be able to change some form into another human (or into one if your not)

Further thought makes me wonder if this could be used for disguise?

Maybe substitute the bonuses you could get to the physical stats for bonuses to disguise? One hit means your very similar to yourself but maybe slightly heavier or lighter build / different colour hair five hits and you have changed how you look by a lot or copied someone else

It would have the added benefit of automatically beating object resistance as its not a illusion but a physical change. Ok on the astral it might look abit funky if you dont have masking / extended masking.




Any thoughts?

[Machiavelli]

According to the RAW it is definitely possible, but like always, the GM has the last word on it. I would use mask or physical mask instead, same effect, less drain. But that was not the question. ^^

[Mäx]

I would personally say that you cant shape change into your of species, so human couldn't get that spell.
And you cant copy some else, you just change into a generic human.

[Mordinvan]

I would personally say that you cant shape change into your of species, so human couldn't get that spell.
And you cant copy some else, you just change into a generic human.

actually you CAN change into a human. But NOT a troll, elf, dwarf, etc, as all the latter are paranormal in nature.

[Lansdren]

I would personally say that you cant shape change into your of species, so human couldn't get that spell.
And you cant copy some else, you just change into a generic human.

How are we defining generic?

Also while the FAQ isn't a update to the rules as such it does pretty much say you can use shape change to turn into a human.

I would also point out that a troll and a human can have children which means they are the same species.

[Dahrken]

A "Human Form" spell cast by a human mage has ain interesting side effect : it is probably be the cheapest and easiest to sustain magical Attributes boost available - that +1 over base value to each Physical attribute for each net success on spellcasting can relatively easily rack up to interesting levels.

[Lansdren]

A "Human Form" spell cast by a human mage has ain interesting side effect : it is probably be the cheapest and easiest to sustain magical Attributes boost available - that +1 over base value to each Physical attribute for each net success on spellcasting can relatively easily rack up to interesting levels.

Add a sustaining focus into the mix and it could be abit game breaking, a mage whos not so weedy anymore (ok still only one ip without a second spell but still pretty worrying)


Its one of the reasons I was more looking at it from the disguise point of view, If you can change form and have some control over how it looks then it could be a handy (although painful due to drain) way of a quick change.

Still might call for a specialised spell for it really.

[The_Vanguard]

I'm not happy at all with this FAQ ruling. What a "critter" is should be defined by the content of the chapter "Critters" and nothing else. Also, it outright contradicts the Shapehange text where it reads "Magicians in critter form [...] cannot perform other tasks requiring speech." (SR4A pg.211)
The description for (Critter) Form also specifies that the spell will turn the target into an animal. The distinction between human and animal is only arbitrary, of course, but many magical traditions are all about the arbitrary stuff.

Now, if I had to deal with this I'd rule the masking aspect to be an additional option to the attribute boosts, so the mage would have to decide how to split his successes between the two. I'd also say that the human physique clearly reflects the attributes, so if you replace a wage slave and give him Str 7, everybody would ask him when he got those muscle replacements implanted.

[TommyTwoToes]

I'm not happy at all with this FAQ ruling. What a "critter" is should be defined by the content of the chapter "Critters" and nothing else. Also, it outright contradicts the Shapehange text where it reads "Magicians in critter form [...] cannot perform other tasks requiring speech." (SR4A pg.211)
The description for (Critter) Form also specifies that the spell will turn the target into an animal. The distinction between human and animal is only arbitrary, of course, but many magical traditions are all about the arbitrary stuff.

How about a similar but different spell that lets you shapeshift into Metahuman forms?

[augmentin]

Aren't humans included in metahumanity? I don't think this would work.

[The_Vanguard]

How about a similar but different spell that lets you shapeshift into Metahuman forms?

Aren't humans included in metahumanity? I don't think this would work.

The FAQ defines baseline humans to be "non-awakened critters" compared to all other meta types just as e.g. dogs are the mundane baseline to Hell Hounds, Barghests, Shadow Hounds and the like. This distinction seems pretty fuzzy to me, however, and offers the potential for weird arguments like if it would be possible to Shapeshift into a human with magical or resonance abilities.

[jimbo]

A "Human Form" spell cast by a human mage has ain interesting side effect : it is probably be the cheapest and easiest to sustain magical Attributes boost available - that +1 over base value to each Physical attribute for each net success on spellcasting can relatively easily rack up to interesting levels.

Emphasis above is mine

Couldn't an Ork magician shapechange into a Human?

Although my 2 cents worth is ixnay on "Human form" for shapechange.