The murder sumo., Body slam! Options

[Badmoodguy88]

I did not know how much damage ramming can do. I realized that slamming into someone wile under the effects of the critter movement power and immunity to normal weapons would mean dishing out a tun of damage and likely taking no damage. If this is combined with a ram plate (or possibly a big shield) then the ramming can be done at a lower speed for less damage against the person ramming.

A person ramming into a person in not strictly covered by rules. I guess you would call it normal unarmed combat, but even if trolls plowing through people does not count as a ramming, a small vehicle or drone should work just as well.

If a meta human would do it. Anything that adds to run speed ( Celerity, Satyr Legs, Raptor Cyberlegs, and Inline Skates each add one half movement. Skimmer Discs double movement. Celerity seems to stack with every thing. Skimmer Disks probably can't stack with Satyr Legs or Raptor Cyberlegs.) If you do the math super high body ends up being not that desirable at the start because of how it effects movement and the damage that needs to be resisted. Relying on Immunity to Normal Weapons means armor does not need to by higher than normal, if speed is 61–200 meters per turn and body is less than or equal to magic of the spirit with Immunity to Normal Weapons.

ramming damage table

[ Spoiler ]

VEHICLE speed (meters/turn) damage value
1–20 Body ÷ 2
21–60 Body
61–200 Body x 2
201+ Body x 3

Ramming

[ Spoiler ]

If a driver wants to ram something (or someone) with the vehicle, treat
it as a melee attack. The target must be within the vehicle’s Walking or
Running Range (a –3 dice modifier applies if the driver has to resort
to running). The driver rolls Vehicle skill + Reaction +/– Handling
to attack. The target rolls Dodge + Reaction if a pedestrian, or Vehicle
skill + Reaction +/– Handling if driving another vehicle.

If the driver gets more hits, he hits the target. Make the damage
resistance test as normal. The base Damage Value of the attack is determined
by the ramming vehicle’s Body and speed, as noted on the
Ramming Damage Table. The ramming vehicle must resist only half
that amount (round down). Characters resist ramming damage with
half their Impact armor (round up).
If the ram succeeds, each driver must make an additional Vehicle
Test to avoid crashing. The threshold for the ramming driver is 2; the
threshold for the rammed driver is 3.

Ram Plate (Standard, Groundcraft and Watercraft Only)

[ Spoiler ]

At those times when simply shooting someone doesn’t
give you satisfaction, it’s better to just ram them with the largest
vehicle you can fi nd. To make that ramming more eff ective,
equip your vehicle with a ram plate. Using a ram plate means
that damage done to the rammed vehicle is raised to the next
higher damage value on the ramming table (p. 160, SR4), while
the damage to the ramming vehicle remains the same.

Hardened Armor

[ Spoiler ]

Type: P • Action: Auto • Range: Self • Duration: Always
Hardened Armor is even tougher than normal armor. If the
modified Damage Value of an attack does not exceed the Armor
rating (modified by Armor Penetration), then it bounces harmlessly
off the critter; don’t even bother to make a Damage Resistance Test.
Otherwise, Hardened Armor provides both Ballistic and Impact armor
equal to its rating.

Immunity

[ Spoiler ]

Type: P • Action: Auto • Range: Self • Duration: Always
A critter with Immunity has an enhanced resistance to a certain
type of attack or affliction. The critter gains an “Armor rating” equal to
twice its Magic against that damage. This Immunity Armor is treated
as “hardened” protection (see Hardened Armor above), meaning that
if the Damage Value does not exceed the Armor, then the attack automatically
does no damage. Additionally, this “armor rating” is added
to the damage resistance test as normal armor.
Immunity to Normal Weapons: This immunity applies to all
weapons that are not magical (weapon foci, spells, adept or critter
powers). If the critter has the Allergy weakness, then the Immunity
does not apply against non-magical attacks made using the allergen.

Movement

[ Spoiler ]

Type: P • Action: Complex • Range: LOS • Duration: Sustained
The critter may increase or decrease the subject’s movement rate
within the terrain it controls. Multiply or divide the target’s movement
rate by the spirit or critter’s Magic.
This power has its limits. If the Body of the target exceeds the critter’s
Magic, reduce the Movement multiplier by half. If the Body of the
target exceeds Magic x 2 then Movement has no effect.

[Johnny B. Good]

Most GMs will rule that celerity does not stack with Skimmerdisks, as it's basically a personal hovercraft.

[Machiavelli]

Good points. I was always wondering why the modifiers for targets that are moving faster than the attacker didn´t come along to SR4. But stuff like that would give the movement power a little bit more bang for your bucks. It would be sufficent enough if it would help you leap longer, but jumping doesn´t seem to be linked to your speed.

[Simon Kerimov]

Have you played Prototype? One of my favorite ways of getting around town was to sprint through the streets with a shield out. If it was a car, it would need good windshield wipers. As to your question, you can treat it like falling damage, using your meter per Combat Turn as the distance fallen. I don't think there is a rule that covers it exactly, but that's the closest mechanic I know of.

[Stahlseele]

Most GMs will rule that celerity does not stack with Skimmerdisks, as it's basically a personal hovercraft.

Then celerity should not stack with retractable roller blades either, because it's more or less the same way to move in . .

[KarmaInferno]

Then celerity should not stack with retractable roller blades either, because it's more or less the same way to move in . .

Hm. I've always thought of skimmerdisks as "you stand there and the disks take you places".

Whereas you actually push off surfaces with rollerblades.




-karma

[Johnny B. Good]

Hm. I've always thought of skimmerdisks as "you stand there and the disks take you places".

Whereas you actually push off surfaces with rollerblades.

-karma

Sort of? You still have to control the vector and thrust of the skimmerdisks, but the power comes from the disks themselves. I can see how celerity would stack with rollerblades since you have to push off with them yourself, but you would look like a bloody ridiculous gangly rollerblading monkey man.

[Mooncrow]

Sort of? You still have to control the vector and thrust of the skimmerdisks, but the power comes from the disks themselves. I can see how celerity would stack with rollerblades since you have to push off with them yourself, but you would look like a bloody ridiculous gangly rollerblading monkey man.

Goes well with monkey paws and prehensile tail I suppose^^

Yay Surge =)

[hobgoblin]

iirc, skimmer disks adds to the base movement rate of the person "wearing" them, so imo they are basically rollerblades with near zero friction.

[Johnny B. Good]

iirc, skimmer disks adds to the base movement rate of the person "wearing" them, so imo they are basically rollerblades with near zero friction.

The problem is that the skimmerdisks would have to automatically generate thrust equal to the force of the pushing leg, if power actually "comes" from the person wearing them. This leads me to think, "Why can't somebody just crank up their skimmerdisks past normal (for their metatype) thrust?"

Skimmerdisks sure are wonky.

[Stahlseele]

Skimmerdiscs are basically like Marty McFly's Hoverboard.
Not like Biff Tannon's Killer-Board. Not self propelled.
But if you stand on them, other people can push you around.

[hobgoblin]

The problem is that the skimmerdisks would have to automatically generate thrust equal to the force of the pushing leg, if power actually "comes" from the person wearing them. This leads me to think, "Why can't somebody just crank up their skimmerdisks past normal (for their metatype) thrust?"

Skimmerdisks sure are wonky.

maybe i am missing some elementary physics in all this, but how so? The disks are turned to carry the weight of the person a certain distance above ground. If then the person tries to push down against that he is more likely to push himself forward then push the disk down, as that will be the direction of least resistance. The disk is pushing upwards with a force equal to the persons weight after all, and if one try to push that down the air will compress further to create more resistance. It would behave pretty much in the same manner as if one attempted to walk on a couple of springs that was able to carry the persons weight without compressing.

tho sure, i guess one could always crank the engine up there and go for something like what the helicopters do. But i suspect that much of the design of the disks makes use of ground effect:
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/w...ect_in_aircraft

once one move out of ground effect, the energy needed to stay aloft increases. This in turn decreases the endurance of the system. So for a compact system like the skimmer disks, i dont think relying on the disks engines for propulsion is a good bet if one plan on cover a useful distance.

[Stahlseele]

Best way to get around town:
One or two cyber-arms with grapple-hands and magnetic system,
two replacement feet with skimmer discs.
Do the McFly Flyboy!
And worry if someone pushes you above a lake or something like that ^^

[hobgoblin]

how about a magnetic grapple and some rollerblades with smartwheels (or skateboard with same)? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif)

[Badmoodguy88]

I figured skimmer disks stacked with Celerity and nothing else, because they are not something worn they are a replacement for your legs. But I don't really care if it stacks because celerity, satyr Legs, and inline Skates get you up to 2.5 your normal movement rate with no essence cost. But it is actually not really necessary because the movement power gets you going very fast with out any surge. But I do like the idea of someone who can out run most cars (with movement power). Also having a high walk rate could come in handy.

The target must be within the vehicle’s Walking or Running Range (a –3 dice modifier applies if the driver has to resort to running).

One use of a high walk speed here.

[Stahlseele]

how about a magnetic grapple and some rollerblades with smartwheels (or skateboard with same)? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif)

The german Arsenal actually does have the motorized Skateboard with Smart Wheels, called power board . .
COWABUNGA!

[Kraegor]

2 words:

Thrust Boosters.

Just strap these on your back, take off from 0 to 200 in 3 seconds and slam into something at 200 miles per hour wearing MilSpec armor.

One of you will be a pancake.

[Badmoodguy88]

Well that is how a street sam would do it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif)

The whole immunity to normal weapons, ignore damage if it is less than magic times two physical is what makes this more survivable. But the sam will still take half the damage the other guy does and be able to resist some of it and have the rest be stun, wile the other guy is likely in bits even if they are not quite dead.

[Neraph]

Now are you trying to get an actual person to follow the Ramming rules? The flow of this thread is confusing.

[Simon Kerimov]

BASE MOVEMENT
Movement Table SR4 p138
Troll Movement: 15/35 m/turn

• Satyr Legs: Rate*1.5 (round down)
• Celerity: Rate*1.5 (round down)

Modified Base Movement = 35+35*0.5+35*0.5 = 35+17+17 = 69 m/turn

RUNNING
Running Rules SR4 p117
[STR+Running(Sprinting)] Test : hits add 2 m/turn to Running Rate

STR

• Troll STR: 5/10(15)
• Base STR 9
• K-10: +6 STR

Net STR: 15

Running(Sprinting)
Base Skill Running(Sprinting): 7(9)

• Aptitude (Athletics)
• Improved (Athletics) Adept Power: +7 dpm
• Enhanced Articulation +1 dmp Physical
• Syntacardium: +3 dpm Athletics
• Reflex Recorders: +1 dpm Athletics
• Modified dice pool STR+Running(Sprinting) = 15+9+7+1+3+1 = 36
• Purchase hits at 4 dice/hit: 9 hits
  Net Running Rate: 87 m/turn
• Movement Power Force 3: 261 m/turn

TOTAL: 261 m/turn

RAMMING
Ramming Table SR4 p160
Maxes at 201 m/turn
DV: BOD*3

BOD
Troll BOD 5/10(15) --> 5/13(19)

• Metagenic Improvement (BOD)
• Exceptional Attribute (BOD)
• Genetic Optimization (BOD)
• Customized Cybertorso Body Enhancement +3 BOD (16)
• K-10: +3 BOD (19)

Net BOD = 19

Ramming DV: BOD*3 [caps at 201 m/turn] = 57P
TOTAL DV: 57P

Ow.

[Makki]

be careful with high BOD.

This power has its limits. If the Body of the target exceeds the critter’s
Magic, reduce the Movement multiplier by half. If the Body of the
target exceeds Magic x 2 then Movement has no effect.

well, you'll need a force 10 spirit, then you'll enjoy a multiplier of 5

[Simon Kerimov]

be careful with high BOD.

Good point. Bump the Force of the spirit up to 19, and the modified movement rate up to 1653 m/turn.

[Makki]

Good point. Bump the Force of the spirit up to 19, and the modified movement rate up to 1653 m/turn.

which is nice, because they wont hear you coming, you're faster than sound. no need for traceless walk any more ^^

[Badmoodguy88]

So the question is who would actualy allow this in a game? Like i said this could be done with a drone easy. So is it fair game for a metahuman to do it too?

One could argue that vehicle body and metahuman body are not totally same for some reason, or that metahumans are usualy softer so dish out less damage, but a troll in combat armor is a very solid projectile object.

[Simon Kerimov]

Maybe the troll is charging in for a subduing attack?