Considering the Inn, Am I wrong for wnating to use the old GM's standby? Options

[LurkerOutThere]

So lately i've been working on a steampunk setting and the kitbashed rules to make it run. I've been looking at the list of pre-gens i've got written up and at least basic notations on their possible background and how it migh shape their worldview. Looking at the list of characters I've got I've decided that the only place I could account for all of them potentially being during the kick off events is common house/inn.

Currently the premise is this: The characters are at the inn either because their staying there or because they have stopped in for a drink or to conduct business or the like. While there a mysterious figure stumbles in requesting with their dying breath that the character protect the package he leaves with them. At that point pursuers enter and attempt to kill all the PC's for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. During the course of the fight it is my intent the package will come open revealing it is a sword. Investigation of the sword afterwards will reveal it is lost sword of the imperial dynasty. A powerful relic that most of the factions in the city would gladly kill to posses.

Is this too cliche? Keeping in mind that not all tropes are bad is it too troperific?

[KarmaInferno]

Sure, why not?

For bonus points make the innkeeper a retired adventurer.




-karma

[Critias]

There's nothing wrong with it, or it wouldn't be a trope in the first place, is my thinking. If -- looking at the list of characters you've got -- that's the best way to make it happen, then that's the best way to make it happen.

You might want to tie a few of the characters together if you can, though, with previous dealings with each other. The dying courier could be related to one of them, or could have worked for them in the past. Some sort of motivation is better than none at all, but if your players are cool with the classic inn/stranger routine, there's no urgent need to fix what ain't broke.

[Mercer]

Some say "trope", some say "cliche", some say "time honored storytelling tool".

Tropes, stereotypes and cliches aren't automatically bad things. Sure, if that's all the game is it's going to seem like day old bread, but one thing they do is get across a lot of information very quickly. There's a lot of times this is useful, and nowhere is that more true than at the beginning of the game. I don't know any player that won't take a cliched beginning that gets the game going quickly over one that takes up a lot of time.

[Yerameyahu]

The group has to be pulled together, which is almost always a complete contrivance. So, embrace it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[DocTaotsu]

There is no shame in using the well worn inn to kick off an adventure, especially since you're not following it up with "A powerfully built dwarf walks up to you with a job and a giant axe. The glint in his eye seems to indicate he knows how to use it"

I'm assuming your comfortable with your group? I presume everyone wants to play as a team and that nobody is going to pass you a note read: "I backstab the party and sell the sword for l00t"

[Karoline]

Remember that you can always make use of that 'everyone is connected to (famous person X) by no more than 7 steps'. That of course means that any two people should be connected by no more than 7 steps, and tons of people are going to be connected by 2 or 3, especially in a setting in which an inn/tavern exists. I don't know anything about your list of characters, but I'd imagine you could figure out ways to have each of them know each other at worse through 'a friend of a friend'. And if that is the case, maybe one person just decided to gather everyone up to discuss forming an adventuring group (for treasure, fame, women (men), general goodiness, whatever). Then the 'oh, please take my McGuffin' can happen, or maybe it can simply be their first mission, without proper idea of just how valuable it is, with the person hiring them knowing he is being hunted and hoping to throw the assailants off by unloading it on some seemingly random group.

[LurkerOutThere]

Part of it is I really see this as a bit more a gritty world, people don't normally just form adventuring groups to do stuff. It may happen with specific goals in mind but it far from the cottage industry that some settings seem to entail.

I have a set of loose reasons for why the players might be there depending on what they choose to play and a brief write up on the things that are set about their backstory, other then that I'm going to leave it open to them with some suggestions.

The Rifleman - There to speak to the bar keep who is also a former Rifleman and is good at finding work that's more then just a thug for hire.
The Healer - Might be there having a cup of tea and collecting alms for the poor
The Necromancer - Is there because this particular inn falls in the very narrow area of the city where magic and technology are in balance allowing them to both practice without fear but also meet the more mundane folk. They might be there trying to barter for post mortis contracts.
The Undead Slayer/Mortician - Might be there waiting to ply his trade or meeting with the necromancer as the two share the same nationality and religion.
The barbarian - Is there looking for work as a sell sword now that their legion contract is up.
The Mad Doctor - Is there conducting clandestine business.
The Mage - Is there collecting their nerves after a trip into the more technical part of the city. A fruitless search for work in a city increasingly turning away from magic.

Our group has been playing together in one configuration for years now, while some level of backstabbing happens it's more in good fun then anything. I tend to encourage political backstabbing over actual backstabbing.

[Karoline]

Well, I don't know much about the background, but from basic descriptions like that, I don't see any reason you couldn't tweak things ever so slightly and have most if not all of them know each other loosely.

The healer can have worked on both the rifleman and barbarian before. All three could have even been in some battle/legion/similar together.

The Mad Doctor and Healer could be former colleges.

The Necromancer and Mortician you already have covered as perhaps having worked deals together before.

The Necromancer and Mage could be part of the same 'mage club' of sorts, magical types banding together to share knowledge and for protection.

The Mortition could know the Doctor and Healer, as healing and death are often close together.

So bam, everyone knows each other, or knows someone who knows one of the others. This at least allows for the group to not be total strangers. Not saying they were all meeting for any given reason, but it is nice to have some sort of connections.

[Blade]

Something to keep in mind for fantasy setting (and that can apply to steampunk settings as well) is that the inn is the first place you'll want to go upon arriving in a new town. No matter who you are, the first thing you'll want after a day spent walking on a dirt road with a backpack full of items and probably some armor (or robes) is a meal or at least a drink.

So it makes sense for travellers to stop and meet here. It also makes sense for people looking for travellers/adventurers to go there.

[Karoline]

And even if you have a horse or ride in a carriage, inns tend to have stabling for the horse, and a nice hot meal for the rider.

Heck, I'm sure plenty of people that owned a house in a particular city would still stop at the inn for the hot meal that they didn't have to cook and having their horse taken care of and generally not having to worry about anything for an extra day. Remember, traveling back then was way more of an issue than it is now.

[Voran]

Nothing wrong with the old standby. If it works for you and your players and its something you can flow naturally with, go for it. Lets review some of the perils of some of the other tropes:

You're all prisoners, released by the king to do a job: Even if you hand them all the gear they came up with in chargen, some players really resent the idea that some lowly npcs managed to nab them and put them in prison, they'll spend more time bitching about the prison setup and how unrealistic/unfair/railroading it is, even though functionally they've lost nothing.

You're all random people at an event, a fair, a ship ride, caravan, whatever when <something> happens. The peril here is by leaving it to the PCs to do the intended thing of hook up as a group, there's still a chance you'll end up fragmented, especially if they throw in a bit of roleplaying that ends up rubbing each other the wrong way

You're all free agents, contracted by the <powers that be> to do <something>. Safe. But its pretty much the SR "Fixer hires a bunch of strangers".

A variant of the above is the multi-mini, where some in the group naturally draw to each other, then you tie the story threads together. Problem is, kinda like the random people setup, is that sometimes you end up with the various minigroups meeting each other and wanting to kill each other.

[Yerameyahu]

Hehe, always a problem. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Honestly, if the characters weren't built to be a group (background-wise), then what choice do you have? They *have* to be a group, or there's no game.

[Tanegar]

You're all prisoners, released by the king to do a job: Even if you hand them all the gear they came up with in chargen, some players really resent the idea that some lowly npcs managed to nab them and put them in prison, they'll spend more time bitching about the prison setup and how unrealistic/unfair/railroading it is, even though functionally they've lost nothing.

Things like this always irk me. Are the PCs the only badasses in the world? Unlikely. Why does it strain belief that there are people capable of imprisoning them?

[Doc Chase]

*eyebrow*

Hands up, who here doesn't regularly have their SR team meet the Johnson in a lounge, bar, or nightclub?

We've been in the tavern/inn since the old days, it hasn't exactly changed. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

Indeed. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) The Mr. Johnson *gives* you the run; it's as contrived as D&D ever was, except SR makes it make sense. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Which is why I like SR.

[StealthSigma]

*eyebrow*

Hands up, who here doesn't regularly have their SR team meet the Johnson in a lounge, bar, or nightclub?

We've been in the tavern/inn since the old days, it hasn't exactly changed. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Back of a limo.
Sparse apartment two stories above the face's apartment.

[Yerameyahu]

Those count. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Especially the limo.

[CollateralDynamo]

I'm going to echo what most people here have said already. Using the trope is not necessarily a bad thing as long as you don't ride the tropes all the way to the end. As long as you intend to eventually throw a few curve balls around, go for the "you met at a bar" thing. But also keep in mind, you are creating their characters for them in this set-up. This gives you the unique ability to choose the personality and the friends that the character possesses. I'm not sure if your table is heavy on the RP, but assuming they are, this is a perfect time to mix up the party.

Have as many know each other up front as possible, with a little synopsis on everyone's sheet describing what they know of each other. Have some already dislike each other, but force them to work together for whatever reason or another. Make certain people family members, and make the guy who is a friend of a friend not necessarily your friend, etc.

Since you are developing the characters for your PCs, make sure that the characters are at least vaguely deep, this way the roleplayer has something to hang his hat on and also has in game excuses to meet and talk with one another. Otherwise you might risk a crash and burn. If the man shows up with the McGuffin and gives it to the "overly honorable" type, he might decide to try to defend it on his own, since he may well have to defend it from the very scoundrels that you want to be in the party. Even worse, it can go the other way, with a scoundrel trying to sneak off with it, unless he too is given a motive to ensure that things work out for at least a few other members of the party.

Just my 2 cp, does it earn me an ale? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Stahlseele]

So, a human, an elf, an ork, a troll and a dwarf walk into a bar . .

[Karoline]

So, a human, an elf, an ork, a troll and a dwarf walk into a bar . .

and the troll trips over the dwarf, and through his flailing takes down the elf.

[Tiralee]

The inn is a great place - new gamers don't know what's going to happen and the old gamers expect you to mix it the hell up to not fall into a cliche.

Frankly, a fireball lobbed into the middle of the bar followed by some mooks jumping in through the windows (tightly shuttered against the night & winter rain) to "take care of the survivors" is great. Just make it that they managed to be in the places where they're somewhat protected by the blast and are suitably pissed off and going to return the favour.
If they're being difficult about it...ie: the "Darkslyr the Assassin woudn't trust these guys to empty a boot!" effect, it's simple...

Choo-choo! A nice one is an injured officer of the law, "You, you and you, get this package to my superiors while I rest and organise a retaliation. Oh, not wanting to go? Ok then, as an Officer of the law, I use my <Geas-laying official shiney, use 1/week> to command you to do so. Have fun and (Passes over a Kitten.) take this, it's dangerous out there."


Another classic kicker was waking up while falling from a great height in the middle of a thunderstorm and driving rain, naked. ("You're almost flogged to death by....") As Bastard GM ™ I'd also removed their character sheets and made up new ones (with the same stats) but with different classes. Worked amazingly well.

No one trusted anyone, but it was cold, they had NOTHING and had to work together to understand and survive.
Although the "I'll create food an make clothing out of that." idea had repurcussions.

Naked in a dungeon is also great. (Not that sort of role-play, perverts), Lost at sea, Caravan survivors, raw recruits under command of an old hand who dies of a heart-attack while you're jumped at night by goblins and "survivors of a village that was attacked for no apparent purpose" are really fun as well. (The village one was brilliant, the 3 players were all gnomish wizards. Not a single thief, fighter or cleric. Made for some scary, "by the seat of your pants" playing, and everyone squabbling over who got the spellbook-making supplied when they reached civilization.)

-Tir

[StealthSigma]

My favorite suggestion that I've heard for starting in bar is to switch it up by having everyone in the restroom when the "action" starts.

[Voran]

"Okay, but if there are any girls there, I wanna DO them!"

[Dumori]

I'm assuming your comfortable with your group? I presume everyone wants to play as a team and that nobody is going to pass you a note read: "I backstab the party and sell the sword for l00t"

No the only time I've done that was a note signed by a big chunk of the party. And the sword a holy avenger and it's owner a down right annoying paladin. Where playing a game that involved us all being thrown together randomly with no easy way out. We where mostly neutral/chaotic and this paladin was of the if its evil kill it mentality. I mean we had two rouges one a tifling.

Things like this always irk me. Are the PCs the only badasses in the world? Unlikely. Why does it strain belief that there are people capable of imprisoning them?

Aye but some times it is the case that at least one of the PCs could have force there way out. My old changeling monk for example in that situation has advantages. It also depends on how high magic and weird races are in the setting. If there high than a PC playing a mage or some more "intresting" race can be imprisoned logically in a setting where magic is rare and/or so are exotic races/classes then one PCs might not start as one other wise the prison trope dose have holes. That's a GM issue tbh if you PCs can logical easy escape then the method of starting then story won't work.